Most accurate currently available Bowie knife

B

Big Ugly Tall Texan

Joined
Jan 27, 2006
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107
I'm new to the forum and am interested in finding a fairly accurate Bowie knife.From what I have been able to dig up, this one

primitivebowie.jpg


from Atlanta Cutlery, is the most accurate version currently available without giving up an arm and a leg. Do any of you know of a currently available Bowie selling for less than two Ben Franklins that is a more accurate copy of what historians think Jim Bowie carried around.
 
I've never heard of Atlanta Cutlery before, and from the looks of their site they appear to be a replica company. If you are looking for a display piece, their knives would be a good cheap option. If you are looking for a user, I'd say go elsewhere.

If you really want a high end bowie, I'd say go custom. You might pay more than 200 beans; but you'll have a piece to be proud of. Check out the Makers Forum and the Customer forum here for some ideas. Here are a few recent threads showing custom bowies:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=385486
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=384659
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=376565

[editted to add]Caught this snippet on the Atlanta Cutlery site:

A sword that is too soft or untempered will not break, but will simply bend and stay bent and if it sharpened it will not hold an edge. Understanding that Rockwell hardness is for tools, not swords and daggers, our blades will range from about 45 to 49 on a Rockwell scale.
Click to expand...
Definite display pieces.
 
I have a couple of Case folders that do fine for using knives. I'm hunting for a looker, and also a knife to use in case I finally managed to get started with Cowboy shooting competition. When it comes to using knives, I am definitely from the less is more school of thought.

Those big Bowies were designed for knife fighting and I don't use a knife in a fight if I can avoid it. I've been in one semi-knife fight in my life and that was more than 30 years ago. Two guys pulled knives and I pulled a 1911 in Condition One. End of conversation.
 
Even if you have no intention of fighting with the knife, the replica pieces are so soft that you'll bend/fold the edge with very little use. As the steel they are made out of is not advertised, they likely are made out of 420/420J and won't hold a very good edge. According to their FAQ, those knives are mostly designed for display or stage props.

BTW, welcome to the forum! Stick around for a while! There is a wealth of information here to help you make the decision you like! :cool:

For a good reference on blade steels, check out Joe Talmadge's Steel FAQ
 
I think the original Bowie Knife went home to Mexico in the hands of one of Santa Annas officers. I know it was "said" it was destroyed in a fire but, anyone know of a fire to completly destroy a steel blade or rifle? The Searles Bowie is authentic & was used by Bowie in the famous sandbar fight. Bowie then went on to improve it with a clip & a guard of somekind. Hope this helps!
 
What I know, or THINK I know, about the Bowie design follows:

It was BIG. it was described as a small sword.

It had the clipped, or false edge point and that edge was sharpened,allowing cuts in either direction.

It had a grip that allowed the knife to be used with the leading edge either up or down. I understand Bowie's preferred fighting method was with the main edge up. Therefore the grip has to be symmetrical.

It had a soft bronze handguard designed to catch the blades of oppossing knives, allowing Bowie to disarm his foe.

It was designd by Jim Bowie or his brothe Resin and was mde by James Black, a knifesmith in Washington, Arkansas.

I plan to use ir for display and to carry on a belt sheath for show when, or maybe I should say IF I start taking part cowboy shooting competition. As I understnd the rules, the knife is for show only.

Atlantq Cutlery http://www.atlantacutlery.com/WebStore/SearchResults.aspx?SearchCriteria=bowie makes a whole line of replica knives and swords that are supposed to be pretty historically accurate. The one I posted is called the "primitive Bowie" appears to be the one used in the Disney movie, The Alamo. It is a slightly smaller version of a knife termed the "brass back Bowie" owned by a collector named Musso. I read a book about Jim Bowie and his knife when I was in junior high. The book described the knife fairly closely, and of all the Bowies I have seen, that primitive Bowie most closely matches my mental image of Jim Bowies knife.

I also like the looks of what they term, the Texas Bowie.
 
That Atlanta Cutlery piece is a reproduction of the Joseph Musso Bowie and is made by Windlass Steel in India. It is not too bad as a knife, but it comes with a rebated edge fr re-enactment purposes (read dull as all Hell!). They will sharpen it for an additional fee. I would recommend it, as you would have to remove enormous amounts of steel to do it yourself.

The hilt is not very well done, just a hunk of wood stuck on the tang. And the sheath is this cheap-a** junk that looks like it came with a $5.00 special at Wal-Mart.

The bottom line is that you are getting what you pay for, actually less than you pay for when you consider what most places are getting fot the Hanwei Bowie reproductions such as that superb Bell Bowie. Knife Outlet has the Hanwei Bowies, but not the Bell, in stock. They sell them for $134.50.
 
The Historic Arkansas Museum has Bowie #1 on display:

ham_gal_knife08.jpg

​

It's been determined to be an original Jim Black, but has been undetermined to be "the" original bowie and since Jim Black didn't mark his blades, the Bowie #1 appears to have been added afterwards. Since the original design went to the grave with Jim Black, conceptions of what the "original" bowie was will always be an interpretation.

Wikipedia.org has a pretty concise read.
 
AG Russell used to sell a Bowie knife that was a recreation of a museum piece. I don't see it at his website now though... And it may have been over $200 anyway.

Good luck in your quest,
Bob
 
From what I have read on the subject, there is a major difference between the original Sandbar knife (more of a crude butcher knife design) and the knife Old Jim carried at the time of his death (Clip point, brass guards, longer blade). This years "Gun Digest" has a good article. I like the Case/Western Bowie, not a custom knife by a long shot, but high carbon steel. I sanded down the rosewood scales to fit my hand, and cut off the brass fighting guards where they bend. I then modified the sheath so it tuckes into my waistband, up high on my right hip. If you like Bowies, I urge you to get Bill Bagwells Bowie knife book. Great info and all his wonderfull articles from the 1980's Soldier of Fortune Mag. The Case Western 49 is Not a custom job, but a big, sharp, high quality knife for survival/show/defense.
 
Deadhead Archer said:
As the steel they are made out of is not advertised, they likely are made out of 420/420J and won't hold a very good edge.
Click to expand...

There are enough reasons not to buy Atlanta Cutlery knives without making more up. :D

I've never encountered one of their Windlass made pieces that was 420. They are spring steel (5160-ish), usually through hardened to around RC 55 or so. Quality control varies enormously, but customer service - at least on pieces bought directly from them - is very good, in the sense that they'll cheerfully accept returns and either refund you or keep sending replacements until you get one that's up to snuff.

They tend to come with horrible or non-existent edges. The handles tend to be mediocre, as is fit and finish.

But if you want a tough, slab of steel chopper, they are far from horrible. Don't buy one if you want sharp out of the box, or a good slicer, or excellent quality control. If what you want is a traditional pattern, in traditional handle material (rather than synthetic), that is tough to break and easy to resharpen (rather than with good edge holding), then look at Atlanta Cutlery.

Yes, they mostly sell to the wall hanger, reenactment, and stage fight crowd. But my experience is that they are decent village grade traditional using knives. If that's what you want, and the fit, finish, edge and price are acceptable to you, there's no reason not to buy Atlanta Cutlery. They are not China Cheapies or knockoffs or crap. They just aren't aimed at perfectionist knife snobs like many of us.

I tend to think of them as fixer-upper project knives rather than open the box and be instantly happy pieces. Maybe I just like to tinker. :p
 
Texan, as you may have figured, I have one of the Atlanta Cutlery Bowies and my opinion is based upon that. I also have an old Case Bowie that I bought in the 1970s. My version was tricked out with a brass strip on the back and a black leather scabbard with a brass frame. The first problem with it is that it has a picxture of a dude in a coonskin cap engraved on the blade. The second problem is that it is unwieldy as Hell. I have the Imperial Weapons version of the Musso Bowie and of the "Iron Mistress" Bowie from the film. Both of these handle much better than the Case Bowie.

888 Knives R US says that it has the Bell Bowie for $136.95 and that, sir, is a good price for an excellent reproduction of an historic Bowie variant.
CAS IBERIA PAUL CHEN 2210 BELL BOWIE

This is a replication of a Bowie knife made by Samuel Bell. Bell was a cutler and silversmith first in Knoxville, Tennessee, then in San Antonio, Texas. He was mayor of Knoxville, and later made some silver spurs for Sam Houston. It’s a real rib-tickler, long and lean like Tennessee, and big enough for a Texan!

MEASUREMENTS:
• Blade Length: 12”
• Handle Length: 5”
• Overall Length: 16.5”
• Weight: 16oz
Click to expand...
http://www.888knivesrus.com/product/CAS2210GT

I also have one of these and it is a magnificent piece of work.
 
You are searching for something that does not really exist. Nobody knows what Jim Bowie's knife was really like. It's all speculation and marketing hype. Many historians say there wasn't one knife but several that changed over time. There isn't any knife left that was owned by Bowie, much less one that would be the Bowie design. The real fact is that there are no plans, drawings, pictures, paintings, or even accurate descriptions. As noted, the Searles bowie is supposed to be close, but it's been documented that it's still not the real thing.

Soooo, if you really want an accurate repro, save your money. If you want a fantasy blade, invent a good story and buy one that matches it.
 
Brownshoe has the right answer, I'm afraid. The Bowie knife is as much legend as anything else. Buy whatever clicks your mouse. It is more important that you like it than that it "reproduces" a legend.
 
I have to admit I've looked at those Atlanta Cutlery knives more than once, that's cause I'm a cheap Bastid. I couldn't actually buy one because I could never show it to anyone that knew what a real knife was.

I was looking to get into CASS myself and thought this J. RUSSEL GREEN RIVER WORKS CLIP POINT BOWIE fit the bill for me. It's a real knife at a great price.

http://www.888knivesrus.com/product/RU1000

Oh...I bought their spearpoint also. ;)

74323671.jpg


PS. you could spend about half the price of the knife just for the stag scales.
 
From descriptions, the original bowie that was used at the sandbar fight may well have been a 9" butcher knife. The Searles knife came later. It is documented that Resin and James Bowie had knives made by quite a few blacksmiths and cutlers.

As far as authentic bowies go, there were as many styles as there were people and companies making the knives.
 
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