Mystery solved .... not a happy ending

rddp

rddp

Joined
May 24, 2013
Messages
271
I bought this " Winchester " on Ebay several years ago and always felt there was something fishy about it. The blades were too full and too shiny for the age of the knife but the tang stamps looked real .... Then I read a post here that described the scam of welding new blades on old tang stamps, then carefully feathering the weld to be seamless ( or nearly so ). Take peak at these pics to see an example of what this scam looks like. I've been suckered by other unscrupulous sellers and probably will be again... C'est la vie. I hope this helps others to be more vigilant. Ebay is chock full of scammers.IMG_5385.jpegIMG_5386.jpeg
 
Those blades aren't nearly "full"...and they are shiny because somebody cleaned the hell out of them.....and reshaped them so they look right and have a choil at the base of the blade. Winchester did make a wood swell end that looked like that but it had a spear and a pen blade.....
 
Arathol said:
Those blades aren't nearly "full"...and they are shiny because somebody cleaned the hell out of them.....and reshaped them so they look right and have a choil at the base of the blade. Winchester did make a wood swell end that looked like that but it had a spear and a pen blade.....
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I can’t argue with your observations. Not only are they too shiny, but they’re ugly.
Do you agree with my opinion that the blades are welded onto the tangs?
 
rddp said:
I can’t argue with your observations. Not only are they too shiny, but they’re ugly.
Do you agree with my opinion that the blades are welded onto the tangs?
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I doubt it. Why weld on half used up blades? I think what you are seeing is the transition from the surface that hasn't been cleaned to the part that as been aggressively cleaned.
RmzKkhE.jpg

The number 2604 is correct for a 3 1/2" swell end barehead jack with cocobolo handles, clip and pen blades.
 
I am ignorant about many things.... trying to learn how to not be scammed on the internet with old knives is a daunting task!

It would seem to me that actually welding new blades onto old tangs would not only be very time consuming, but also possibly mess up the pivot area, possibly the covers due to the heat. After a weld, there would be plenty of clean up. Also, getting them straight enough to sit in the blade wells correctly could be a daunting task. These blades look like someone slapped them on a belt and polished them.

I'm guessing a scammer would put in as minimal amount of time as possible.

If I'm wrong, please correct me!!

Reminds me of the folks on YouTube who 're-finish' (ruin) old knives.
 
Agreeing with aggressively cleaned and reshaped. The blades were badly corroded at one time, and deeply resurfaced. When guys weld up knives they use excellent to minty blades cut from new knives or old lesser donors, otherwise it doesn't make financial sense for the faker.
 
Arathol said:
Its not about making money usually. Its about proving that they can fool you.....
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I’ll say that the aggressive cleaning has done more damage than the welding. An honestly worn or damaged antique is far better than a shiny remanufactured one.

N2s
 
From looking at it, Id say it has just been cleaned really hard.. Ive never heard of anyone welding blades on, but it is possible I suppose.
 
In my opinion your knife is OK, just been overly and aggressively cleaned. Welding on new blades to the original tangs is common and in most cases done to restore a vintage knife that the blades are broken or heavily worn.
 
In the end the knife is still a knife, drop it in your pocket and enjoy carrying/using it - something that would be hard to do with an actual pristine and valuable antique. OH
Ps. I’d take a file and make a coping blade out of that reshaped pen, then it would be a useful addition to the Clip.
 
Winchesters have been know to be one of the more counterfeited brands out there. That being said, I don't think that particular one is counterfeit or has welded blades, it just looks to have been cleaned ALOT.

I am aware of a mechanic that welds a lot of blades. He really does impressive work. The only thing that bothers me is that he doesn't mark the knives he has worked on. Those knives could eventually make their way back onto the market, and the new buyer would not be aware. To me, that is deception, and takes away from the impressive repair work that was done.

As Bruce mentioned regarding the OP knife, just pop it in you pocket and enjoy it for what it is!
 
Old Hunter said:
In the end the knife is still a knife, drop it in your pocket and enjoy carrying/using it - something that would be hard to do with an actual pristine and valuable antique. OH
Ps. I’d take a file and make a coping blade out of that reshaped pen, then it would be a useful addition to the Clip.
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Amen I like your opinion!
 
Arathol said:
I doubt it. Why weld on half used up blades? I think what you are seeing is the transition from the surface that hasn't been cleaned to the part that as been aggressively cleaned.
RmzKkhE.jpg

The number 2604 is correct for a 3 1/2" swell end barehead jack with cocobolo handles, clip and pen blades.
Click to expand...
Thanks for your attention to this. Maybe this is just the case of someone who did their very best to ruin this knife by grinding and polishing. I still like the Coco handle and it has good snap so it will be in rotation in my pocket.
 
i mean they weld rolex cases to repair and restore. its a divisive topic im sure. guess theres an application for everything. even in the omegaforums, one of the topics is learning how to fish
 
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