Naniwa Superstone 400 problem

[samuraistuart]

First, a test to see if I can even post.

OK so that worked.

Let's try this again and MODS....move to MTE, please if this works.

Having a problem with Naniwa Superstone 400. Using clamp on guides for a pretty edge...no angle changes at all.

First, to establish bevel I use DMT XC, not apexing. Almost apex not quite. Move to C DMT and apexing, creating minimal burr both sides, then finishing off the edge as if this were my final stone. Will easily shave hair and bite into nail.

Wanting to refine diamond scratches I move to Naniwa Supertone 400. This stone makes my edge duller. Apex is no longer crisp. Will not shave at all, barely bites into nail.

Frustrated, I use the DMT Fine, and this brings the edge back. Easily shaves and bites into nail. I progress from there, Shapton 1000 Pro works in the diamond line up quit well. What a stone that is! (See I misspelled "quite", but I left that in there just for Rick! ... and my eclipses too ... )

So no matter the steel, and using an angle jig, the Naniwa Superstone 400 basically kills my edge, but any diamond or waterstone after wards works fine.

This happens every time, no matter the angle or steel.

I've heard those stones are softer, maybe it's rounding off apex? Doesn't feel like that tho when I am using it. I've never had issue using water stones in a diamond line up before, until this stone. Even using the Naniwa in an exclusive water stone line up, it seems to do the same. Yes, freshly lapped, and very flat. No mud either, just splash and go. Metal shavings suspended in water on top of stone. The Shapton Pro 1000 in a diamond line up works very well.

Any thoughts as to what might be going on with this stone?

Side note....last night decided to thin down a Kershaw Leek 13C26 (AEBL). Sigma Power Select II 120!!! Wow! (Keep under running water...it loads instantly) to thin, almost apex. Shapton Pro 1000 at about 14° per side to establish bevel on an edge that barely reflected light. Then Spyderco Fine Ceramic, then 0.3 micron film. WOW!!! Sharpest I've ever made a knife! EASILY would split my arm hair lengthwise, while still on my arm. The sharpest I've ever made a knife!

OK, so I was able to post here by editing one line at a time. I tried that in MTE and got about 3 or 4 lines and would get timed out.

 

[tinfoil hat timmy]

I see.

 

[tim37a]

Sounds good - what's the problem?

Tim

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

I moved it for you.

 

[dufus53]

Are you flattening the stones?

 

[Camber]

This is a common problem with softer stones like the Naniwa 400, King 1k, King 6k, etc. Because they work by three body abrasion (abrasive moving between the stone and knife), it will impact the apex and round it off to some degree. I don't understand why, but this happens often even when there is no apparent mud buildup.

I guess my main question would be is the scratch pattern being refined on the edge bevel? if so you are at least accomplishing that. Also, if you let it build up some mud and work that a bit it will definitely increase the edge polish and also because of the effect described above remove the burr, so that you can effectively microbevel with a much higher grit.

Alternatively you could try edge trailing strokes which minimizes the effects of the three body abrasion.

 

[samuraistuart]

Guys thanks for your replies. Because I was having problems posting this thread here, and started another one in Shop Talk that Stacy kindly moved for me, allow me to close this thread and further replies to be made on the other one of the same subject heading.

Thank you all, again!