Navigator G-10 problems......

T

TNRonin

Joined
Jul 29, 2001
Messages
42
I bought a Navigator g-10 and I have been using this thing for a money clip. I noticed some play on the clip today and discovered that the screws holding the clip in place had stripped out. I took it for granted that there would be some sort of inserts in place to screw into.

  • Is anyone else having this problem?
  • If so what is the recommended fix?

Thanks for looking.

Mitch
 
I'm thinking that also, but I don't want to keep sending it back if this is a repeating even. I'm thinking either helacores (sp) or brass inserts or something.
 
I thought that it had threads into metal inserts but if not just a little dab of super glue gel or liquid will probably fix it right up. Even loctite would work. G10 is basically epoxy itself so any glue will work on it pretty well.

But before you do anything the first place I'd look would be on the screw. It may be that the screw is what is stripped and if that is the case they can probably just send you a replacement in the mail without the need for you to send the knife back. It is one of the ones made in the Golden Colorado plant.
 
Welp, it ain't the screws, I just checked them, the hole is definately wallered out.

I'm not keen to put crazy glue in the holes, this is a fill issue, not a sticky issue. Also this is the pivot area, crazy glue would be bad in there.
 
As with many of the early G10 Spydercos, the G10 Navigator has no steel liner. This means the screws are threaded directly into the G10, and G10 does not stand up well to that. That's why sometime in the late 90's a single steel liner was added to some, and others (like the Navigator) were dropped from the lineup. Not much really that can be done to "fix" it, helicoils "might" work if (and thats a way big if) you could find some with the correct internal thread. As a "user", the aluminum handled Navigator is a much better choice.
 
Several years ago, some of the holes for the clip screws on my G10 Navigator got stripped. I was never able to fix the problem. IIRC, I tried putting loc-tite and super glue or epoxy on the threads, but the clip would always loosen up over time. Like The Deacon said, the clip screws simply have to go into a steel liner, pin, or some other type of metal insert to work properly.
 
Here is what I think I'm going to go with,
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much is dependant on the thickness of the G-10. But they can go down to .160 in length if I need it. Do you guys think I should glue it in?

I just need to find the size screw I have.

Deacon, ya if I had known about this I wouldn't have bought the knife. I'm not happy, and quite frankly I'm surprised Spyderco did something like this.
 
If it were me, I would sent it back and see or at least call them and see what they say. One design change that they might have been able to make was to mill out a disk say 1/2" in diameter by a 1/16" thick on the back side of the liner and tap into it.
 
I do not have one of these model Spydercos so I was not aware of where the clip mounted. Since it is the pivot area you should send it back to Spyderco. They can replace the scale or retap it to a bigger size. Of course you could do that yourself if you already have the stuff to do it but it wouldn't make much sense to buy the tap, and some 2-56 screws when it would be cheaper to mail it back.

In my own mods that I've done to numerous knives I have had very good luck threading G10, Micarta and even FRN/Zytel. I've found if you do it a particular way that these materials thread quite well and are also quite strong, but there is no substitute for a nice backing plate of titanium of stainless steel. If the handle scale comes off that would be the way to fix it. Just inlay a plate of .040 titanium in the back side of the handle and drill it out and tap it for two or three (depending on the clip) holes and thread them for the screw and you won't have any trouble with it again.

Also, I don't know how much you want to tackle but if you just need a small piece of titanium to use and want to do this yourself I could send you an end cut off from my scrap pile.
 
So this is a design flaw. One recognized by not only spyderco but other major manufacturers. Should spyderco fix it for free? In my similar experience with the Jot they fixed mine for free but later a forumite said they refused to fix his. The silence from Spyderco on this design flaw is deafening. Where is factory rep to show us the "fair and honest" way?
 
I would not call it a design flaw. Cold steel sells their Voyagers and Vaqueros and more with threaded zytel and they hold up. It is generally thought that G10 is stronger than FRN/zytel so there is no reason to give threading it a second thought.

I have some knives made of both materials with no metal threads that have seen heavy use and they have held up well. BTW, I've had metal threads strip for clips and for handle scales too so percentage wise I don't think the odds are against G10 being threaded for clip installations this way anymore than metal lined clip mounts. On occassion both can give out. It may be that the threads were never really fully finished off from the original threading.

Sometimes in my own threading jobs for knives I've made I've neglected to screw the tapper in far enough. You have to screw it in until the threader is far enough in to be at the thickest part or the meat of the tapper and if you don't the threads can be shallow and thus they can easily strip. This can also happen if the threader you are using is a well used one that should be retired for a new one. But it also can occur if you use say a taper when you should use a bottom out threader. The taper is great for starting holes but the tip will hit what is on the exit side and prevent the threads from going any deeper whereas a bottom type will take the threads all the way to the bottom. It could just be a simple matter of using the wrong tap. Human error in other words.
 
I believe that Sal has stated in the past that the reason larger G-10 and Micarta knives get a liner is for strength. Supposedly there were not that many failures on the smaller knives. I carried my G-10 Navigator and micarta Calypso Jr for probably a year total without failure.
 
Sal has stated the single liners in G10 and Micarta is not for strength but for the screws. He has stated that G10 and Micarta are strong enough alone. This is supported by the AGR micarta knives w/o liners...but also w/o clips.

You can get lucky screwing into G10 and micarta, but it's not a stable enough platform for long term heavy use.

So will spyderco fix the man's design flaw?
 
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