Needed from the Makers of Folding Rigging Knives

EDCeeker

EDCeeker

Joined
Apr 9, 2006
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One of my hobbies is sailing. I've long considered purchasing a folding rigging knife, but have been unable to identify the one product that "has it all" and is "affordable." It turns out I'm not alone. Recently, in a sailing forum, somebody started a thread and posted a survey on the subject: Sailing / Rigging Knife (SailNet.com)

In post number 9 of that thread he refers to a white paper he's published on the results of his studies: Nautical_Knife_Market.pdf

So there you go, knife-makers, a challenge :): Design, build and sell an "affordable" "Perfect Folding Rigging Knife." From page 28 of the PDF:
  • A locking blade of quality steel and appropriate shape
  • A dedicated and locking marlin spike
  • A foldout shackle key that includes a bottle opener at minimum, perhaps a can opener
  • A one-handed lanyard and carrying strategy
  • Finish the design with true one-handed usability for all of it; that's it--nothing else
(Personally, I could do w/o the bottle/can opener.)

For the blade shape, author David Seidman provides a good description in his book The Complete Sailor: It "...should be short and stubby, gently curved along its edge, with a thick back and anti-slip finger grooves. [Ed. note: I believe he refers here to jimping on the spine.] It should have almost no point at the tip and, in cross section, a gradual taper toward the cutting edge." Seidman is referring to a fixed-blade knife in his text, but I believe a folding rigging knife blade must have similar characteristics. One thing pictured in the book, but not mentioned in the text is a generous choil. Master Rigger Brion Toss, author of The Rigger's Aprentice describes and pictures a knife (again: fixed-blade) with a blade having identical properties.

One reason for that blade profile is that one of the ways in which a rigging knife is used is to cut rope by placing it on a block of wood, setting the knife edge on it, and giving the knife's spine a good, swift whack with a small mallet. I don't know as it's possible to design a folder that could be safely used that way.

Note that I've quoted terms like "affordable" and "perfect..." This is because I surely recognize that both properties are relative, and even somewhat subjective.
 
27x40 said:
http://www.shipstore.com/SS/HTML/DAV/DAV1551.html
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"Made entirely of top quality stainless steel with dutra-edged blades." "Dutra?" Wonder what that is? Anyway, I find it hard be believe the kind of knife I, or any other serious sailor, would be seeking could be had for $20.

27x40 said:
Got curious and hunted around.
AG Russel makes several sailors knives but the shackle key is not present on any.
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Pretty much. According to the author of the white paper: Some have a shackle key in the blade. That strikes me as an accident waiting to happen.

27x40 said:
Wenger's new Alinghi Yachtsman may be of interest.
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Violates the KISS principle in a major way.

You'd have to had spent time on a pitching boat with a stubborn knot (that either wasn't supposed to be there, wasn't supposed to be that kind of knot, wasn't supposed to jam [that hard], etc.) to understand the author's list of requirements.

Thanks for the follow-up, 27x40.
 
Rather than look for the "perfect" do everything knife, I'd recommend doing what I did. Get yourself a Spyderco Salt knife (I prefer the Salt 1, but they're all great), and a separate marlin spike. You can find marlin spides for sale online at numerous marine supply and sailing stores, or you can find lots of workable alternatives. I've even seen people who make their own out of hardwood.
 
topher said:
Rather than look for the "perfect" do everything knife, ...
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"Perfect" is unattainable. Secondly: We're not looking for a "do everything" knife, but a capable folding rigging knife.

topher said:
I'd recommend doing what I did. Get yourself a Spyderco Salt knife (I prefer the Salt 1, but they're all great), and a separate marlin spike...
Click to expand...
That rather misses the point of the white paper's author's study and white paper, and my posting pointers to it here: Bringing attention to the perceived deficiencies in current product offerings and a suggestion to knife-makers as to what the market is lacking.

Admittedly, a folding rigging knife can never be as good a rigging knife as a fixed blade knife. Nor as good a marlingspike as a dedicated marlingspike. Probably not as good a shackle key as a dedicated shackle key. But the folding knife/marlingspike/shackle key you have with you when you suddenly find you need it up on the tossing bow of a boat is probably going to do you more good than the dedicated kit stashed down below in your ditty bag. And that's the whole point: A capable, complete folding rigging knife that one can conveniently keep with them at all times, and reasonably deploy when needed.

Jim
 
Perhaps one could get a nice multi-tool and convert one of the tools in to a marlin-spike?
 
allenC said:
Perhaps one could get a nice multi-tool and convert one of the tools in to a marlin-spike?
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Possible, I suppose. But if you look at a proper marlingspike, you'll see that probably the only thing w/enough heft would be perhaps pliers, and I don't think that would work out well.
 
EDCeeker said:
Possible, I suppose. But if you look at a proper marlingspike, you'll see that probably the only thing w/enough heft would be perhaps pliers, and I don't think that would work out well.
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I've seen a few folders with marlin-spikes and they were really no more hefty than a large phillips screwdriver....besides, being on a folder, the marlin-spike is only going to be as strong as the pivot screw or pivot pin.
 
http://www.myerchin.com/R Knives Folders.html

We got some of these in the Coast Guard. Seem to fit all the criteria to me: locking blade and marlinspike, shackle key, lanyard. I can open mine with one hand (although some folk have trouble).

This is probably one, if not the most, popular sailing knife on the market. I'm surprised nobody on a sailing forum thought of Myerchin.
 
Sorry, got busy and lost track of this thread.

allenC,

Just because the marling spike on many folding rigging knives isn't very substantial doesn't mean that a more substantial marling spike isn't desireable. Take a look at the Myerchins Maikutis mentions, for example.

Maikutis,

Of course the Myerchins are known. And they're listed in the author's white-paper. They almost, but don't quite meet the criteria, because the shackle slot is in the blade. ISTM battling with a stubborn shackle on a pitching deck with an open, sharp blade is an invitation to disaster--what with all the sailcloth, rope and, especially, vulnerable body parts in the near vicinity.

kamkazmoto,

Like the Myerchins: Very close. At least the shackle slot is in the spike, rather than the blade, and can possilbly be used w/o opening the spike. Relatively pricey, tho. (These are also listed in the author's white-paper.)

Thanks for your comments, guys.
 
EDCeeker said:
...
Of course the Myerchins are known. And they're listed in the author's white-paper. They almost, but don't quite meet the criteria, because the shackle slot is in the blade. ISTM battling with a stubborn shackle on a pitching deck with an open, sharp blade is an invitation to disaster--what with all the sailcloth, rope and, especially, vulnerable body parts in the near vicinity.

kamkazmoto,

Like the Myerchins: Very close. At least the shackle slot is in the spike, rather than the blade, and can possilbly be used w/o opening the spike. Relatively pricey, tho. (These are also listed in the author's white-paper.)

Thanks for your comments, guys.
Click to expand...

I met John Myerchin in 1985 and worked with him until 1998. I have a lot of respect for him: he's a humble, competent guy who cares about people.
 
Paymeister said:
I met John Myerchin in 1985 and worked with him until 1998. I have a lot of respect for him: he's a humble, competent guy who cares about people.
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I'm not questioning John Myerchin's character or competence. I'm just offering the opinion, as a sailor (and an admittedly relatively inexperienced one, at that), that ISTM having a blade open on a (possibly) pitching deck, in a target-rich environment, possibly in the dark, so you can use a shackle key strikes me as a less-than-optimal design.
 
HI out there. I'm a bit of a collector, I have a KA-BAR folder,love it but no shac. key. A vintage ABL w/ can / bottel opener, shac.key, spike, blade(sheep foot) really hard to open. A Telo I have had for 20 years it has it all, but no locking blade and blade can close on lanyard loop. My fixed Blade Myerchin w/key in spike is real nice although a little bulky. Speaking of Myerchin they have a new one thats looks really good,called the p300 It has all that I will need. It has no shack.key (I never did like those keys anyway)It has a built in set of pliers. Only thing is it has a serated blade, well I guess I'll find out If I like that. I plan to buy. Now what color should I get? Sail on, Mark
 
I don't know. I've been stuck, in the dark, crossing a bar in nasty-as-it-gets weather (Columbia River Washington/Oregon). Never had a problem with the Myerchin. I guess we weren't sailing (47' motor life boat), but we were towing a sail boat. The captain of the sail boat carried a spyderco and a separate key.

Honestly, with all due respect, I think you're thinking about this way to hard. You're imagining yourself to be pitched about in rolling seas messing with a key. I'd argue its better to have them separate, should one get lost (likely). Often, a dedicated tool is better for a dedicated job.

I'd consider a shackle key on a knife as a bonus, not a requirement.

Your thoughts may vary.

mike.
 
Hi, got my p300 today. It looks real good. It blasted through a pice of half inch double braide but left the ends a little messy.To me thats ok because this is going to be my emergency knife that I will carry when sailing. Also it is a true one hand operated. Blade and spike lock and unlock easy. Has a nice belt clasp too and a nylon pouch for when you are done. OK, now for the best part the shack key is a plier. All for 30.00 Clams U.S. EDCeeker check it out I think it comes close to what you are talking about. Mark
 
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