New to Heat treating

NickWheeler

NickWheeler

Joined
Dec 3, 1999
Messages
9,437
Hello again-

I decided to break my questions up into a couple posts instead of asking ten things at once...

Thus far, I have sent all my blades to Paul Bos for heat treating. He does a great job, but I have been thinking more and more that I want to do it myself.

Here's where I am at now. I am pretty sure I am ready to call Paragon on Monday and order the 24 inch knife maker's furnace (that really is especially hard on a college students pocketbook).

As far as the stainless tool wrap (foil), I was told by some makers that they treat tool steel with it in a foil packet and then quench the knife while it's still in the foil to keep things cleaner. Is this good, bad ???

Purchasing the foil? I have an MSC and an Enco catalog and Enco sells the same foil for $30 less. Is this the best source? Or can somebody let me in on a better one?

I have ground all my blades out of ATS-34 so far. But a friend GAVE me five 36" pieces of 0-1. There's 1/16" and 5/32 thicknesses, precision ground and all in 4 inch widths.

Yes, that was quite a gift!!!

Moving on, can I get some idea on how to heat treat it??? What would you guys grind it to before heat treating (60? 240? 400?)

I have heard a lot about freezing the blades in a container of dry ice and Acetone as opposed to Nitrogen. Thoughts ??? How much dry ice? How much Acetone or other alcohol??? A nearby maker told me he gets dry ice at Baskin Robins. Does anybody else and if not where?

I know that 0-1 isn't the BEST steel. But it was FREE and it seems to be the old stand-by, so it seems to be the perfect medium for refining my heat-treating and grinding techniques.

I know this is a lot to ask!

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Nick
 
that's what i did with o-1, tried out a couple grinding techniques, found flat grinding to be my favorite, so i'm sticking with that one. o-1 is pretty much just a simple carbon tool steel. 440c and ats-34 grind easier, and are easier to finish by hand. o-1 looks very nice when mirror finished. i would finish to at least 240, maybe even 400.

[This message has been edited by magnum .44 (edited 03 December 1999).]
 
Nick, I do not believe that heat treating your own blades is a good ideal unless you do some type of hardness testing. The testing equipment is a important part of heat treating blades if you want good and consistant results.

I have also wanted to buy a oven to heat treat blades but have choosen to wait until I could also aford a hardness tester. Instead of buying the oven I bought tools to build folding knives. I got myself a small lathe/mill. The unimat has impoved my knife making abilities more than any other tool in my shop.

The way I see it with money is that it is usually easier to send than to get and when you have money you still have options. Give yourself some more time to think of how you want to spend the money it will still be their when you go to buy it. Good luck Nick
 
Ray-

Thanks, that's a very good point. What you said is something I've been going over in my mind.

I spent a week down in Texas at JP Moss's shop and built a folder with him. I have to say the precision of folding knives is a draw.

Of course the ideal situation would be to buy the tools AND the furnace, but money still isn't growing on any of the trees here in Washington. Damn.

I'm interested in more about this mill/lathe you have. Are you talking two small units or one multi-tool?

The biggest reason I have been leaning towards the furnace is because the mills alone that I've looked at are twice the money.

By the way, I read the article by Phil Wilson in KI about needing a tester for consistent heat-treating results. The point is dually noted. I found an old unit circa 1950's for $4500...ouch. I'm not sure I'd trust some of the units that are on the market.

Thanks again.
 
Nick,
I gotta agree with Ray. Let Paul keep heat treating them for now.

I bought my first oven about 15 years ago, primarily because I wanted to work with so many different steels. A hardness tester, heat treating books, gloves, foil, and all the other stuff followed. Pretty soon, I had over 2 grand tied up that could have been used for other equipment. I made it through it, but in hindsight it wasn't such a good idea.

 
rob simonich does my heat treating, i'm convinced he is the best heat treater out there. heat treats knives fantasticaly, and i am in a rush to get knives done for christmas, so he shipped them to me priority, that helped me out alot. thanks rob
 
Your welcome Brian. I agree on the need for a good hardness tester before getting a furnace. I have an old Wilson that came with all the test blocks and different anvils and penetrators for both B and C scale testing. The thing is built like a Swiss Watch, and would cost several tohosand dollars to replace. Heat treating is one of the most satisfying parts of knifemaking for me. Something about pulling them blades out of the orange furnace and transforming them from soft to hard that is almost magical. I actually do quite a few other makers knives, and their trust in my work is kinda scary!
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www.simonichknives.com
 
Nick, The Emco unimat 3 is a combination lathe/mill it has 7.9" between centers and a center height of 1.8". It is no longer made but you can still get parts and accessories for it. I have just got the dividing attachment for it and have started making mosaic pins using 3/16" brass rod and 1/4" brass tubing.

I use the unimat to jewel liners, make pivot pins, slot guards, finish screw heads, and to make my own counter sinks.

The sherline miniature lathe has a good reputation, has alot of accessories available for it, and cost less money than the Emco products. Good luck
 
rob, thanks for shipping it to me so fast i already started on one, and you gave me a couple extra days. i'll post a picture as soon as possible.
 
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