Newbie needs some direction

R

Rpaul

Joined
Jan 20, 2017
Messages
4
Hey Guys,
I'm new to this forum, any knife forum for that matter, and I'm having trouble right from the jump. I have read a lot of the archived posts, and the sticky posted by Mag_G in particular. I started with a CKRT EDC, and followed the directions in the sticky, on how to properly apex my edge. I'm working with a basic Lansky guided sharpening system, with the coarse, medium, and fine stones. I have sharpened knives on the Worksharp, grinder, and by hand, but none were worth anything when I finished, so I'm starting at the beginning and trying to learn the proper method. That said, I spent a while with the coarse stone, maybe an hour, and took my time trying to correct the edge and properly apex it. I'm sure the scratches mentioned in the sticky were uniform, and I tried to get a good burr, but it really didn't feel as pronounced as I thought it should. So I tried using the marker method, I read about here, to be sure the edge was uniform. After using the marker, and checking every couple of times with a magnifying glass and bright headlamp, I repeated the process on the opposite side. I went from the coarse to fine stones using this same process, and finished with a strop on a piece of 5000 grit sanding sheet. I have never stropped a knife, but I followed the illustrations in a post I found on here. I only did it a few times, to try to remove the micro-burr, because I wasn't really sure what I was doing. After all that, I tried testing the sharpness of the edge by feel, and cutting a piece of paper, and found it wouldn't cut at all. Disheartened that the last couple hours was spent in vain, I grabbed a double sided Smith's field sharpener, with a carbide angled coarse side and ceramic rod fine side. I ran the knife through the fine side while watching tv, for about 10-15 mins, and it is extremely sharp now. What did I do wrong in the stone sharpening process? I have some, what I think are good knives, K-bars and Cold Steel knives, so I need to know what I'm doing wrong on my practice knives before I ruin my good knives. If I don't have the talent you gentlemen have, for professionally / correctly sharpening them, I will concede; but I know almost nothing when it comes to the level the guys here sharpen at, so I would greatly appreciate any guidance that anyone may have for me. I would welcome the opportunity to try ay recommended techniques, and report back the results. Sorry for anyone that actually reads all this, but I wanted to give as much info in the OP as may be required. Thank you, in advance.
 
Man . . . you're not having much luck getting an answer.

I'm thinking you pressed too hard on the last few strokes and or took too many passes per side in the last few strokes. Try going really light the last ten strokes or so and only one stroke per side alternating back and forth.

You may have biased the edge to one side; kind of rolled it.

Usually less is more once you get some kind of sharpish apex. In fact the last strokes don't take full length strokes just a few inches of the stone for the whole blade edge. And the higher you get up onto the edge (think secondary / micro bevel) the lighter you want to go and the shorter the strokes.

The force on a very narrow bevel is high even with light pressure. If the bevel is wide you can use much more force while sharpening but then maybe steepen the angle even a fraction of a degree and go light then.

This can take a while to learn. Get some serious magnification and LOOK at the condition of the edge before and after your work and adjust your strategy accordingly.
 
What do I mean “serious magnification “ ?

Note the optional pivoting lense


This is a mini microscope


Or a loop. I didn't find a photo of my loop but you know what I mean.
 
Hi,
and congratulations, the matrix has you now :D
Rpaul said:
Hey Guys,
I'm new to this forum, any knife forum for that matter, and I'm having trouble right from the jump. I have read a lot of the archived posts, and the sticky posted by Mag_G in particular. I started with a CKRT EDC, and followed the directions in the sticky, on how to properly apex my edge. I'm working with a basic Lansky guided sharpening system, with the coarse, medium, and fine stones. I have sharpened knives on the Worksharp, grinder, and by hand, but none were worth anything when I finished, so I'm starting at the beginning and trying to learn the proper method. That said, I spent a while with the coarse stone, maybe an hour, and took my time trying to correct the edge and properly apex it. I'm sure the scratches mentioned in the sticky were uniform, and I tried to get a good burr, but it really didn't feel as pronounced as I thought it should. So I tried using the marker method, I read about here, to be sure the edge was uniform. After using the marker, and checking every couple of times with a magnifying glass and bright headlamp, I repeated the process on the opposite side. I went from the coarse to fine stones using this same process, and finished with a strop on a piece of 5000 grit sanding sheet. I have never stropped a knife, but I followed the illustrations in a post I found on here. I only did it a few times, to try to remove the micro-burr, because I wasn't really sure what I was doing. After all that, I tried testing the sharpness of the edge by feel, and cutting a piece of paper, and found it wouldn't cut at all. Disheartened that the last couple hours was spent in vain, I grabbed a double sided Smith's field sharpener, with a carbide angled coarse side and ceramic rod fine side. I ran the knife through the fine side while watching tv, for about 10-15 mins, and it is extremely sharp now. What did I do wrong in the stone sharpening process? I have some, what I think are good knives, K-bars and Cold Steel knives, so I need to know what I'm doing wrong on my practice knives before I ruin my good knives. If I don't have the talent you gentlemen have, for professionally / correctly sharpening them, I will concede; but I know almost nothing when it comes to the level the guys here sharpen at, so I would greatly appreciate any guidance that anyone may have for me. I would welcome the opportunity to try ay recommended techniques, and report back the results. Sorry for anyone that actually reads all this, but I wanted to give as much info in the OP as may be required. Thank you, in advance.
Click to expand...
Hi,
What you did is learn stuff :) a lot of stuff
You did absolutely nothing wrong ,
you got sharpening equipment,
you tried sharpening,
you didn't give up,
you got there,
next time you'll get there sooner

you learned the difference between reading stuff and knowing stuff, doing stuff helps you know stuff
you learned what it feels like to regrind/reprofile/lower the edge angle with lansky coarse hone
you learned that burrs can be felt before you've reached the apex,
and that on your next sharpening practice you'll increase the angle
and if you're grinding/scrubbing one side and havent raised a big giant floppy you can see and feel from space
in under 300 strokes / 5 minutes, your angle is too low


so, thats the beginning,
grind on one side for a full minute,
check with fingernail on the other side of edge if you feel a curl of metal catching your nail
grind for one full minute,
if still no curl to catch your nail increase angle,
when nail catches on burr, switch sides and grind for a minute and check if burr has flipped,
when burr has flipped, stand burr up, double the angle,
and cut burr off with 1-10 alternating edge leading passes
and you can shave arm hair with it at any grit

then onto the next stone ,
maybe with increased angle angle (for a microbevel)
and for 5-10 alternating edge leading passes per side
all the way until your final stone
 
Wow bagged,
Thank you for the insight. I agree totally with the magnification suggestion. I found it difficult to really see what I was doing, so that'll be my next investment. I could put it to use on other projects too, if she asks.
 
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Bucketstove,
Awesome advice! And thanks for the words of encouragement. I hate to let anything whip me, and the older I get the more I realize a more "tactical" assault, usually yields better results. Which is why I'm here, and hopefully with the input you guys have given me, I can start producing, and reproducing, correctly sharpened edges. I'll put your technique to work on a blade promptly, and report back. Thanks again.
 
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Hey Guys, I've been using the techniques you guys gave me to try, and I'm pleased to report that I can sharpen a knife that will hold an edge longer than 15 minutes. The only knives that I have, that aren't working knives, are those handed down that have sentimental value, so it's really important for me to be able to sharpen and not have to repeat every night. LOL. Once I started trying to "feel" the edge as I was sharpening, I could verify that through the glass. Still have yet to get the loupe, but with the mag glass I've got I can tell the uniformity of the scratches, and that aided in telling how hard, and when to switcch stones. I can't describe, or give accurate account of how or when I knew it was working, but I kept practicing using those technques, and I could "feel" the difference as much as I could see it. The mirco bevel is probably the single most "identifiable" tip that I can see made a huge difference. After reading more on it, it should be the reason the edge retains sharpness, even with heavy use, longer. I'm not proclaiming to hold a candle to the pros here, and my edges are NOT mirror, but I'm elated that I can take my K-Bar and put a great edge on it. I'm still practicing, and learning, and I'm sure the level I can take my edges to is partly dependant on the stones, so I'm also starting to add more. Right now, I'm tryng to see how good I can get with a strop, but I've found that I can actually dull it back down with improper technique. Anyway, I just wanted to reach out, and relay my appreciation for all your help, believe me I needed it. LOL If the whole world were as willing to ask for help, and get such good advice, as I have here, it would be a much better place. Thanks again for your help!
 
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