Nobody needs more than a $100.00 knife.

Keith Montgomery

Keith Montgomery

Joined
May 9, 2000
Messages
29,205
You can do everything with a $100.00 knife that you can do with a $1000.00 knife except show it off as a status symbol and think you are better than the guys who figure that a $100.00 knife is all you need.

There is no way that a thousand dollar knife has that much better materials and construction that it could possibly be worth the money that is being asked for it. Sure a maker has to get a reasonable return on the hours he puts into making a knife, but come on now, there is no way that custom knives should cost as much as they do. Heck, I think my Benchmade and Spyderco knives are just about as good, if not as good as any custom knife that I have seen. As far as I am concerned anyone that spends that kind of money on a knife has more money than brains.

The above is my paraphrasing of what I have been reading more and more often on the Blade Discussion Forum recently. I have nothing against people liking their $30.00 to $150.00 production knives. Heck I think that there are some pretty darn good $10.00 knives out there (I am thinking of Opinel in particular), but I am getting really ticked at people that presume to tell me that I am stupid or a knife snob because I choose to purchase knives that cost a fair bit of money.

I do this because I love these knives. They have originality, style, quality and fit and finish that in my opinion far exceeds almost anything being produced by the manufacturers. The only production knives that I see that come close in quality to a custom knife, also cost just about as much, or in some cases just as much as a comparable custom knife. You also get to take part in what the knife will become and I love having input into how my knives will turn out. The other part of why I love custom knives as I do is that I get to interact with the makers, get to know them and in some cases even become friends with them. Try that with any $100.00 production knife out there.

Sorry about this long winded rant, but I just had to get that off my chest. I enjoy BladeForums because of the shared enjoyment of all knives and to have people tell me that I am a moron or a snob for spending the money that I do on knives really gets me upset.
 
I enjoy BladeForums because of the shared enjoyment of all knives and to have people tell me that I am a moron or a snob for spending the money that I do on knives really gets me upset.
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The truth hurts. You and I are knife snobs. We have come to appreciate the better stuff in knives.

There are many younger knife collectors on this site and it is perfectly natural for them to feel the way they do. Most of the population can't even understand why we appreciate knives. To them packages and bags are things you claw and stab at with bare hands, teeth, and whatever misc. thing happens to be at hand.

At least our guys appreciate knives. In due time they will come to realize that, as with everything else, you generally get what you pay for. The more expensive the knife, the better the finish, the better the value retention, and generally the better the construction. There are alot of minor details that you tend to pick up over time. Everything from the quality of the blade grind, and the weight and balance of the knife, to the durability and comfort of the handle is something that you will come to appreciate. It doesn't come from looking at a catalog, you have to actually handle the knives to feel the difference.

There is also some expensive junk on the market. The best thing to do is to start with the cheaper production knives, until you find somthing you like, and then slowly work your way up to the better stuff.

n2s
 
Keith, I understand your point. I've watched the last few weeks as people have stated their ignorance.(Ignorance, meaning uneducated or uninformed)It's a mind-set they have of knives being tools only. In that since they are totally right. But, when custom knives are veiwed as they truly are, as an experience, as something special, as an *INVESTMENT, and most importantly *ART, they don't have a clue.

Remember a few months ago, the thread,"Knives as Investments", The good doctor and others just didn't get it. These forums should be a place of enjoyment and EDUCATION. I know I have learned from others on here and hope I will open the eyes of others as well.

Don't let them get to you. Be secure in your decisions and continue to learn and educate when you can. Never forget, regardless of the circumstance,ONCE KNOWLEDGE IS OBTAINED, THERE IS NO EXCUSE!

*I'm not refering to all custom knives as ART and an INVESTMENT. Just the select makers that rise to the top.

Keith, I look forward to reading more of your post, as I have in the past.

Thank you,
Darby
 
n2s, I agree that someone that is new to knives would be likely to have this opinion and I can understand that. A lot of what I am seeing as far as these comments are concerned is coming from experienced knife people, not just newbies.

I dug through an old box I had in storage the other day and I found a couple of Opinels that I had put away ages ago. I still think that these are very high value knives. I love my Buck 110 and inexpensive slipjoints. I would never presume to tell someone that is looking at purchasing a good quality inexpensive knife that I think he must have something wrong with him to be looking at something that inexpensive. I would recommend the best knife that I know of for that price range.

When I first got really interested in knives I owned many good quality lower priced knives. They were all that I could afford. Even then I dreamed about owning knives from Loveless, Fox, Lake, Henry, Dowell and many other custom makers of the time. These knives were way above what I could afford to spend, but I new they were better than what I had and I aspired to them. I felt the people that owned these knives new what they were doing and I wanted to be one of them.

Own and love all the production knives you want. Just don't get up on a soap box and preach to me about how I don't need the knives that I am buying. Yes I do, because I won't settle for anything less. Does that make me a knife snob? I don't think so. As far as I am concerned all it makes me is someone that has found something he really loves and I am going to continue to so for as long as I am able. I will also continue to buy some inexpensive knives, because they can be fun as well, but my true passion is custom knives and that is never going to change.

Damn I can ramble on.
 
Good thread. I'll keep mine short: I own over 50 customs and they value over 20k. :eek: I'm a BIG snob! ;)

For work lately, I have been carrying and using my Spyderco Calypso folder. I couldn't have a better-suited knife for the mainstay of my knife usage. Costs just over 100 bucks. Other customs on occasion I use, but for functionality this one is the best.

But......

I can't WAIT for my next $$$ custom to arrive, though!! Damn them kidz...

Coop
 
Well said Keith,you rambling madman.:p I like many others here have started to put together a fairly decent collection of customes.I don't collect customes to wave it in somebody elses face.I collect for the pride of personal ownership and enjoy using
a knife that a maker has sweated over to make the best he could and the enjoyment of interacting with the makers.For me it's that simple.
 
I used to feel the same way. I thought $40 was expensive to drop on my Ka-Bar. Then I went out and got a Gerber Covert, and thought that $90 was tough to let go. Then I went out and got an Emerson, after a while I got an HI khukri, a Custom Bowie, and a Custom Neck knife... It just takes time before they get used to the fact that a $200+ knife can actually be worth the money. For me all it took were some qualiy pics of great looking knives.:)
 
I'm no snob although "moron" is very arguable. I'd be in major league trouble with my wife if she knew that I have $2650 in 5 knives. I've tried to go back to production knives and I can't do it (although there's not a thing wrong with production knives). So my point is that I'm severely sleep deprived from a one year old that was up all night and I can't really think of any point. My 5 knives are worth every penny (and then some), by the way.
 
It doesn't matter what the product is, there are always people who don't get it.

Here is a question for those who "don't get it". If custom knives are not superior to factory knives. Why is every factory in the US after the best know custom knife makers to either design or license exsisting models to the factory?

Hell, even the factories are custom knife snobs!

Take the for sale forum here on BF. Back before Spark seperated factory and custom how many times did you see this:

Terzuola, Carson, Ralph, Emerson, Elishewitz and Crawford for sale.

Only to find out it was a Spyderco, CRKT, Outdoor Edge, Emerson Factory, Benchmade and CRKT.

Why didn't the seller's list the factories that produced these knives. For the same reason the factories go after these makers.

They are selling "snob" appeal at an "affordable" price.

On a side note, due directly to the amount of advertising the factories due for these makers. The demand for the knives from these makers has increased. Also, people are now coming to custom knives at an earlier age than they did before.

The "snob" level in knives is now rising.
 
Let's just forget about "invesments" and the almighty dollar for a second.

Life is fleeting and in my view (and I know it is shared by many of you) the joy of owning or experiencing a thing of beauty is its own reward.

Why is a Mont Blanc (I don't collect pens so sorry if I'm leaving out a better variety) better than a Bic?

Why is a Mercedes better than a Yugo?

Why is a painting by one of the masters better than some Home Shopping Channel wall hanging?

The point is that the value is in what it brings to the person who experiences it, not what they might sell it for later on.

I'd never trade a sunrise spent on a mountain top I had climbed for watching the same scene on The Discovery Channel.

I have a Revishvili piece with a blade by Keith Kilby (M.S.). How does one put a particular value on that knife when it will never (while I own it) be used for slicing and dicing? The fact is that it is a piece of art that astounds me with its craftsmanship and artistry each time I take it out to examine it. Even if I couldn't afford to have purchased it when I did, its beauty would still have been breathtaking to me.

Keith, don't let the naysayers get you down. Some of it is jealousy, some ignorance, and for some just the fact that they see knives as something utilitarian that cuts and is then put away.

Remember, your own reasons are the best reason for doing anything.
 
Keith,

Do not let them rock your boat.

I do not own a custom knife.....yet. If I could afford it, I would be buying customs galore. It seems a Knife Knut pyramid exists. Some start out with a gas station pos 5$ knife and progress through CRKT, Spyderco, Benchmade, CRK and into customs. The top of the pyramid.

Originally posted by Don Rac
It just takes time before they get used to the fact that a $200+ knife can actually be worth the money.
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Excellent point.

I also agree with Blues. Life is short, so why not buy and enjoy the best you can afford. There is nothing wrong with striving for and preferring custom products.

Cheers,
Gord
 
Originally posted by KWM
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You can do everything with a $100.00 knife that you can do with a $1000.00 knife except show it off as a status symbol and think you are better than the guys who figure that a $100.00 knife is all you need.

I guess we all see this sort of liturgy from time to time Keith.., but I honestly never do much except grin. :) It has been a rare occurance for me to feel like anyone here is "showing off".., or feels "better" than others because they have X,Y.., or Z knife. I think a few of these folks misunderstand the difference between profound interest and pride of ownership.., and just plain bragging.

It is also not true that you can do anything with a $100 knife that you can do with a $1000 knife.., and until I see someone trade a Benchmade AFCK for a Brend Model 2.., I'll stick with that opinion. ;)

Originally posted by KWM
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As far as I am concerned anyone that spends that kind of money on a knife has more money than brains.

On a lighter note.., the downside to having more money than brains is what exactly....lol??

Fun thread...thanks!


"Hunters seek what they [WANT].., Seekers hunt what they [NEED]"
 
I think most people that are into customs started out with factory knives. That certainly is the way I got started. Quality was always something I looked for in a knife, even as a kid. The first knife that I bought for myself was a Puma hunter and it cost me a months paper route money. Since then I have pretty well stuck to knives of at least that quality range. I did buy a $4.00 knife for opening boxes at work, but found it to be such a piece of crap that I threw it out a couple of weeks later.

In my opinion you reach a limit in factory knives and if you want to continue to get something better customs are the next step. Once you reach the world of custom knives there is virtually no limit as to how far you can go with knives. If I had the money there is no doubt in my mind that I would own knives by Scagel, Moran, Loveless and others of that ilk as well as many of todays more makers of upper end knives. Hopefully someday I will be able to own just one of these great knives.

Les, what you posted about the factories trying to get together with the top makers for collaborations is very true indeed. The knives that are produced from these collaborations tend to be some of the most popular models that these companies sell. I guess even people that spend just $50.00 to $200.00 on knives want a little bit of that snob appeal as well.

Pete, I think that the way you just grin when you read about people thinking that $100.00 knives are as good as anyone really needs, is probably the right way to look at things. I am sure that in a year or two I am going to be reading posts by some of these people stating how great they think custom knives are and that at one time they too thought that $100.00 knives were all they would ever need.
 
Fun thread. I do not know about the snob part, but I could stand in AnklePocket's corner and chip in trying to defend against the "couple of morons" argument. :D

Personally, I am not a wealthy person, but I lead a pretty simple life (whenever I can). That enables me to dabble (at times pretty heavily) in knives and a couple of other "hobbies" or sports. (kayak's and rafts ain't cheap either) :).

If a custom knife was just an object or a tool to me I probably would own a couple but would not be as interested in in custom knife collecting. I would probably own a small folder and nice utilitarian DA folder and a nice big ol' camp knife and something for whitewater rescue, but that would be about it.

When I order a higher end knife, I put a lot of thought into it. Thought based on what has been seen, read, heard and experienced. I usually have a multiple year wait so that gives me time to skimp on dog food to save the cash. :) There is no doubt that to me these knives are a splurge, at the same time in each case I have made a friend or become closer to an existing friend. In some cases the maker would call every few days to chat and let me know what was going on with the knife.

These three examples might illustrate my point a little.

I met Darrel Ralph at a show Les and Bob organized at the Ramada Inn in downtown Atlanta in 1995 or 1996 (or was it 1994 Les?)(I do not know what got into Les letting a factory knife dealer into a Custom Show :) (Actually it was held in conjunction with a Knife Club show if I am not mistaken so don't blame Les :D.)

Anyway it was a cool show. Darrel won best folder (may have been an early version of the Nomad). Folks were lined up 2 and 3 deep at my table at times, but when things were slow Darrel and I spent a bunch of time together and I even sold him a nice Case 1111/2 in pearl. (He got a great deal). He turned me on the the Knives Points of Interest books. :D That Case Cheetah was the down payment for a dagger we were going to talk about and he would make (Now keep in mind Darrel did not have his ABS JS stamp at that time and this was going to be a test piece for his M.S. stamp. (When you place an order like that you don't worry about when.) We have had a blast with it. It has evolved into several incarnations.


John Fitch is also a friend. I met him at his first Blade Show and was impressed with the person and his work right off. Over the years I kept threatening him that I was actually going to buy one of his knives some day. When John earned his Journeyman's Smith stamp he had pretty darn nice stag bowie on his table (his first mosaic damascus) and I scarfed it up. By that time the dagger bug had bit me good, so I asked "flat grind" if his M.S. dagger was spoken for. It wasn't.


This one two has been a blast. That pick in Blade last year looking through the now infamous loupe was taken while I was looking at the roughed out blade of the dagger. (John had actually gotten a little impatient with me when I did not bring the loupe on the first day so I reluctantly brought it the second day only to look at the dagger blade. Of course with my luck Steve walked by and nabbed the pic.
John and I talk a lot and I think he has made about 15 or 20 guards for this pup. It was not that any of them were bad, he would just get started and another idea would pop into his head, so he would finish up his first idea and go onto the next.

John and I talk a good bit and it is great to hear him excited over what he was working on or what new idea he had while he has been making this knife. It will be ready at Blade and I am excited about owning a knife that a good friend has been working on for a year and a half.

Back in 1996 I was very fortunate to make another friend. I ordered a knife from her even though she had a 2+ year waiting list and stayed in touch. When my name came up, she called and would talk about the knife. That experience too was a blast. Delana has remained a friend since then and I have been blessed to get to call her husband Van a friend also. Both great people.

I would not trade the experiences I have had with these four and a few others for love or money. (Well ok, I am single so maybe love :).

The best thing is that those experiences are not limited to occasions when a knife order is involved. I still buy and use an occasional factory knife but they can not provide the enjoyment I get from "hanging around customs."

Bottom line = Who cares what anybody else thinks. Enjoy them. As Blues stated life is too short and as Calvin Cooledge so eloquently stated it is also to short to carry an ugly knife.



Edited because anyone who knows me realizes that I can not possible write this much and not have typos and poor spelling all over the place.
 
Great topic and replies!!! If anyone wants to build a thousand dollar knife and sell it to me for a hundred dollars please give me a call. Heck, I'll even pay two hundred.:)

I'm with Blues. The value is in the enjoyment. I own some thousand dollar knives and I've made some thousand dollar knives. To this day I can't say wheather I like collecting them or making them better. I'm not very interested in a knife that is one of ten thousand or more. I want something that someone put themselves into. I want something that has character. I want something unique. I want something that has life in it.

Custom knives represent a place in the world where individuals and quality still matter. Money is secondary to this in my mind.
 
Reality check, the folks who rant and rave about $1000 knives could never afford one, for WHATEVER reason. I've been sniped by a few folks just because I'm a "custom" buyer. If you really like it, you can pay for it, and appreciate it, just buy the damn thing. Anyone who doesn't think a J.W. Smith or Bose or Horn piece isn't worth the going price, either doesn't REALLY love knives or has no taste!
 
Originally posted by Gus Kalanzis
I would not trade the experiences!

Bottom line = Who cares what anybody else thinks. Enjoy them. As Blues stated life is too short and as Calvin Cooledge so eloquently stated it is also to short to carry an ugly knife.
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Good points guys! I don't think many of us are "rich" in terms of money BUT the experience of knowing the makers of some of the finest peices of cutlery in the world . . . and then getting to carry their work is a rich opportunity indeed!:D :D :D
 
The thing most people dont realize is that there are some custom makers that dont charge a arm and a leg. I mean i used to buy production only until i found a custom maker that makes great user knives, may not be a pretty as a fisk or mayo but i dont want something that looks amazing cause i USE my knives not collect them, so its gunna get beat up anyways. I picked up a 4" fixed blade custom thats totally bullet proof, i have beat this thing into the ground and it keeps coming back for more, i have used it for things i have broken production knives doing and it still survived, and it was only $80 shipped. Hell thats cheaper than most production knives in its range and its alot tougher. I have nothing against people spening $1000+ on knives, for me its not practical cause i USE my knives, but if i collected them then i would be spending $1000+ as well.
 
I never understood why people get so upset over how someone else spend's their own money. If I want to buy a $1000 knife, so what. Why on Earth should you care? Please explain it to me.
I have a few $1000+ knives and I love them. One is my Favorite knife. Not because of the price but because of the design, construction and feel. I also really like my Opinel and it cost me a whopping $6. For the most part, price is meaningless to me. If it is a good value, it is a good value.

Rich
 
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