Noob needs help--Sharpening my SAK (my nightmare?)

M

maximus0723

Joined
May 2, 2010
Messages
118
Last several hours hasn't been good.

I had used big knife on my huntsman II out in my backyard several times. Used it to make pegs, practice making traps and some bushcrafting.

When I got my MT (bought new) it was sharp. To simplify, I would give 10 points to that edge, after backyard work I would give it an 8.

Now, I am very new in the knife world (:D), so I bought a cheap oil stone from sears which only had course edge.

After searching online for some sharpening tips, I tried to sharpen my knife, guess what, I screwed up. After sharpening or more like dulling it, I give it 5 points. Before sharpening paper was being cut with fair ease, after sharpening/dulling, I was tearing it rather then slicing it.

I have a camping trip on the weekend, so right now I am in big dodo.

From my research, SAK are very easy or easiest to sharpen. But those comments fooled me as you can see :grumpy:.

So gentlemen, I need your help. I have that stone and lot of sand paper.
I am not planning to buy expensive knives in near future, so I think it's futile to spend ~$50 or more on sharpening equipment.
But I think I can work with what I have and get my knife in much better condition. I just need more help!
 
More expert people than I will respond, but maybe the difficulties you are experiencing stem from the combination of using a coarse stone and technique. I would try a finer stone and sharpen by cutting "into" the stone at a shallow angle , 20 degrees or so (experts, please correct me if that is technically does not comprise a shallow angle). I have difficulty with technique and hope to improve some day.
 
corse stones= corse edge...You should use corser stones/grit to fix chips etc. To put a fine edge you have to use fine grit. Some people use several stages of fine sandpaper all the way to 1500 grit then strop with polishing compound. It all depends on what type of edge you are striving for.Shallow angle also helps produce finer edge.
 
All I ever used was a medium Arkansas stone, until about ten years ago. Now I have all kinds of sharpening gear. My advice to you would be to get a DMT diamond duo-fold. About $20, I think. Two grits of diamond (faster, to get that knife back in business quicker). It's portable too, so take it camping with you, and practice while sitting around the campfire.
 
agreed with the DMT diamond duo-fold ,,later on get some better quality medium and fine stones,,or maybe even a sharpmaker which is pretty easyt oo use ,,comes with a dvd how to ,,
 
maximus0723 said:
Last several hours hasn't been good.

I had used big knife on my huntsman II out in my backyard several times. Used it to make pegs, practice making traps and some bushcrafting.

When I got my MT (bought new) it was sharp. To simplify, I would give 10 points to that edge, after backyard work I would give it an 8.

Now, I am very new in the knife world (:D), so I bought a cheap oil stone from sears which only had course edge.

After searching online for some sharpening tips, I tried to sharpen my knife, guess what, I screwed up. After sharpening or more like dulling it, I give it 5 points. Before sharpening paper was being cut with fair ease, after sharpening/dulling, I was tearing it rather then slicing it.

I have a camping trip on the weekend, so right now I am in big dodo.

From my research, SAK are very easy or easiest to sharpen. But those comments fooled me as you can see :grumpy:.

So gentlemen, I need your help. I have that stone and lot of sand paper.
I am not planning to buy expensive knives in near future, so I think it's futile to spend ~$50 or more on sharpening equipment.
But I think I can work with what I have and get my knife in much better condition. I just need more help!
Click to expand...


Okay max, we're gonna fix it. Do exactly what I tell you, and we'll get the knife pretty sharp. Your stone will do just fine for now, but later get a DMT or Eze-lap diamond hone. I carry a Eze-lap model L in my wallet with most of the red plastic handle cut off so it will fit in the zipper compartment.

Take some dry erase magic marker and color the blade edge bevels on you knife. A nice bright color is good. I use red.

Then take the knife and set it on the stone at 90 degrees, like you're going to try to cut the stone in half. Half of 90 is 45, so we lay the blade over just one half of that distance. Look at the distance from the back of the balde to the stone now at 45 degrees. Now cut that distance in half again. Now your in the ball park of a decent cutting edge.

Now, without lifting the blade off the stone, start honing the blade in small circles, starting at the base of the blade, and moving to the tip. Take at least a full minute to do one side. Do not take the blade off the stone, keep in contact. This will help you keep the right angle while honing.

After a minute, do the same thing on the other side. Start at 90 degrees like you're going to saw the stone in half, and lay the blade over twice, each time cutting the angle by half. Hone in circles for a minute. Then check the fresh ground area as compared to what was marked with the marker.

After a while you should have two bevels that are in the ball park of being a good cutting edge. Repeat as needed. As the knife gets sharper, just use less presure on the stone.

Don't get too hung up on angle. Once sharp, 99.999% of the people out there won't be able to tell the difference. Sharp is sharp, and a degree or two of angle is not going to make a difference you can see while sharpening a tent peg or cutting a package open. If you start obsessing over it, your in trouble.

People trying to learn free hand sharpening by the slice into the stone method, have the problem of the angle changing a little each stroke. With the constant contact way, that problem of keeping the angle steady is gone. This is the way we did it in the boy scouts in the 1950's. It will work. To finish up, strop the blade on the back of your belt.

If you haven't oiled your stone yet, don't. Use it dry.

If you can learn to sharpen free hand, you'll be able to touch up your knife on just about any coffee mug bottom, brick, top of car window, anywhere, at any time. You won't need a gadget to lean on.
 
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I think jackknife is right...the circular technique should do the trick rather than slicing into the stone if you want surefire results...it worked for me before :thumbup: (I wonder why they don't teach the circular method anymore? I see these in old texts like Jaeger's Wildwood Wisdom and it certainly works better. I wonder if I simply continually reshape the edge due to inconsistent angles when I use the "slicing into" method).
 
Max, I have two pieces of advice for you:

1) Read, and re-read, what jackknife has posted - the man speaks the truth.

2) Whatever you do, stay away from the "Maintenance, Tinkering & Embellishment" sub-forum!!! Those boys will have you obsessing over everything -- the minutest angles, xxx grit stone vs xxy grit, thinking you need to be able to see your face in the mirror polish that you have to put on the edge bevel, and that merely shaving your arm hair isn't good enough - you need to be able to split the hair or even whittle hairs.

P.S. #2 above is slightly "tongue in cheek" - you can learn a lot over there, but it's awful easy to go "obsessive/compulsive" and lose sight of what you really need - a sharp knife that will perform the tasks you need it to perform. If you want to make knife sharpening into a separate hobby, then by all means head over to the Maint. sub-forum. If you want a sharp knife with little fuss and bother, re-read jackknife's post.
 
agree with jackknife said...

i use 1500grit sandpaper and free hand sharpening at about 20degree... and strop on green compund..

just take a couple of minutes with satifaction result...
 
jackknife, man, thanks for advice, and thanks everyone else as well for the support.

OK, here is the deal. My professor has good experience in sharpening. He has few sharpening tools at home. He said he is sharpen that baby 2morow. If it doesn't work, I will try your method.
 
Yes sir. I haven't tried it yet.

I am giving it to my professor, he got some sharpening equipment in his garage. He usually sharpens some worthless lab equipment. If that doesn't work then, I will give it a go tomorrow.

Sorry but you guys have to wait 24 hours for results :D

Jack, again, I really appreciate you constructive posts and appreciate your urge to help me.
 
[Forgive me if this is obvious]

Learning to sharpen takes a constant self-reminder of #1 concentration and #2 patience.

I remember when I was trying to teach myself how to sharpen freehand, that the most important thing to remember -was to pay close attention to what I was doing.

I found that the tedious and repetitive motions involved in freehand sharpening caused me to daydream a little and not pay close attention to the effects of what I was doing. I wasn't really learning anything. Once I started to pay close attention to everything and I analyzed all the effects of my actions I began to really understand what worked and what did not.

Once you get it down, you wont have to pay such close attention to achieve decent results.

100% concentration and a good dose of patience is my 2 cents.
 
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Give it a go maximus - sounds like u have nothing to lose but could learn this skill & youwill feel more confident in the future.

Also , Ive seen some peoples ideas of sharpening equipment , no way I'd trust my edges to that - could easily make the edge worse!
 
When you sharpen on that stone, hold the knife in chopping position like youre going to cut the stone in half. Go halfway between that and the stone (angle wise) then another half, then go an 1/8 between that. If you get what i mean... that will bring you to around where youll be sharpening. You want it to be 15* each side, so if youre good with angles then you should be fine. Also, you want to produce a burr. Feel for a burr by rubbing the opposite side of the knife that you sharpened on your fingernail, have the edge facing away from you and slide the edge up your fingernail at about the same angle you sharpened with, it will scrap nail off. You want to the sharpen the other side and feel for a burr again, then knock that burr off. Lightly let the blade slide against the stone and you want no burr this time, Keep knocking it off. What it does is, if you imagine your head, a curl forms on the edge, so the edge isnt even on both sides. When you knock the burr off, the edge is even on both sides. Vic's are easy but hard to sharpen. Easy because the steel is soft, but hard because the burr is hard to knock off. You'll get it. You can try knocking the burr off with cardboard. It's rough enough, i've done this before, but usually use my stones.

Edit: Just read what jackknife has said, and he pretty much said the same thing as me lol, maybe i should read all the posts before posting! Good luck, you'll need to learn to sharpen at some point, so try it out on a kitchen knife or something.
 
Max, another spooky thing added to Jack's advise - listen to the sound of blade on stone - after lots of practice you can hear if you have the right angle - I like the ezlap extrafine folding hone,,,
Peace
Revvie
 
Go out and buy Spyderco Sharpmaker!!!! It´s a very good and very easy sharpening system that will give your knives a good and very sharp edges. Ok, it´s a bit pricey but it will do wonders för your kitchen knives for years to come. It´s a joy to cut onions and tomatoes with a scary sharp knife. And it will fix your SAK in no time.

I reasoned just like you and bought small and cheap roll-sharpener, but they don´t really work. Trust me on this one.
 
I got a DMT DuoSharp and spent about an hour and a half freehand sharpening my SwissChamp, Spartan, and Manager. All five blades are paper-cutting sharp now.

Highly recommend DMT products.
 
I would recommend buying a Lansky system from SAKs. I have the deluxe one, but the standard three stone one is perfect for SAKs. With the Lansky, you can't go wrong!
 
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