O1 vs. D2

T

tristram

Joined
Dec 5, 2004
Messages
537
I'm confused. D2 has 1.5% carbon, O1 less than one... but it's the latter that sounds like a high-carbon steel by its qualities. Seems to cost a bit more as well. I know there's other elements influencing edge retention, corrosion etc., but to such a degree as to turn the usual rule of thumb about carbon content on its head?
Have been trying to decide about materials for a custom knife and went for the qualities that turned out to be those of the old O1, well known from my Randall. Which is fine... only then I find I've decided against what turns out to be D2, and yet that has lots more carbon?
Searching the two is no use since the terms are suppressed.
Hope this isn't too much out of place here.
Thanks for helping.:confused:
 
I think its everything else in the steel. I could bake a cake that was 1.5% carbon, but you wouldnt want to cut a 2X4 with it.

Some metal experts will surely chime in here. I am just being a PITA :)
 
tristram:

I don't understand what you're asking? All tool steels have advantages and disadvantages. D2 is definitely a tougher steel and will hold an edge longer than 01. Much harder material to work with though (miserable to machine). Much harder to sharpen by hand too- a belt grinder helps a lot here.

George
 
The only reason that 0-1 us a little higher, is that most suppliers sell it precision flat ground. This cost quite a bit to have done. D-2 is a tougher, stronger, harder steel. Harder to work as well. O-1 grinds like butter. It takes a beautiful mirror finish as well. Not many can mirror finish D-2. Mabe 3 or four makers in the world. Mike
 
D-2 is industrial die steel. Its main use in industry is making stamping dies to shape metal parts and shear metal parts, This can be any where from small shop operations with small presses to Huge Niagara type presses,as big as a house. Using many tons of force. Abrasion resistance, and toughness is the required game here. O-1 cannot withstand this kind of abuse. The frame of you truck was more than likely formed and stamped in D-2 dies. This is mega stress. Thousands of times. It must hold damage from abrasion stress, impact, shear force, and cracking to a minimum to be viable for this use. It has been one of the very best for many years. A deer is no match for it. O-1 is a much simpler, tool steel. The version sold by Sterrett is is an improvement, with vanadium added for strength. Its a very good steel. Many of us, myself included started with it. D-2 on the other hand is a great steel. but more costly, both in steel and in belts, drill bits, saw blades, and much more demanding of the maker. No one would use it if it wasn't a better steel, considering all the trouble. Mike
 
TikTock said:
I think its everything else in the steel. I could bake a cake that was 1.5% carbon, but you wouldnt want to cut a 2X4 with it.

Some metal experts will surely chime in here. I am just being a PITA :)
Click to expand...

:p :p :D :D

:thumbup:

ROFL!
 
Just my .02:

O1: Sharpens easily, produces a sharp fine edge, decent edge retention (better than most production knives in better steels when hardened to the application), but rusts easily.

D2: Harder to sharpen, edge will get sharp, but the edge quality is different from O1 in that it can be described as "toothy," excellent edge retention (better than O1 and close to S30V) and semi-stainless.
 
D2 may be a high wear resistant steel, take on a higher hardness then O1 but depending on what the knife is used for, one or the other is better. The people I sell to, would rather their knife bend then break in a survival or extreme use situation. IMO, O1 would be the better of the two for this. If you want a steel for pure cutting and long edge holding ability, D2 would be the choice.
Scott
 
Different steels for different jobs.O-1 is easy to work,heat treat,polish and sharpen.D-2 is hard,tough,very wear resistant,and nearly stainless.The old adage about D-2 is that it takes a poor edge and keeps it forever.This is not entirely true,but D-2 is a more challenging steel to work in.It requires a controlled HT that can't be done in a simple setup.
New makers should consider O-1 the preferred starting steel.
Stacy
 
To start off, I will admit to prejudice on my syeels. D2 is my favorite and my standby everyday steel. This is because I came to it for hunting, utility and so on knives. D2 is harder to work etc, and does not have the impact strength that O1 does. I polish D2 edges and they get shaving sharp-I have shaved my face with a D2 warncliffe blade. The large amounts of carbides will tend to be toothier if you don't go really fine with the edge. The polished edge will get toothier as it wears, which helps it keep on cutting.

For bowies and larger camp knives, I personally like A2 better than O1. The impact resistance is similar, but the A2 holds a better edge, IMHO. Even here in the desert, O1 will rust just sitting there, while A2 will hold out a little better.

I like S30V also, but due to the extra cost and difficulty grinding and heat treating, I only use it for special orders and wild hairs.
 
O-1 is used for dies too. Also, every steel marking stamp I've ever seen was made from O-1 as well as most other tools. Tough stuff, I like it alot.
 
Thanks for all the input, folks,
especially flatgrinder's post has helped to clear up my confusion a bit, which was produced by erroneous statements of my custom maker. It was the fine edge combined with the rust problem that gave me the impression that O1 would be in line with my high-carbon experiences. But of course, there's more than one dimension to steels, simply lining them up by C-content doesn't say it all.
I'm impressed with the wide range of views and by so many experts favoring D2. After all, look at the cost of my Randall in O1, compared to my Kershaw Outcast in D2. But the survival arguments explain that.
Anyway, the problem's solved: as in most cases of lingering doubt, if I can't solve it by taking both options, I go to a higher level and settle on a better option; so I solved my custom conundrum by eschewing the choice between O1 and D2, and went for a Damascus steel instead - more beautiful, more tungsten (wolfram), and easily hardened to 62 Rockwell - that should overcome all my worries about the comparative advantages of D2 and O1!
gratefully,
t.
 
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