off topic but need suggestions

D

dkulze

Joined
Dec 30, 2007
Messages
127
From the same folks I got a bunch of knives from, I just got two vintage/antique pistols. Anyone know a good forum to find out about these guns? Kinda the handgun equivalent to this forum.

Thanks,
Dietrich
 
Let’s see if we can find the right forum …
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Thanks Mike,

Here are pics. The little gun is a 22 and the bigger is a 32 (pretty sure).

dk
 

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The H&R was a mass-produced inexpensive top break made in the late 1880's on. A good clean example will fetch $125-150. These also where one of the guns that earned the nickname "Suicide Specials" because of their low cost. The other may be a Hopkins and Allen made for a chain store, again not much value.

When Dad and I had the shop open we would collect these and every so often dump them at a gun buy back for cash or gift certificates. They normally are not safe to shoot and this way we got something for them and knew they would be proper disposed of.
 
The barrel and other markings on your pistols are serious and definitive clues as to who made them. If you have one not identified yet, tell us what the markings say. The nickname "Suicide Special" was a propaganda move by Colt and S&W, one of the few times in history they moved in accord. [The days of Randolph Hearst and his newspapers that would editorialize against anyone for whoever paid them to (hmmm, not much has changed there).] Those $2 to $4 pistols (along with the spur pistols and the Bulldogs) were a real economic threat to the guys trying to sell overpriced $12 to $20 pistols. Needless to say those little things were a lot more common with the working poor than were the obsolete, but more expensive, Colts and the S&Ws. Quite a few of the little things in the Old West too, John Wayne and Hollywood to the contrary. Go to the NRA museum and in the Indian Wars exhibit is a much more expensive, burst Colt which probably killed the soldier using it, since it was recovered from a battle site. The assumption of lack of safety in the old pocket pistols is in my opinion wholly unwarranted and more based on propaganda and myth rather than serious testing. I have several period pocket pistols ranging from Patriot spur triggers to various Bulldog types which I have fired dozens of times (ammo supply is an issue with the .32 rimfire) with no problems. Most of them (assuming good condition) are as safe as the period Colt and S&W pistols.
 
The little pocket pistol (barrel markings are "new Baby 1911 model") is very well built and has seen a fair amount of use (and abuse). I wouldn't hesitate to fire it as it is very well cast, fully symetrical, and the metal is very consistant. The fold down trigger is kinda cool too. The K handle stamp I'm assuming is the brand. Would love any info on it.

dk
 
Found out what the small pistol is. It's a Kolb Baby Hammerless made in 1911. Baby hammerless guns were apparently popular from the late 1880s through the 19teens and made by lots of folks. In Europe, they called them "bicycle" guns because they were popular to be carried by bicyclists to shoot dogs that were chasing you.

A well made little gun.

dk
 
All the H&Rs (and Iver Johnsons) I remember seeing from that era were all non shooters. Even when they were new they never seemed to lockup properly from what I remember. Would never try to shoot any of the ones that I had remember seeing. Many times I remember the nickel plating was flaking off and the cylinders were very thin and/or the barrels didn't appear to be drilled/reamed concentric with the outside of the barrel. Overall I considered them to be of very poor quality. Of course simply because I never saw one of good quality doesn't mean that there weren't some decent ones. I just don't ever remember seeing one and we had quite a few pass through the gun store that I worked at. Also, I thought that they were called bicycle pistols because I thought that those companies got their start making bicycles. I could be wrong though, its been a while.

Don't ever remember seeing a Kolb so I cannot comment on them.

KR
 
The H&R I had (passed on now) was excellent quality. Solid build, top latch was well made and with tight tollerance, and barrel was clean and concentric.

Hadn't heard that version of "bicycle " gun but it would make sense also. Alot of those little spur guns look kinda scary but that little Kolb is realy pretty nice.

I wouldn't hesitate to shoot either of these guns, and I was raised around gun safety. The person who aquired the little Kolb from me is going to get some new screws milled and, if it cleans up the action, we're going plinking.

dk
 
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