Old Nicholson files for knives?

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theberzh

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Aug 9, 2008
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Has anyone ever used an old Nicholson file to make a knife out of? What kind of steel is it? What is a recommended heat treatment process / normalizing / austenizing / hardening / tempering temperature? What is a recommended quenching medium?
I discovered about 100+ old files in my dad’s basement that my uncle gave my dad back in the 80s. They were probably from the 70s and 80s. That’s really about all the information I have on them. Is there any other way to tell what the composite of the steel is?
 
welcome theberzh,
You may get the prize for the longest time between joining and your first post. Fill out your profile so we know where you live, your age, and a bit about you. It helps with better answers.

There is no way to know what exact metal the files are. If tey are all 50 years old it is likely that they are suitable steel for a knife. You will have to test a few to see. The general alloy will usually be something akin to W2 or 1095. But, some files and rasps are case hardened low carbon steel and won't work for knives.
Do two tests to see what you have. First, stick an inch or so of end with teeth in a vise and pull hard on the other end. Wear glove and eye protection. It should snap cleanly and not bend any at all. The break should all look the same color and have a fine frosty grain. If it is different at the outer edges than the middle it is case hardened. Second test on the same file is to heat the whole file to non-magnetic with a torch and let it cool slowly. Then heat to non-magnetic again and quench in a gallon of 120-130°F water. It should not bend any at all, but should snap like glass when the bend test is done, and the grain should all look fine and frosty. If that is the case, you can use the knives for knife steel and heat treat it like it was W2 or 1095.
The stickys at the top of the page have info on making a knife from a file.

However, files are worth far more than steel. You may want to keep them as files and use known knife steel. You could even trade some for steel to a local knifemaker or blacksmith.
 
I got this and read it a few months ago. It will answer most if not all those questions. It will answer questions that won't be in your head until tomorrow, next week, and next month. Knife Engineering: Steel, Heat Treating, and Geometry
I got mine on amazon for maybe $35.
 
SwissHeritageCo said:
What kind of shape are they in? That's a lot of files.
Click to expand...
They are mostly in very excellent shape. Not much rust and it just comes off with the wire wheel. I even polished up about 30 of them to use for my regular every day files and then gave them a coat of wd40.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
welcome theberzh,
You may get the prize for the longest time between joining and your first post. Fill out your profile so we know where you live, your age, and a bit about you. It helps with better answers.

There is no way to know what exact metal the files are. If tey are all 50 years old it is likely that they are suitable steel for a knife. You will have to test a few to see. The general alloy will usually be something akin to W2 or 1095. But, some files and rasps are case hardened low carbon steel and won't work for knives.
Do two tests to see what you have. First, stick an inch or so of end with teeth in a vise and pull hard on the other end. Wear glove and eye protection. It should snap cleanly and not bend any at all. The break should all look the same color and have a fine frosty grain. If it is different at the outer edges than the middle it is case hardened. Second test on the same file is to heat the whole file to non-magnetic with a torch and let it cool slowly. Then heat to non-magnetic again and quench in a gallon of 120-130°F water. It should not bend any at all, but should snap like glass when the bend test is done, and the grain should all look fine and frosty. If that is the case, you can use the knives for knife steel and heat treat it like it was W2 or 1095.
The stickys at the top of the page have info on making a knife from a file.

However, files are worth far more than steel. You may want to keep them as files and use known knife steel. You could even trade some for steel to a local knifemaker or blacksmith.
Click to expand...

I signed up with a lot of forums for things I was interested in years ago and now I'm starting to get back into them again. Will I get a gold metal for winning the longest time for first post competition? haha.

All kidding aside...
I did the snap test and it snapped and it all solid with the grains. looking nice and uniform. I ended up getting one of those Devil Forge kilns and heating it up glowing red, however I didn't have a magnet around to do a magnet test. I let it cool down and the metal actually bends now. I then shaped one into a knife shape on a grinding wheel and then heated it back up cherry red and then dipped it back into the water to cool it. It was room temperature water. The file was bent when I took it out and actually cracked a few minutes after I took it out. I tried to bend it too and it snapped like a gram cracker.

Thanks for the advice. I'll have a look at that 'making a knife from a file' info. I'm very new at this and could use all the help I can get.
 
GRapp said:
I got this and read it a few months ago. It will answer most if not all those questions. It will answer questions that won't be in your head until tomorrow, next week, and next month. Knife Engineering: Steel, Heat Treating, and Geometry
I got mine on amazon for maybe $35.
Click to expand...
I've heard of this book. I'm considering it. I'm very new at this and am not sure I would understand everything going on yet. I usually have to get my feet wet and then really dive into it.
 
Ive got spec tests from 4-5 files and they were all within a fraction of a fraction of each other... That's not to say that they all will but I can tell you as late as 10 years ago Nicholson engineer told me they still used the same steel they had been using for 25+ years before that.. Again take that for what its worth.. Heres some of the results...
Nicholson: C:1.28 | Mn:0.34 | P: 0.016 | S:0.015 | Si:0.15 | Cu: 0.02 | Cr:0.14 | Mo:0.005 | Ni: 0.02 | Sn: 0.002 | V: - | Nb: -
Heller: C:1.20 | Mn:0.25 | P:0.010 | S:0.020 | Si:0.12 | Cu:0.04 | Cr:0.03 | Mo: 0.004 | Ni:0.03 | Sn:0.018 | V: 0.005 | Nb: -
 
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