Ontario RAT vs. Swamp Rat... Worth the extra money?

A

Alberto Salas

Joined
Jan 30, 2003
Messages
268
I'm hunting for a hicking-camping knife, something strong but compact, and I was almost sold on the Ontario TAK.

But I'm starting to consider the SwampRat Howling Rat LM. Is a gooooood looking knife! But a lot more expensive! The TAK is about $80 and the HR is about $130.

The million dollar question is: Is worth the money? Should I save my hard earned cash and toss it in the HR instead the TAK?

What the experts say?



BETO
====================
Sorry for my english :o
 
The SR is probably better at the extremes of performance, but not $50.00 worth IMO.
 
Get the HRLM.

Excellent knife, it's the right size utility knife.
Very user friendly.
It's worth the money :thumbup: :thumbup:
 
I've never handled the Swamp Rat but I have the TAK-1. I really like the feel of the TAK-1 in the hand...very good ergonomics. But looking at pictures of the Swamp Rat I can see that the handle looks super nice.... I like the pins and the scale material (is that Micarta?).

One thing about Ontario's RAT and TAK series.... I've seen alot of variance in attention to detail in blade grinding. Almost every fized blade knife I have has some minor flaw in the grinding (less so with BM's knives), but I've seen several Ontario RATs and at least two TAKs where the blade is ground off center. If you look down the spine of the blade from the scales, you can often see a major grind error from one side to the next going out to the tip.

This may not bother anyone, but if you try to re-bevel the edge, you could end up doing some pretty hard labor. Another thing is, Ontario doesn't always keep the same sweep in their grind from the belly to the tip. The distance from the spine to the edge must stay the same as the sweep continues to the tip, otherwise, you'll have problems if you re-bevel. I don;t know if this makes sense or not, but I can;t figure out how to explain it any better than that.
 
wetdog1911 said:
When you may (never, hopefully), need the extremes of performance, that $50 may be money well spent.

Rob
Click to expand...

And there are likely scores of knives out there that are $50.00 or more "better" than the SR. Diminishing returns and all that. $50.00 buys pretty good insurance in the form of another fixed blade or a pretty decent folder.
 
Alberto,

I've been debating the same contrast (maybe we will be competing for the last stock of LMs?). I've also added the Fallkniven F1 to this list - which in its most basic form could be had for as low as $78 USD. The F1 has probably as closed to a following as RAT-3 and SRKW-LM. Personally - I'm leaning for the LM (especially given the fact that it may not be available in the near future) and will likely save up for the F1. Good luck on your decision making - its a toughy! BTW - SRKW-LM doesn't come with a sheath - and SRKW is out of stock for their sheaths - thus price point gets a bit higher if you consider a custom sheath.
 
also consider the resell value, the howlers don't really drop in price at all.

Go for the HRLM but expect to pay more because you need to get a sheath.
 
I've handled a TAC and have a RAT 7. Good knives and will likely do anything you need them to do. On the other hand, I also own Swamp Rat. Their fit, finish and quality is better. Either will likely serve you well.

One other thing to consider. The HR is $ 50.00 more, without a sheath. While I belive the cost of a TAC comes with a sheath.

Good luck with your choice.
 
I have the F1, TAK and HR, and vote for the HR.:D
HR has a better balance for me and the handle is more comfortable.
 
with swamp rat, if you break it (which you probally never will) they fix it no questions asked, if you dont like it you can sell it for the same amount you paid (if not more). i would say spend the extra money and get a rat but that is just me.
 
Thanks for the help guys!
A lot of usefull information :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

The price of the sheath is something to consider, but I want a kydex sheath for the TAK anyway, so the cost will be added to the both knives.

The resale value is a big plus for the HR, I didn't think about it.

Speaking only about the knives, both are thick and stout, no problem here. But which one will cut better?


BETO

====================
Sorry for my english :o
 
Alberto Salas said:
But which one will cut better?
Click to expand...
The only way to answer that question is with another question - "What are you cutting?"

Swamp Rat knives tend to come with thick stocks (at least in my experience). Thick edge angles mean a lot of strength behind the edge, but you sacrifice slicing ability. I've thinned my Gen II Howling Rat edge so it's a better slicer, but at a risk of greater edge deformation on severe impacts. To me, it's a fair trade off as the Howling Rat isn't a big enough blade to use as a heavy chopping blade. I carry mine for EDC, camping, and hiking.

Another thing to consider is that the Rat 7 is a longer blade than the Howling Rat, which is 4" total (not counting choil). Again, depending on what you intend to use it for if you are looking for those extra 3 inches you may want to consider the Mini Uncle Mojo or Mini Mojo which are over the 6¾" length.

Swamp Rat carries the same lifetime replacement guarantee that all Busse blades do (fixing everything but the most blatant abuse); and produce much smaller supplies so the quality is improved (they heat treat their knives so that you get the most out of any steel they use). If you have looked at the Rat-7 in D2, it's widely documented that D2 may not make the best large blade choice as it's a steel that is much better for a slicing edge.

Probably the only bad thing about Swamp Rat is that it's the gateway drug to INFI. INFI = $$$

It wouldn't be fair to not point out that Swamp Rat also occasionally receives complaints about grinds on new knives as well (there is a recent thread about one such complaint in the Swamp Rat forum under Manufacturers). Their no-questions asked replacement policy guarantees that you'll be happy with what you buy - no matter what. I've ordered several Busse/Swamp Rat knives in the past year-and-a-half and while I've had some edges that are thicker than I would like (which is easily fixed), I've personally never run into any problems with grinds.

I am sorry my opinion is so one-sided...I've looked at the Ontario RTAK series but for some reason I just keep going back to Busse...so in my estimation, YES it's worth the extra money.

Good luck with your decision! :thumbup: :D
 
I've had the TAK-1 for a while now, it's a solid knife and well worth the money. Until today I was not qualified to answer this question, but I received my Howling Rat today and upon first inspection I have to say that yes, it is worth the extra $. The overall design is a bit more refined. The balance in hand just feels right. A slightly deeper choil and a small cutout for my thumb on the spine for intricate chores is thoughtful. My HR weights 8.9 oz vs the TAK at 10.3 oz. The TAK is a lot heavier than it needs to be IMO....HR hits the sweet spot for a four inch blade. How will they compare in real woods tests? I am looking forward to finding out, heck, that's why I bought the HR! The TAK can take a beating, 1095 is great stuff, if I never got the HR I would be perfectly satisfied with the TAK-1..... but if you can spare the bucks get the HR. I can't see how you would be disappointed.
 
I will only give you this one warning. For many, buying a Busse knife is like taking that first hit of cocaine, some will become immediately addicted, others will think they are immune to it, only to succomb later on, and become Infi addicts eventually as well. Should you opt for the Swamp Rat, you can expect the reaction when you get it in your hand and use it for the first time to have the same effect as that first line would. Just like the drug, Infi will make you go broke trying to get fix after fix, alll the while your addiction will continue to grow. You will end up lying to your mom/wife/girlfriend about where the money is going, you will lose countless hours of sleep waiting for the next big ganzaa internet sale, you will find yourself pining for a woman you've never met, who seems to totally control your destiny, and who herself is addicted to clark bars and coors light. You will develop a distinct preference for single malt scotch and good cigars.

You have been warned. Now hurry up and order that Swamp Rat before they run out!!!!
 
My Opinion. The sheath that comes with the TAK-1 is JUNK. You will have to buy another one for that knife also. The company that I got mine from advertised an on scene kydex sheath ($25 extra) because they admitted the factory sheath was "not very good".
Ron Athay
 
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