OT: court stops do-not-call list

firkin

firkin

Joined
Jan 26, 2002
Messages
2,737
Y'all didn't think something that makes as much sense as this would be as easy as it sounded, did you?

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A federal court has blocked the national "do not call" list that would have allowed consumers to stop most unwanted telephone sales, one week before the much anticipated measure was due to take effect.

The U.S. District Court in Oklahoma City said the Federal Trade Commission overstepped its authority when it set up the popular anti-telemarketing measure, according to a court decision filed late on Tuesday...

...In its decision, the court said existing laws give the FTC authority to curb abusive telemarketing practices, but that any national do-not-call list must be handled by the Federal Communications Commission.

Several telemarketing firms and the Direct Marketing Association sued to block the measure in January, saying it would violate free-speech laws and discriminate against an industry that provides millions of jobs....

...Muris did not say whether the FTC would appeal the decision or turn over the list to the FCC. An FCC spokesman did not return several calls...

...The DMA welcomed the decision and said consumers could sign up for its own, voluntary do-not-call list...

..."I suspect the courthouse in Oklahoma would want to add itself to the 'Do Not Call' database in order to protect itself from the millions of consumers who feel deeply about the right to be left alone by telemarketers," Rep. Ed Markey said...

...At least 27 U.S. states have do-not-call lists of their own, which were not affected by the court's ruling...
 
Court Clerk - Robert D Dennis. 200 NW 4th Street Room 1210 Oklahoma City OK 73102. Main Number: (405)609-5000 Fax: (405)609-5099

Give 'em a call.:D

Steve
 
OK - the premise here is a good one. The executive branch can't take legislative powers unless Congress says so.

(edit - I haven't read the decision, just the news reports, and I'm not a lawyer. So this may be a bit off. However, I think that the list will still happen. When was the last time the American public got behind something so emphatically? I also think it will be resolved before the end of the year.)

Congress just forgot to explicitly say "we give you the authority to handle this do not call list"

I'll bet a khuk that they correct that slight error ASAP. No matter how much a telemarketing lobbyist paid you, would you want to be the one who said NO to something that millions of Americans have already signed up for? Talk about political suicide!!!!
 
FTC and FCC already have authority, I think.

Sounds to me more like bickering over whether telemarketing is trade or communication. Since there isn't a "trade and communication" commission (No, please don't form one!!) the inflexible dopes are in a self-induced conundrum, and the lawyers are having a field day.

I'll bet a khuk that if the FCC had generated the list, there would have been a suit challenging their authority, and somebody would say the the FTC should have the list.

Which federal agency have the list, isn't the issue--stopping or slowing down the implemetation is.
 
I wonder if these companies that sued realize that the people who signed up for this thing are not ones who are going to be responsive to telemarketing in the first place. Actually, it's saving them money in wasted phone calls...

Edited to add: Posting from the computer store! They have sample machines here with internet connections! :D
 
Well, Tohatchi's prediction was right on...

http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=15200393

House Quickly Passes Do-Not-Call Bill
Sept. 25, 2003

The 412-8 vote came one day after a federal judge ruled that the Federal Trade Commission lacked the authority to create and operate the anti-telemarketing register.
By David Ho, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The House approved legislation Thursday aimed at ensuring the national "do-not-call" list goes into effect as scheduled next week so consumers can block many unwanted telemarketing sales pitches.

The House voted 412-8 after less than hour of debate. Lawmakers from both parties uniformly blasted a decision by U.S. District Judge Lee R. West, who ruled Tuesday that the Federal Trade Commission lacked authority to create and operate the registry.

"The judge in this case is dead wrong and I'm sure his decision will in turn be overturned," said Rep. Billy Tauzin, R-La., chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee. "We should probably call the bill 'This Time We Really Mean It Act' to cure any myopia in the judicial branch. The bill leaves no doubt as to the intent of Congress."

The bill says the FTC may operate the list, which was approved by Congress earlier this year and is scheduled to take effect Wednesday. The Senate was expected to pass similar legislation Thursday.

If the bill passes both chambers and is signed into law by President Bush, that does not automatically nullify the court order. West, the Oklahoma City judge, must still dismiss the case brought by telemarketers in order for the list to move ahead...

...West ruled late Tuesday that the Federal Communications Commission, not the FTC, has the authority to oversee a national do-not-call registry.

West said recently adopted rules that allowed the FTC to create such a list were invalid. But he did not issue an order directing the FTC to stop the list.

Man, did they ever move this fast?? Question is is the judge gonna be dumb enough to try and fight this battle?

In any case, the Direct-Marketing Association has kindly provided a list of planned and existing state do-not-call lists on their website. These are unaffected by the recent ruling.:)

http://www.the-dma.org/government/donotcalllists.shtml

"I wonder if these companies that sued realize that the people who signed up for this thing are not ones who are going to be responsive to telemarketing in the first place. Actually, it's savingthem money in wasted phone calls..."

Hmmm, maybe time to start the sport of telemarketeer-baiting--see how long you can keep them on the line at their expense, and then abusively gloat when they finally realize that their time has been wasted.
 
Originally posted by firkin
Hmmm, maybe time to start the sport of telemarketeer-baiting--see how long you can keep them on the line at their expense, and then abusively gloat when they finally realize that their time has been wasted.
Click to expand...

"Oh, yes, I'm very interested. Hang on just a second while I grab a pen and some paper." (Gently sets phone down on counter, walks away to play with khukuris...)
--Josh
 
39 out of 50 states have no call lists and I have to live in one of the other 11:mad: :rolleyes: Being home all day, it gets annoying the amount of calls that have to be checked. Caller ID is great, but even the Railroad shows up as out of area and so most of the time we have to answer everything. Guess I'll try the suggestion of keeping them on the line at there expense. I've also enjoyed saying I'll get whoever and then just leaving the phone laying somewhere. The late night calls are the worst!!
 
You could always provide them the unique experience of listening to your blender, vacuum cleaner, or a loud whistle. It is hard to get any satisfaction from the recorded message variety though.
 
Ask the SOB or DOB's what their phone number is so you can call them at 4:00 a.m. and see how they like it!!!!
If it's a real human calling I swear at the profusely and if they don't hang up I Slam the phone down in their ear!!!! Might not help, but sure makes me feel better.:D :rolleyes: :D :grumpy: :D
We don't get too many, but the last one was at 8:50p.m.!!!!! It was a real human, subhuman(?) and I was very satisfied when I hung up!!!!:D
 
Last update I heard was that Congress passed a new bill that satisfied the 1st blocking judge. Now some Denver judge is blocking it on FREEDOM OF SPEECH grounds.
I suggest we find his contact info and call/write/etc until he realizes that telemarketing is like dancing in traffic, it's not free expression, it's the right to annoy.
Plus, you'd think that the telemarketers would prefer to be calling people who might actually buy from them, instead of getting angry, like those on the do-not-call list!!! it's like a free list of people who aren't worth calling!
 
If any telemarketeer calls you outside of the hours 8:00 AM to 9:00 PM find out who it is and get their *ss busted--they are not allowed to call at other times.

This has been posted for the second judge:

Nottingham Edward Us District Judge

1929 Stout St
DENVER, CO 80294
303-844-5018

Maps & Directions | Did you go to school with Nottingham Edward Us District Judge?
Find More on Nottingham Edward Us District Judge

from anywho.com

Have fun!! Apparently the office of the first judge got swamped.

The thing is full of holes though--

Exempt are:

Charities
Politicians
Market Researchers - If they ask you a question about products similar to that they are selling, are they doing "research"?
Announcements of prizes won - if you listen to sales pitch.
Calling an 800 number to ask a question can trigger calls for 3 mo.

So maybe the the second judge has a point--the above are allowed to intusively exercise "free speech" while others aren't. No-call should mean no-call.

The Direct Marketing Association is now advocating that telemarketeers voluntarily respect the list. Seems there are two camps, those whole realize that hostile people aren't likely potential customers, and those whole feel sheer volume of calls made is what's important.

I guess the later must be ones that contract out to others to do telemarketing for them and the company paying for their services is stupid enough to base compensation on number of calls, not number of sales. If they want to pay for services on that basis, fine--but leave me out of it, dammit. Spend your own time going out of business, don't expect any of my time.
 
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