OT plumbing question

firkin

firkin

Joined
Jan 26, 2002
Messages
2,737
Well, the plumbing isn't really the question--it sucks, but I get a good deal renting the place.

Here's the damned thing. Hard water. There is a 3" (I think) PVC pipe that services my kitchen sink. Past the kitchen sink, it connects to another similarly sized pipe that services my upstairs neighbor's shower and bathroom sink and kitchen sink. As far as I can tell, there are the requisite number of vents, and traps, but don't know if this conforms to code.

Anyway, after all this connects to a single 3" pipe, it goes to a big pipe with a clean-out. Sometimes there is a clog in the final length of pipe, and I get my kitchen sink filling up with shower water. Gross, and can't clean or use the sink.
But there is a clean-out in the final bit of 3" pipe before the clog occurs, which I can open and at least keep the house from flooding. of course, the yucky water runs out in front of the back stoop. Less gross.

The landlord's plumbers, when they eventually arrive, run a snake through the clean-out before the big pipe, and after a long while, clear the pipe and produce some bit of crap stuck to the snake and provide a lecture about putting the wrong stuff down the sink. But at least it works for a few months.

It clogged today. I saw it long after he took the shower, the sink was full of nasty soapy shower water. Very lucky I didn't get flooded, up to the top of the sinks. I opened the clean-out. But I wanted my sink back, and the guy upstairs will take a shower tomorrow morning no matter what. So I turned the garden hose on full blast and rammed it down the clean-out. Big chunks of salt deposits started floating up. Eventually it drained again, and pretty good too. Not bad, as I don't want to smell the guy's old shower water while I cook.

Obviously the plumbers are full of crap.

Finally, at last, the question. Is there some short gizmo that I can put on the garden hose that looks like a cap with one or more small holes in so there is a powerfull water jet(s)? It can't be too long, or it won't get 'round the corners in the pipe.

Thanks.
 
There used to be an item that looked like a dog's Kong. You attached it to the end of the hose, stuck it in the drain, and when the pressure built up to the point it sealed the fixture, then the internal pressure forced open the bottom of the Kong and (hopefully) blew out the clog.

We used them for cleaning out drains on refrigerated cases in the stores.

We called it a "thunderer" but I don't know the real name, I haven't seen one offered for sale in the last few years, we bought them from True Value hardware stores.

Worked well for use until the rubber aged and the damn thing would explode.
 
firkin said:
Is there some short gizmo that I can put on the garden hose that looks like a cap with one or more small holes in so there is a powerfull water jet(s)?
Click to expand...
Brass hose cap
drill hole

experiment with sizes & angles

(look in plumbing/irrigation/refrigerator parts too
plastic caps likely work if you're careful with the drilling)

also,
You'll find at least a couple of size reducers that fit a hose
in a well stocked builder supply.

Even lower tech,
cut fitting off the end of a -cheap/thin-wall- hose
use a nylon zip-tie to reduce the end diameter.

Have I done it myself,
no,
but I have bought the hose end-caps
& I've seen the reducers
 
We called it a "thunderer" but I don't know the real name

They are marketed under that name and available at the Home Depot and most hardware stores. It is rubber attachment for your garden hose that is designed to wedge itself in your drain pipe and provide a continous blast of pressurized water. They come in different size ranges so make sure you get one appropriate for your pipe diameter.

5898473.jpg


Be careful when you use these. You are introducing pressurized water into your drainage system. Most home drainage systems are not designed for that and you can easily burst a pipe, or create a backup which will flood the entire place. These are usually helpful when clearing/testing a drain pipe after you have cleared the pipe of the main obstruction.

The only way to really clear the line once it is clogged is with a snake, and those can be expensive and dangerous. Call in the plumbers and let them work on it. If the problem is recurring too frequently, you can try using a degreaser (something like Formula 88 from the Home Depot). Just fill your sink with warm water add the stuff and pull the plug and run the warm tap for a few minutes. How often and how much depends on how frequently you and your neighbor use your garbage deposals.

n2s
 
I'm of no use, but wanted to point out there's a single action revolver called the 'thunderer' and I don't think it would sell as well if the image was linked to stopped up toilets.



munk
 
Thanks, guys!

munk, otherwise, it is a good deal, for the same price I would be living in a beehive studio apartment, and this place has a yard, and I can dig it up to and actually grow stuff that I can eat, and can walk to buy just about everything I need. Plus, I really like my next door neighbors. Overall, landlord is cool. n2s, no garbage disposals here, and I know the guy upstairs knows what that means.

Otherwise thanks very much for suggestions, ddean's is most like I'm looking for--I don't think the deposits are really stuck to the plastic pipe as hard as they would be a metal one, they did break up even with the hose. I dunno if they go the full length of the pipe, but I so far I think they are just at the entrance to the big pipe from the way things acted. I guess I'll have to look for the hose caps, I have access to a drill and bits. Just thought somebody might sell such a thing ready made--if I can think of it, somebody else should have. I could just use it every few months for prevention with no fuss or mess.

I don't want to just pressurize the thing, I want to break up or erode the salt deposits, since it seems the plumber's snakes just re-open a narrow path in the center, and so far the deposits seem pretty friable (unnlike the ones in the toilet).

I bet they didn't fair the pipe joints, so I'm leary of just pressurizing it if there is still a full-circumferance deposit of stone in it.

If I can have control of the situation for minimal effort or expendiature, I'll take it.

Thanks again!

(edited because I can't type to save a flea's life)
 
"...that services my kitchen sink. Past the kitchen sink, it connects to another similarly sized pipe that services my upstairs neighbor's shower and bathroom sink and kitchen sink."

So If I read this right, and you were to cork-off your kitchen sinks, the first place for 'his' water to go would be to overflow his shower? Not that I'm suggesting something THAT mischevious or anything :D 'Just food for thought in case he ever becomes uncool and the drains happen to clog ;)

(...as long as you release the "clean-out in the final bit of 3" pipe" before you uncork your sinks you should be fine)
 
whew......


glad to see this wasn't about your....uh.....personal plumbing, firkin....:eek: :p


:footinmou
 
Couldn't you install, or have someone install a back-flow valve between your sink and the common line? There are several designs, and most work by gravity and bouyancy. They are basically a floating ball that allows water to flow down, but seal against a gasket when they float up to it. I would think that would be a more permanent fix than having to blast out your drain line periodically, and it might also result in the scenario that BillTheCat mentioned. ;)
 
McHete, that gizmo,wouldn't do a lot of good, except if it plugged while I was gone for for a couple of days, then stuff would back-up to his shower, the prospect of which so strangely delights our feline friend. Then he'd call the plumber.

However my sink would still be unusable until the clog was removed, unless I wanted to drain to back steps. I wouldn't trust the gizmo not to leak at all, anyway--If it slowly leaked while I was gone, most of the water would still end up in my kitchen, it would just trickle in, instead of pouring in. I'd trust knowing that it's clear before I go away. Maybe as a secondary defense.

His stuff and my stuff are serviced by the same last bit of pipe before the big line, then it branches to my sink, and his stuff. I got about fifteen feet of garden hose down the last bit of 3" pipe through the clean-out. But not quite enough to where I can see it when I unscrew the access to the big pipe that takes everthing to the mains. If I can manage that, I know I'll likely be OK for a couple of years. The big chunks of salt that came out show that part of the pipe has over a 1/4 inch of salt lining it. That is better than roots, I suppose.

It would be nicer if each fixture had it's own line to the big pipe, but that's not the way they did it. I suspect that the relative levels of the pipes in the ground are screwed-up and there is always standing water right before the junction to the big pipe, so it salts out right there. They did do a good job placing the clean-outs, have to give them that.

Thanks again for all the suggestions.
 
Firkin--what about dissolving the salts with something like vinegar? Works on coffee makers, might work on your pipes as well. I don't know if there's a way to block off one end of the pipe and fill it up with cheap vinegar and let it sit for a while. I like Ddean's suggestion of the brass end cap. You should be able to find one at any hardware store or lawn and garden store.

--Josh
 
Josh, the plumber used conc. sulfuric on the deposits in toilet, and spent a long time scrubbing with a giant rubber glove that had big chunks of abrasive embedded in it. Weaker stuff that I bought didn't do jack, so I doubt vinegar would help.

It got hot. He said, don't know what you are doing and you crack the porcelain. I believe him on this one. Lots of gas can be evolved. I recall folks in the plaster-cast making room at a teaching hospital regularly blowing out their sinks this way. I'd rather not play with the stuff for this purpose, as I don't know what I am doing, and the consequences of screwing up aren't pretty.

I'll let the plumbers mess with that stuff in pipes. You want to sulfonate some aromatic hydrocarbons, then I'm probably a better bet than the plumber.
 
You know, I've been wondering what to do with my collection of aromatic hydrocarbons. Sulfonation might just be the answer ;)

--Josh
 
Firkin

Here's how you deal with the encrustations:
First, you take a Biltong Khuk, tie it to this reeeeeally long pole... If you can't chisel out the blockage, then wait until the neighbor is taking a shower and jam it up the pipe in his direction. You'll know when you succeed by the yelps.

Oh, here's a serious thought; sometimes minerals in water react to particular types of soap to form deposits. They aren't normal lime deposits and they can be pretty tenacious in the pipes. Your plumber needs to use the piercing tip to break through, then a series of larger scraping heads on the electric drain snake to clear the lines. Periodically, you need to run water through the line to clear the debris, then resume snaking it out. Perhaps your landlord should be paying for this, or maybe your neighbor will share the cost.

Stephen
 
45-70 said:
There used to be an item that looked like a dog's Kong.
Click to expand...
LOL!
An interesting Euphemism!

Perhaps a large Ball Valve under the sink would prevent flooding when away from home?
 
Stephan,

Bingo!! the stuff is mostly soap, and really won't lather at all or even hardly dissolve! God does he use stinky soap!

I left the chunks overnight to dry out for sweeping and no question is mostly soap--That is why it broke out so easy and was light enough to wash up as it did. And why it is different from the other deposits.

Landlord pays for plumbers, he has some contracted, but they do mimimal job, and nothing preventative.

Don't ask about neighbor changing soap--he is already extremely P.O.ed that he has to use a full shower curtain because the old fashioned free-standing tub that was stupidly caulked into a shower enclosure won't handle the shower spray without it. He'll say the landlord has the responsibilty to take care of whatever problems his choice of soap causes.

At this point, it is really less hassle just to get the hose down there, now that I know what the problem is. It is draining fine now, there may not be much left. No, this is not the neighbor I like.
 
SOAP!!!


Nice call, Stephen Hamiliton.


Now, the evil minds in the Cantina need to get to work to convince this "neighbor" that it is to his best advantage to change his choice of soaps.

Do any on the physicists have some thoughts on turning the PVC pipe drain from this guy's shower into a reverse "Potato Gun?" :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Little pressure chamber...maybe a propane cartridge, couple of spuds, and SURPRISE !!!


http://www.mshamash.com/spud/spudgun1.html

(edit: seems the experts think ether (car starting fluid aerosol) works all the time.)
http://platinumchromatography.com/potato.htm
justathought.


Kis
 
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