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Other Filipino Martial Arts.
- Thread starter jrf
- Start date
Welll, I think kuntawman should be here for this one as he can clear up the dumog, panantukan, pananjakman, sikaran/sipa sipa mess.
There is Yaw Yan, a kicking art based on the triangle footwork.
There is "Sari'an", a newer art meaning "to go your own way" a hybrid style I believe.
Let's remember Maphilindo Silat from Dan Inosanto, the combo of silat from Malaysia/Philippines/Indonesia
Tapado, the short staff art developed in the 1960's as well as Eskrido (Escrima and Aikido) from the Doce Pares family.
JRF, I've got a book on indigenous styles on review but some of it is suspect. You can have it if you like.
[This message has been edited by Smoke (edited 08-04-2000).]
There is Yaw Yan, a kicking art based on the triangle footwork.
There is "Sari'an", a newer art meaning "to go your own way" a hybrid style I believe.
Let's remember Maphilindo Silat from Dan Inosanto, the combo of silat from Malaysia/Philippines/Indonesia
Tapado, the short staff art developed in the 1960's as well as Eskrido (Escrima and Aikido) from the Doce Pares family.
JRF, I've got a book on indigenous styles on review but some of it is suspect. You can have it if you like.
[This message has been edited by Smoke (edited 08-04-2000).]
- Joined
- Nov 28, 1999
- Messages
- 235
in the philippines you have of course the "sayaw ng kamatayan"(yaw yan) group, which practice a full contact style of fighting. they are a complete martial art, but people know them best by there ring fighter who fight much like the muay thai, except in yaw yan, they have more techniques. in my opinion, they are proven to be the best in the philippines for empty hand fighting, you can almost call them the "pilipino gracies" they challenge and beat almost everybody. most philippine martial artist ignore them when they go abroad, but you cannot at home.
there is the PKA-kuntaw ng pilipinas, headed by carlito lanada. if you look at his older students, they seem to have more pure techniuqe than the newer (1980s and up) who look alomost exactly like shotokan, even there sayaw(dancing)"forms". his organisation is the biggest of the philippine empty hand styles. he has brought under him most of the kuntaw other styles who want to pursue opening a school or international recognition. the only problem is if you are affiliated to him he will only give you a low rank unless you are doing his style. i join this organisation when i am 18 years old, and even after i know my own style (the whole style) plus his requirments to the fourth degree i also got a low rank. i am no long supporting them. scattered you will find his members who are very good fighters, like fernando -something(cant remember his lastt name) in angeles city. and boggs lao who has a pure kuntaw style, but also does lanada style. boggs teaches two versions, one to the g.i.s the other to the pilipinos. there are other kuntaw groups like the MKA modern kuntaw association. they were part of PKA until one guy went south then he found the old style of kuntaw, all they did is revive it in rizal.
in one place i visit a school called the "philippine boxers academy" who teach and "ancient" philippine style of boxing. they wrap there hand with ropes and this is use as a weapon. the man son boxed with the philippine air force, and he brought back that style of boxing to his gym, now they combine the both of them. the only weapon they do is the knife, which they use the same way they box. they were very strong fighters, at the party the old man told me he heard the story of old philippine boxing, and since nobody knew the actual art he piece it together by himself. i say he did a good job.
i heard of stories of a few places who practice "buno" which is wrestling, but the goal is to make the guy give up from pain not really to kill him or anything. i never found out exactly where. at a few stick tournaments i met guys who practice this, but they are using japanese words and they grab the clothes. i was taught that in wrestling in the philippine arts we dont rely on the clothes to throw or hold on. i believe these guys are doing judo.
almost every arnis school i saw in the philippines uses some kind of karate, tae kwon do, or judo for there empty hands. many use "buksing", another way to say "boxing". i thing the preferred method is judo or karate.
there is not a lot of empty hand philippine arts pure around. you can still find some people who are doing silat or kuntaw, but they wont show it to you unless they like you. they think different than the people from the city, and you have to study with them longer than a short trip before they will give you anything to bring back.
as far as kinomutai, dumug, panantukan, and pananjakman, forget it. you wont find it there unless they are readers of american magazines and are expecting u.s. visitors.
i forgot, there is sikaran, which is part of most styles, then there is Sikaran the organisation. they use there feet the same way olympic TKD does, except they kick the legs (as part of an art). i have seen Sikaran the organisation but i cannot remember if they are good or not. they do not look like karate. they punch like a boxer. but very fast with the feet. there uniform is a red bell bottom pants with a tee shirt or no shirt at all. they do not use belts, they use a rope, but i think its to keep there pant up. the organisation of Sikaran also practice arnis de mano.
there is the PKA-kuntaw ng pilipinas, headed by carlito lanada. if you look at his older students, they seem to have more pure techniuqe than the newer (1980s and up) who look alomost exactly like shotokan, even there sayaw(dancing)"forms". his organisation is the biggest of the philippine empty hand styles. he has brought under him most of the kuntaw other styles who want to pursue opening a school or international recognition. the only problem is if you are affiliated to him he will only give you a low rank unless you are doing his style. i join this organisation when i am 18 years old, and even after i know my own style (the whole style) plus his requirments to the fourth degree i also got a low rank. i am no long supporting them. scattered you will find his members who are very good fighters, like fernando -something(cant remember his lastt name) in angeles city. and boggs lao who has a pure kuntaw style, but also does lanada style. boggs teaches two versions, one to the g.i.s the other to the pilipinos. there are other kuntaw groups like the MKA modern kuntaw association. they were part of PKA until one guy went south then he found the old style of kuntaw, all they did is revive it in rizal.
in one place i visit a school called the "philippine boxers academy" who teach and "ancient" philippine style of boxing. they wrap there hand with ropes and this is use as a weapon. the man son boxed with the philippine air force, and he brought back that style of boxing to his gym, now they combine the both of them. the only weapon they do is the knife, which they use the same way they box. they were very strong fighters, at the party the old man told me he heard the story of old philippine boxing, and since nobody knew the actual art he piece it together by himself. i say he did a good job.
i heard of stories of a few places who practice "buno" which is wrestling, but the goal is to make the guy give up from pain not really to kill him or anything. i never found out exactly where. at a few stick tournaments i met guys who practice this, but they are using japanese words and they grab the clothes. i was taught that in wrestling in the philippine arts we dont rely on the clothes to throw or hold on. i believe these guys are doing judo.
almost every arnis school i saw in the philippines uses some kind of karate, tae kwon do, or judo for there empty hands. many use "buksing", another way to say "boxing". i thing the preferred method is judo or karate.
there is not a lot of empty hand philippine arts pure around. you can still find some people who are doing silat or kuntaw, but they wont show it to you unless they like you. they think different than the people from the city, and you have to study with them longer than a short trip before they will give you anything to bring back.
as far as kinomutai, dumug, panantukan, and pananjakman, forget it. you wont find it there unless they are readers of american magazines and are expecting u.s. visitors.
i forgot, there is sikaran, which is part of most styles, then there is Sikaran the organisation. they use there feet the same way olympic TKD does, except they kick the legs (as part of an art). i have seen Sikaran the organisation but i cannot remember if they are good or not. they do not look like karate. they punch like a boxer. but very fast with the feet. there uniform is a red bell bottom pants with a tee shirt or no shirt at all. they do not use belts, they use a rope, but i think its to keep there pant up. the organisation of Sikaran also practice arnis de mano.
- Joined
- Nov 28, 1999
- Messages
- 235
i am sorry i forgot one of the most important of the organisation in the philippines, called bakbakan. they are like the university of the philippine martial arts. they do a lot of research, and they do everything, kickbox, ground fighting, everything. i believe that they one time were practicing a kung fu style there to but i dont remember the style.
from what i heard they have eveolve there style so much that if you are there in 1980, you will be outdated if you dont stay in 1985. i heard they started with a japanese name and then changed to a philippine name later. but there fighting is very pilipino.
there fighters are also very good, they are the rival to yaw yan.
from what i heard they have eveolve there style so much that if you are there in 1980, you will be outdated if you dont stay in 1985. i heard they started with a japanese name and then changed to a philippine name later. but there fighting is very pilipino.
there fighters are also very good, they are the rival to yaw yan.
jrf, the big discrepancy some FMA folks have about empty hand FMA arts is that, well these terms seemingly popped out of nowhere here in the US. Kuntawman really breaks this down in another forum.
Anyhow, the terms Panantukan/Pananjakman, buno tick some off for 2 reasons
1) These are more a set of techniques within one art. Not an entire independent system.
2) The terms don't actually exist in the PI (Philippine Islands for you newbies) a close word is "santukan" which usually means "to box, hit with the fist" etc.
NOT "ancient jungle art of pugilistic freedom and intent"
Also, there's a site somewhere that states that Korean arts in Korea are a changing too. Some folks combining or adding Muay Thai leg kicks to their TKD. Others taking kickboxing and adding TKD.
[This message has been edited by Smoke (edited 08-08-2000).]
Anyhow, the terms Panantukan/Pananjakman, buno tick some off for 2 reasons
1) These are more a set of techniques within one art. Not an entire independent system.
2) The terms don't actually exist in the PI (Philippine Islands for you newbies) a close word is "santukan" which usually means "to box, hit with the fist" etc.
NOT "ancient jungle art of pugilistic freedom and intent"
Also, there's a site somewhere that states that Korean arts in Korea are a changing too. Some folks combining or adding Muay Thai leg kicks to their TKD. Others taking kickboxing and adding TKD.
[This message has been edited by Smoke (edited 08-08-2000).]
The newest development is ARNIS MARHALIKHA, a new Filipino government group which will register all forms of Filipino Martial Art...then proceed to set up Olympic "Arnis"...
the term Arnis was picked because of its generic nature and the fact that its recognised around the world.. ( obviously there is no intent to say less of the terms Kali- Eskrima)
The AM group is being set up to preserve and register ALL forms of FMA and set it to record...
That means all of us can then go see a list of arts and what they teach...
who started it..
where its going...
the term Arnis was picked because of its generic nature and the fact that its recognised around the world.. ( obviously there is no intent to say less of the terms Kali- Eskrima)
The AM group is being set up to preserve and register ALL forms of FMA and set it to record...
That means all of us can then go see a list of arts and what they teach...
who started it..
where its going...
Hi, kuntawman! The kung fu style (Chinese kuntao) that is part of the Bakbakan curriculum is called Ngo Cho Kun (Five Ancestor Fist)--it's a Fukien close-quarter system, in the same family as White Crane (from which it is partly derived), and is quite powerful. Master Topher in Bakbakan has a close relationship with the Beng Kiam Association (the Ngo Cho Kun kung-fu brotherhood), along the same lines that we have a relationship w/Lameco Eskrima Int'l. Indeed, one of the top Ngo Cho Kun practicioners in the PI, Alex Co (writer of the book, FIVE ANCESTOR FIST, Tuttle Press), is himself a longtime member of Bakbakan, and a totally nice guy, on top of that... Hope that helped clear up any questions, take care...peace.
If anyone's curious about Bakbakan International, we have a website at www.bakbakan.com
so feel free to drop on by...
Recently Unique released some videos on the Bakbakan martial systems: Kali Illustrisimo, Sagasa Kickboxing, as well as videos on Ngo Cho Kun...I haven't yet seen them, but I'm guessing they're top-notch, knowing Masters Topher, Rey, and Alex. I'd be interested in hearing what you guys think...reviews, anyone?
Take care!
so feel free to drop on by...
Recently Unique released some videos on the Bakbakan martial systems: Kali Illustrisimo, Sagasa Kickboxing, as well as videos on Ngo Cho Kun...I haven't yet seen them, but I'm guessing they're top-notch, knowing Masters Topher, Rey, and Alex. I'd be interested in hearing what you guys think...reviews, anyone?
Kuntawman,
I know what you mean about being awarded a low rank in Lanada's Kuntaw. I was associated with his organization until the early 90's when several of his blackbelts were blackballed from the organization. I am one of the pre-80's practitioners who was taught the old form of Kuntaw from my instructor in Pampanga, I had to learn the new system for rank advancement. I had been with the association for more than 15 yrs and wore my second dan for 12 yrs.
Since I have been in the FMA, I have trained in Comjuka-Kenpo/Kali (GM Reston) Kalintaw (Pungong Guro Lalic) Modern arnis (Edwin Velasquez) and Kuntaw.
Bill
I know what you mean about being awarded a low rank in Lanada's Kuntaw. I was associated with his organization until the early 90's when several of his blackbelts were blackballed from the organization. I am one of the pre-80's practitioners who was taught the old form of Kuntaw from my instructor in Pampanga, I had to learn the new system for rank advancement. I had been with the association for more than 15 yrs and wore my second dan for 12 yrs.
Since I have been in the FMA, I have trained in Comjuka-Kenpo/Kali (GM Reston) Kalintaw (Pungong Guro Lalic) Modern arnis (Edwin Velasquez) and Kuntaw.
Bill