Out of my comfort zone

John M Cohea

John M Cohea

Joined
Oct 24, 2007
Messages
2,655
:eek:Which for me is frontier style knives and sheaths, but this was a true custom order where the customer supplied me with a materials list, a size, and a picture for reference. This piece was based loosely on a Case bowie by David Yellowhorse.OAL is 14", blade steel is 1095 and nickle ladder pattern damascus by Chad Nichols.Guard is 416 stainless and the handle frame is mild steel with stippling on both. Handle material is recon turquoise with red liners, and nickle silver pins and spacers.Sheath is lightly tooled and carved.
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That is a really interesting knife. Especially the handle.
I do like the shape of the blade very much.:thumbup:
 
Thanks for the comments, Keith it is recon turquoise also. It's called chinese white. I tried to to talk this customer into a different handle material, but this was what he wanted, and in the end it turned out looking nice, it's just bright like a neon sign!
 
This looks well made. :thumbup:

My take? I dislike nearly everything about it - handle material, blade material, and overall design. Turquoise is a material which is best used in moderation. As to nickel damascus, it should only be ever used on fittings, in my opinion.
 
Joss said:
This looks well made. :thumbup:

My take? I dislike nearly everything about it - handle material, blade material, and overall design. Turquoise is a material which is best used in moderation. As to nickel damascus, it should only be ever used on fittings, in my opinion.
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Stragely enough Joss, I agree with you. I'm not crazy about the all turquoise handle, not crazy about the handle shape either.As noted, all of this was the customer's choice, and this particular customer has been buying and collecting my knifes from the begining, about 10 years. On top of that ,he is one of my bosses at work, and the boss is always right, right? As far as nickle damascus,I have seen knives made by ABS mastersmiths that utilize nickle damascus for blades, or at least some nickle content. Plus this piece is destined to live in a gun safe, so it is what it is!
 
John,

It makes sense to reward people who have supported you at the beginnings.

I know some ABS MS use nickel damascus, but as far as I'm concerned this is non functionnal and therefore not appropriate for a blade.
 
It's not my thing but it still looks sweet! The hilt materials are the only things I don't go for. Kinda thick for stag but diamond pattern G-10 or a nice burl could do it.
 
John, customer stisfaction is number 1, no matter what it takes.

Paul

I guess I should add that if a customer is too much of a PITA for me.....then he only gets to be a customer one time.
 
Joss said:
John,

It makes sense to reward people who have supported you at the beginnings.

I know some ABS MS use nickel damascus, but as far as I'm concerned this is non functionnal and therefore not appropriate for a blade.
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Many or perhaps most damascus blades have nickle content (15n20/L-6).

As long as the customer is happy. :thumbup:
 
White turquoise, will wonders never cease?

The knife's not my cup of tea, but as long as the person that bought it, likes it, that's what really matters.
 
Kevin... that really isn't how it works. 15N20 is often referred to as a Nickel steel because it contains 2% nickel. It's the alloy that allows the 15N20 in pattern welded steel (usually 1084/15N20) to resist the etching process. However, it does not make any noticable change in the heat treating over its typical companion of 1084. They are both shallow hardening steels that require similar times/temps/quenchants.

Pure nickel, or nickel 200... is a different story. It is VERY corrosion resistant, but cannot be hardened. The only proven way of hardening it is by cold working. So it adds a lot of flash to damascus, but it also adds layers that are not hardened like the rest of the blade/layers.

Here's some info on Nickel 200... just in case you're interested :)

http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/Nickel200.asp

Sorry to hijack the thread :o
 
NickWheeler said:
Kevin... that really isn't how it works. 15N20 is often referred to as a Nickel steel because it contains 2% nickel. It's the alloy that allows the 15N20 in pattern welded steel (usually 1084/15N20) to resist the etching process. However, it does not make any noticable change in the heat treating over its typical companion of 1084. They are both shallow hardening steels that require similar times/temps/quenchants.

Pure nickel, or nickel 200... is a different story. It is VERY corrosion resistant, but cannot be hardened. The only proven way of hardening it is by cold working. So it adds a lot of flash to damascus, but it also adds layers that are not hardened like the rest of the blade/layers.
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Exactly. Similarly L6 is a Ni bearing alloy which is often associated with O1 because it has similar ht characteristics.
 
NickWheeler said:
Kevin... that really isn't how it works. 15N20 is often referred to as a Nickel steel because it contains 2% nickel. It's the alloy that allows the 15N20 in pattern welded steel (usually 1084/15N20) to resist the etching process. However, it does not make any noticable change in the heat treating over its typical companion of 1084. They are both shallow hardening steels that require similar times/temps/quenchants.

Pure nickel, or nickel 200... is a different story. It is VERY corrosion resistant, but cannot be hardened. The only proven way of hardening it is by cold working. So it adds a lot of flash to damascus, but it also adds layers that are not hardened like the rest of the blade/layers.

Here's some info on Nickel 200... just in case you're interested :)

http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/Nickel200.asp

Sorry to hijack the thread :o
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Yes, I'm aware of 15n20's role in creating damascus. I was assuming Chad Nichols had used 15n20 in his damascus make-up thus nickle content. After re-reading John's initial post, it seems he is referring to pure nickle being used.

If so, I see the dilemma that Joss was pointing out. The down side of using pure nickle is obvious, I assume the upside is more a defined etch/pattern for a knife that's not going to be used?

Thanks for the link Nick, we can never have too much good information here. :thumbup:
 
I did'nt relieze posting these pics would start a small debate, but here's my take. A few years back, I questioned one of the Montana mastersmiths about his use of nitre salts to blue a blade that had pure nickle content. Nitre salts have to reach a temp of around 650 degrees for the bright blue color to occur.Most blade steels temper around 400 to 425 or so. my question was about the higher temp of the salts and it's affect on the heat treat. His answer was that sometimes to achieve a desired effect, you have to sacrifice a little, and as long as the customer understands this, and you are upfront with him or her about it, it will be okay. In this case the sacrfice is a few points of hardness for a high contrast etch. The customer is aware of this and the end result is a satisfied customer, so if he is happy then so am I.If I were building this knife for me, it would have a 1095 or 5160 blade with a desert ironwood or stag handle and a wrought iron guard, but it was built to suit the customer's taste, not mine. I respect your opinion Joss and you are entitled to it, but in this case it was all about the end consumer getting what he want's to pay for.
 
we all gotta feed ourselves. If you can do it by making knives for a happy and satisfied clientele, you're doing better than a desk jockey, in my book:thumbup:
 
Good for you on working outside your comfort zone -- it will only make you a better knifemaker. :) I'm not a big fan of the stone stuff, but your craftmanship looks great and I'm sure your customer will be happy. :thumbup:
 
Good for you for working out of your comfort zone. I am glad that you made one of your customers happy. I do not care for this knife either. Thank you for sharing that with us.
 
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