Paramilitary 2 Issues

Status
Not open for further replies.
Z

zkiller195

Joined
Aug 7, 2014
Messages
143
I just got my second Paramilitary 2 yesterday in the mail, digicam scales with a black DLC blade. My first has black scales and a satin blade, and the new knife is much harder to open. When I first got it, I couldn't even flick it open at all. It would stop about 2/3 of the way even with the hardest flick. Now I've probably opened it at least 1000 times, and it's gotten much better, but it's still alot stiffer than my satin Para2; it takes more effort to open and won't close with gravity alone. I realize it will probably continue to get smoother with time, but I don't remember my satin Para2 ever being quite so stiff.

Also the compression lock on the new knife isn't smooth. When I flick it open with authority, the compression lock takes probably 3 or 4 times as many pounds of force to open than my satin Para2, and will open abruptly, like the liner is caught on the tang of the blade. When I open it more slowly, the lock takes a little less force to open (still noticeably more than my other Para2) and has a little gritty/grainy feel to it. I have yet to take it apart, but from the back of the knife, the tang doesn't look any different from my satin Para2 (besides color of course)

I may just be paranoid, or it may work itself out within a week or two, but I was just wondering if anyone else has had either of these issues (especially the second one), with a Para2 or any compression lock Spyderco or any ideas on what it could be/how to fix it.

Update: I just got done putting it back together. There was a bit of loctite on one of the washers (washer was stuck to the frame and there was powdered loctite between the washer and the blade). I also washed the blade, wiped everything down and put a drop of dri-lube on it. One of the scale screws close to the pivot screw was overly tight also, enough so that it was causing extra pressure on the frame at the pivot screw. Everything is much better now. Still not quite as smooth as my other Para, but now it feels like another quality Spyderco
 
Last edited:
I have heard before that the coated blades can take a bit more breaking in than the satin finish ones. The usual procedure is to wash the knife with hot soapy water, rinse in hot water, dry it carefully, and then lubricate it, making sure to lube the detent ball. Then use the the knife normally for a while and see if it loosens up.
 
Regarding the stiff pivot: use a Torx screwdriver to loosen it a bit.

Regarding the stiff lock: when you flick the knife open with a lot of force, the liner cutout travels further (and tighter) than it usually does, so it of course needs more force to disengage it. This will also happen if there is too much lubrication on the lock face, which will also result in it traveling further than it usually does. You can also see both of these problems in the Axis lock as well, which operates in a somewhat similar manner. This problem is alleviated by not flicking it so hard, and also by breaking it in so the lock wears in a bit more.

Regarding the effect of the coating: coated blades in folders will often be a bit stickier than their uncoated counterparts. One way to counteract this is to use a graphite pencil to coat the area on the tang where the lock engages. This will smooth out the action.
 
I'll try taking it apart and washing it tonight. Hopefully that helps with the lock
Thanks for the suggestion
 
I own three Axis lock knives (4 if you count the Manix), and 2 other compression lock knives and haven't had a problem with them (I have also handled a dozen other compression lock knives that have never done this). When I say "open with authority", I'm not talking about slamming it open as hard as you can, just flicking it open normal. When I said "opening slowly", I meant more of a thumb opening or when you flick it open and it barely makes it to lockup.
I'll try washing the blade with soapy water and lubricating it properly and hopefully that will help. Thanks for the advice
 
I have a satin and a black-coated PM2 both, and the satin opens much easier than the coated blade does.

That is just how they are. The non-coated blade has a smoother finish, therefore it opens and closes easier. It is the same way with my non-coated M390 Benchmade 710 and coated CPM-M4-bladed 710. The non-coated blade in that pair has the same characteristics, it opens and closes light-years easier than the coated one does.

So what you are seeing is normal, as is the harder-closing situation with a harder opening vs. a softer opening. As mentioned, the lock bar is engaging more deeply into the lock, which is "virgin" territory, so it sticks a little more.

Keep using it and it will get better over time, but it is what it is and what you are experiencing is normal.
 
Manix 2 doesn't count as an Axis lock, sorry. Entirely different design, mechanism, and materials. You could say they are both based off the Blackie Collins bolt lock. As far as the break in on knives, I don't break them in the day I get them. I just put the knife in my pocket and use it, over the next weeks and months it sort of breaks in on its own. I just don't see the reasoning behind sitting down and flicking a knife open and closed 1,000s of times. It's like washing your clothes and then then throwing them on the floor and kicking them around for hours before getting dressed.
The warm wash should work to smooth things out.
 
First of all, you're lucky getting a digicam DLC PM2 I cant find one any where, like stated, the coated blades generally take longer to break in, is ease of opening that big of a deal? I mean, you aren't going to be quick-drawing your knife cowboy style for a duel.. just use it and let it mature on it's own, personally, I would consider a tighter lock/opening a big pro
 
RevDevil said:
Manix 2 doesn't count as an Axis lock, sorry. Entirely different design, mechanism, and materials. You could say they are both based off the Blackie Collins bolt lock.
Click to expand...
I realize it's not an Axis lock, but mechanically they work the same way. Different materials for the springs, and a ball bearing vs a cylinder (also probably different materials) but the mechanics are the same

RevDevil said:
I just don't see the reasoning behind sitting down and flicking a knife open and closed 1,000s of times. It's like washing your clothes and then then throwing them on the floor and kicking them around for hours before getting dressed.
Click to expand...
I don't typically play with them quite so much when I get them, but I literally couldn't even flick this knife open when I got it. Super stiff and super gritty. I wanted to see if it would work itself out. Its kinda hard to EDC a knife when it will barely even open for you
 
Make sure when you wash the knife you have something to force the water out from between the scales, liners, and blade. Some folks have reported generous use of Loctite used by the assemblers as the issue that prevents the smoothness.
 
What's this? The third thread in 10 days with an issue with their PM2? Sounds like a sticky is need to explain the intricacies involved with the PM2.
 
I think sometimes people expect a new folding knife to be perfectly dialed in straight out of the box when in fact there is a break in period.
 
skyhorse said:
I think sometimes people expect a new folding knife to be perfectly dialed in straight out of the box when in fact there is a break in period.
Click to expand...

That's not it. I realize that a knife, or really almost anything that you hang on to(from guns to cars to a good pair of jeans), gets better as you break it in. I just never had any issues with my first PM2, it was excellent out of the box, and only got better. This one needed a little TLC first, and is still not to the point my other PM2 was out of the box. I've bought dozens of new Spydercos, and have never had one feel sub-par out of the box. This one did. Not that it's a sub-par knife by any stretch of the imagination; a good cleaning got it to 95% of where my other Para2 is at, and the other 5% will probably come with use.

When you buy several knives from a company and they have all been excellent right out of the box, you just come to expect it. It caught me off guard
 
zkiller195 said:
That's not it. I realize that a knife, or really almost anything that you hang on to(from guns to cars to a good pair of jeans), gets better as you break it in. I just never had any issues with my first PM2, it was excellent out of the box, and only got better. This one needed a little TLC first, and is still not to the point my other PM2 was out of the box. I've bought dozens of new Spydercos, and have never had one feel sub-par out of the box. This one did. Not that it's a sub-par knife by any stretch of the imagination; a good cleaning got it to 95% of where my other Para2 is at, and the other 5% will probably come with use.

When you buy several knives from a company and they have all been excellent right out of the box, you just come to expect it. It caught me off guard
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone is criticizing you out of the gate...I just think most people here tune their knives before they get carried. I NEVER expect a production knife to be perfect when I get it. (and none of them have been) I have a set of Wiha tools and I adjust and tune all of my knives upon receipt. (Customs included) I guess so many people are use to that, and when someone comes along that isn't use to it they are taken by surprise.
 
By no means criticizing you zkiller195, it just that sometimes people expect it to be pre broke in. If she's out of spec I'm sure Spyderco will take care of you.:):thumbup:
 
I thought about opening a thread on this (same) issue, but a quick search on <compression stuck> gave me this hit. In any case, my pm2 is brand-new and it is smooth enough: i can flick it open easily. If i open the knife slowly, the compression lock gets less jammed; if i flick the knife open with authority, the lock gets jammed deeper. In either case the liner gets jammed (it binds) and it takes some finger pinching force to disengage the lock (and then the unjamming produces a small "unjam" click sound).

Of course the jamming is caused by the friction between the liner (locking mechanism) and the tapering opening of the blade where the liner snaps into place. The binding is a mechanical natural thing, i'd say: a rectangular profile tries to get seated in a triangular opening. So the very edges of the rectangular profile get all the mechanical pressure and the binding occurs.

Question is, does everyone experience this (slight) jamming of the compression lock and the higher finger force to disengage the lock, or at least on a new PM2?

I have only this unit for testing. Maybe i should order another unit..
 
Last edited:
It helps break-in if you put a little oil on the area of the standoff where the lock binds. Pivot the blade to 90 degrees, and use an oiled Q-tip to access that area.
 
2 of my 3 pm2 needed some adjustment when it came in. Only one of them came with perfect action. The two that needed simple pivot adjustments were both loctited. This is just the fact of the matter with pm2
 
tsiloics said:
It helps break-in if you put a little oil on the area of the standoff where the lock binds. Pivot the blade to 90 degrees, and use an oiled Q-tip to access that area.
Click to expand...
You were right. My factory-new PM2 only needed some time to get broken_in. Now the lock doesn't bind anymore, everything is smooth, me likey. One can also see that it is broken_in, namely in that standoff area. There is a dark mark from the metal-metal contacting/binding. Unused knives don't have any such usage mark.
On a side note, i once disassembled the knife (it was HELL difficult, i was cooking the pm2 in hot water which hardly weakened the red loctite) and wanted to scan the blade (for a BEFORE-AFTER sharpening comparison animated GIF) but i accidentally dropped the blade, it fell on the tiled floor, made hell of an unbelievable noise jumping around. Upon inspection i noticed that the very tip had broken off :( and the edge had one large blunted spot. So that was that. Ruined my motivation, didn't make the scan of the factory blade.
Since then i managed to sharpen the blade, apex the edge, and create a new, small tip, soso pointy. I changed the SS hardware to chitanium hardware, added a chitanium backspacer, and a paracord. Most importantly i added an ever so slight sharpening choil. I mean, if the original spyderco grind were perfect, accurate, and full, right up to the guard/ricasso, perfectly so, I would not have needed a sharpening choil. In any case, i added one, and I am satisfied with my pm2 unit now.
My usage of this expensive knife is reserved for food prepping, typically indoors. It's not an EDC. For an EDC knife, i am planning to edc a keychain utility blade. I hope to get one soon. :cool:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top