Pattern Welding Pattern Instructions?

D

deker

Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
3,496
So, now that the pattern welding bug has bitten me, my transformation into knife nut is complete :D

I'm wondering if anybody has compiled a collection of instructions on how to create various patterns. Some of the basics such as twist and birdseye/raindrop I get, but my brain keeps asking for more information to absorb. I'm just hoping to be able to learn a bit from others as I spiral downward into this madness.

I stopped and grabbed some sculpy today so that I could play with pattern development in an easier to use medium that I can bake to harden in order to preserve results. My wife is gonna think I'm nuts sitting at the table playing with clay and giggling like a cross between a school girl and a mad scientist...

Any pointers to books/websites/etc?

Thanks,

-d
 
i remember seeing something,like that but i cant think where right now

OT i made that trip to frederick and just about spent way too much again $90 cocobolo
call me as i dont have your cell
 
You'll find Manfred Sachse's book, "Damascus Steel" very useful. It's expensive (about $100 usually) and can be hard to get in English, but it's loaded with pictures and great information including making the various patters for blades of the world and even gun barrels. I think Centaur Forge carries it.

Of course Hrisoulas' book, "The Pattern Welded Blade" is basic, but useful.

These two together should be a great start.
 
Deker, this isn't an answer to your question, but a suggestion. Hike your arse to one of the hammer-ins like Larry Harley's or Bowie's with a notebook in hand. You will learn enough in a weekend talking to people to give you the basics of advanced patterning to progress from there. You have to talk to people, though...don't be shy like me! :D

Much of the fancy you see is composite patterns. Ladder a twist. Weld two billets together twisted in opposite directions. Cut a twist billet down the middle, bookmatch, and re-weld.

"w" pattern is made by taking a laminar billet and repeatedly welding it edge-to-edge and compressing. W's is the basis for many advanced patterns.
You can take a w billet and twist it a little to get one pattern, mosaic it to get another through accordian cuts and another yet through tiling.

Radial patterns come from cutting a billet with a wedge shaped cutter on a press, to give you triangle cross sections. Then restack them into a rectangle and weld. Radials are for mosaics, too.

Radial a w and you get an explosion pattern.

Roll a long flattened billet up into a jellyroll and weld it. draw it out square, cut into 4 pieces and reweld into a square. Keep doing that until you get what you want, then mosaic it. many complex patterns are created by repeated drawing and "cubing."

Meanwhile, start thinking about assembling stuff for a press. You start down this path of deep sickness, you're gonna want one. :D That's what I was talking about when I said "keep a notebook by the bed for patterns."

Look at Buxton's stuff. There be advanced patterning developed through a lot of experimentation with essentially the info I've given you here. And a hellluva dedication and a lot of hard work.

Good luck, it's fun.
 
BTW, here's something simple to try:

make yourself a twist billet, tight twists. flatten it out and clean it up. forge a bevel on one end and end and then next to it just grind the bevel in without forging. Etch and see the difference. one's stars and one's barber pole. Many patterns will show different depending on the mix of grinding and forging to shape.

Be prepared to go through steel like mad. Damascus making is materials intensive, and the more complicated the pattern the more welding heats and the more steel loss.

Bowie's shop had about 300 pounds of discarded billets in it. He'd make a billet, grind into it and etch, then toss it in a corner. Most knifemakers could have made an entire career out of his scrap pile.

Once the monkey has it's fangs in you all the way, then we tell you about powder.......
 
I wasn't going to mention this but felt guilty:

JD Smith, ABS MS, had a DVD out that showed information on advanced patterning. It was around $100+.

That's all I'll say about it. :)
 
LOL.....I have that DVD/CD-ROM set, Fitzo........and Ed Caffrey's Basic video and a few more. Good info in all of them. Only problem I have with J.D.'s is he is WAY to smooth and urbane for a smith. Where are the overalls? lol:D
 
Funny story here. When I first started, I said that i wouldn't get inot damascus because it was frivolous, non-functional, a poor copy of wootz, etc, etc. Well, suffice to say that my press is sitting in crates in my garage and when I finally have a place and a 220 outlet to set it up, I will be destroying 1075 and 15n20 like a mofo!!!! ;) The strange and wonderful things I have seen that you can do with patterns and stil have a usable knife have hooked me. Monley fangs, eh?
 
I forgot all about that DVD. Pretty good, eh? What's in there?

How much time does it spend on "manipulated billet" patterns like I butchered trying to tell deker about, versus powder work?
 
I can see I opened a Pandora's box here with Fitzo. This is exactly the kind of stuff I will want to be getting and compiling into one place, I was just wondering if it had already been done (why spend time researching when I could be forge welding?! :) )

As for a press, i recently almost had one, but long story short, I don't. I did talk to Robert Eggerling at the Chesapeake knife show yesterday though and he gave me a suggestion of a scrap yard about an hour from here where I can find lots of hydraulics, and Butch has a buddy who works in another scrap yard for frame bits, and...

Since I can begin to see how deep the rabbit hole goes, I will have to make a rule that I should maybe make damascus billets to offer for sale in order to pay for the press, or something similar.

I've got some sculpy waiting for me in the living room though...I have to figure out how I'm finishing off the billet I'm working on now. I'm @ a 56 layer twist right now and want to do one or two more fun welds/manipulations before I call this one done. Then I'll see if I can try some of the stuff Fitzo just put into my head.

As for hammer-ins, I'll be making sure to get to as many as I can in the future. Again, funding will be an issue, but I'll invest in a good sleeping bag to avoid silly frivolous things like hotels and beds to sleep in :)

Keep the ideas coming, I'm taking notes! As a matter of fact, I bought a notebook on the way home so I can keep a detailed log of every billet I weld up and plan to include pictures of how each turned out with the "recipe".

-d
 
deker, Bowie (Ron Claiborne) allows folks to camp at his place at his Fall hammer-in down in Knoxville. It is Bowie who was the devil who infected me. He showed Buxton and me things at Bill's place of a long afernoon and evening that couldn't help but inspire. Bill took off and built it to a high skill. Ron Duncan and Bill built me a press and then I crapped out physically before I could really get going. if you could manage Bowie's hammer in, you will consider it time and money well spent.

Somewhere there's a "demo" Cashen did as he did a reverse-twisted viking pattern sword. It may have been patterned after Sutton Hoo, I just can't remember. Maybe mentioning this will jog someone to oput up a link.

Caswell has a thing or two to say, too, if he will. :D Look at the sword and knife on his site.
 
Check out some venetian glass and clay art books. The glass is transparent and helps you think 3D.
Clay is great. There is a book called "The New Clay" using color fast clay. It contains some very good instruction into pattern development. Hank Knickmeyer has a one page handout that he has been using at demos for years that is very rich in information. Remember where you learned your techniques and credit the guys who have gone to the time and expense to develop or recreate great past works. There is much more cool stuff to be done in mosaic than has been done; follow your passion...Take Care...Ed
 
Fitzo:

From the sound of it I just need to go to Bowie's hammer-in next year (and try to gether $$ for one of his presses before then so I can order it while I'm under the influence of inspiration :D). Hopefully Mr. Cashen and Mr. Caswell will chime in as well. The more the merrier!

Del:

I've sent you and email. Thanks for the extremely generous offer.

-d
 
Deker, when Delbert calls, hit the record button on the answering machine. Transcribe it. That may be all you need to stay busy for the next ten years or so.... :thumbup:
 
Ed Schempp said:
Check out some venetian glass and clay art books. The glass is transparent and helps you think 3D.
Clay is great. There is a book called "The New Clay" using color fast clay. It contains some very good instruction into pattern development. Hank Knickmeyer has a one page handout that he has been using at demos for years that is very rich in information. Remember where you learned your techniques and credit the guys who have gone to the time and expense to develop or recreate great past works. There is much more cool stuff to be done in mosaic than has been done; follow your passion...Take Care...Ed
Click to expand...

I never would have thought about venetian glass! Now that you mention it though, it does make a great deal of sense. So does the clay. I actually attempted to replicate my first billet in clay this evening. I have to do a little grinding to see what's under the surface and see if it matched up.

While I'm a big fan of free information, credit should always be given where credit is due. I really, really appreciate all of the information folks here on BF share, and I tell just about anybody who will listen. Since I'm taking notes, I can be sure to note who told me what.

I'd love to get into mosaics eventually, especially after getting to see some of Robert Eggerling's work at the Chesapeake show this weekend. I think I should get the "basics" down first though. Of course, that doesn't mean I can't think about it right? :)

-d
 
Well, I have a free 'tutorial' on my approach to Celtic/Migration/Viking sword forging. It's really meant to convey the steps rather than a detailed how-to, but the price is right:

http://www.caswellstudios.com/SwordPages/BodyPages/swordmakingpage.html

I believe Cashen has a worthy tutorial/discussion on Sword Forums.
Also, there is video and printed material on this particular genre available featuring Scott Lankton.
(I would again recommend Sachse's book "Damascus Steel.")

Those DVDs sound very interesting. I may have to add some to my collection. It's amazing how useful it is to see someone else tackle the same problems/challenges. One good trick (and maybe a lot more) is easily worth the price of admission.

Fitzo is right about attending hammer-ins. Take the note book and a camera. I can't tell you how many times I saw some useful tool or fixture, thinking surely I would remember the details, only to completely forget everything of relevance about it.
 
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