phase converters

samf

samf

Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
197
Iam looking at changing my grinder over to 3 phase with a converter and i would like to have control of changing the speed what all do i need
Sam Fogler
 
Hi, Sam,

I forget which grinder you have?? Does the motor connect via pulley? Do you have 220 power to the shop? How many HP do you want delivered to the grinder?

The answers will help people tell you what ya need. You will need to match the right Variable Frequency Drive (VFD) to the motor.

Hope all is well out in apple country! :)
 
fitzo said:
Hi, Sam,

I forget which grinder you have?? Does the motor connect via pulley? Do you have 220 power to the shop? How many HP do you want delivered to the grinder?

The answers will help people tell you what ya need. You will need to match the right Variable Frequency Drive (VFD) to the motor.

Hope all is well out in apple country! :)
Click to expand...

ayhup:thumbup:
A variable frequency Drive
what I use is a, FVR-C9s By FUJI for up to a 2 hp motor, you can use it for any hp under it's rated HP..
 
I have kmg and i kaven't hook it up yet.I have 11/2 hp motor and i do have 220 . out here in apple country wheather is strange this year rain snow sunshine
Sam Fogler
 
You'll like the KMG, Sam! We must have had the same storm here. :) Inch of rain Friday, snow flurries all day yesterday, sun today. Weird winter. At least you'll have some green soon. :)

I don't know much about the models of controllers, Sam, but one thing to watch out for is that some will cut your motor HP in half. Those you will want to stay away from if possible. 1.5 HP is about what I'd say should be your lower "delivered" HP.

If worse comes to worse, Google "Minarik" and call the office closest to you. They are pretty savvy.

Season's right around the corner! Go Cubs! Go Sox! :D
 
Sam, one other thing: though some may poo-poo the idea, I recommend getting a NEMA 4 enclosure with the heat sink. Keeps the grinding cooties out of the box.
 
Do an advanced search with VFD as the keyword and limit search to shoptalk. You will get more info than you can stand.

Pay particular attention to the words of member "pso" Phil knows his VFD's.
 
You can also buy one from Rob Frink, he has good prices and they are sized for use with the KMG. I've blown up 3 VFD's so far. 2 due to not having a nema 4 enclosure (my shop) and one at work due to repeated power over draw. The nice thing about the work one (a 3 phase, 460 volt model) was that it blew up on the factory rep when he was out seeing why it wsn't working for the application they sold it for. His ears were ringing for 10 minuets.

WS
 
Sam

I purchased my Varialble frequency dirve and one of my motors from these guys. http://www.dealerselectric.com/
I have the FM100-203-N1* Teco Westinghouse VFD with a remote so the drive sits on the clean side of the shop, out of the dust and metal filings.
These guys also have package deals with motors and drives. I've talked to them on various occasions and they always seemed willing to answer questions. Most VFD have a function where you can program in the horsepower of the motor if it is less than the rated hp of the controller. This allows the controller to limit the current to the motor in case something goes awry and keeps the sparks and smoke to a minimum.

I presently have a switching system for my controller and run both my grinders off it, one at a time.

Jim A.
 
DAMNENG said:
Sam

I presently have a switching system for my controller and run both my grinders off it, one at a time.

Jim A.
Click to expand...

my switching system is, both the Surface grinder and the Mill switchs are hard wired to the VFD and then I just use one or the other when I need it :)
when I get my Disk gringer done I'll just add it the same way..
yes, what Mark said there is a lot of mention on this here and there..:)
 
Hello Sam

You can either buy a VFD built into a NEMA 4 enclosure or buy one with a NEMA 1 enclosure. The NEMA 4 enclosures are sealed against dust. The Nema 1 enclosures are not. The NEMA 1 VFD's generally cost less than the NEMA 4 VFDs of the same rating. Quite a few people have mounted their NEMA 1 VFD right next to their grinders and had them blow up after a while. Please see the linked thread for an explanation of why this happens.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=392632


Rob Frink sells a NEMA 4 VFD that works well.

Dealers Electric and Drives Warehouse (www.driveswarehouse.com) sell NEMA 1 VFD's at good prices. They are all pretty much the same, regardless of brand. Many are made in the same factory. If you are going to buy a NEMA 1 VFD, then please follow my recommendations regarding setting up a remote speed pot and remote switches in the following thread where I describe what industrial VFD users do to keep their VFDs out of dirty environments. If you don't want to got to this extra trouble, then you should pay the extra for a NEMA 4 VFD and avoid having your VFD blow up.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=390368


Take care.

Phil
 
i know i am rehashing some old stuff here;however i am lost.
1: is there a vfd that can be used to run a 3phase ac motor on regular current or do you need a phase converter.
2: is it possible to set up a vfd on a single phase ac motor without killing torque/power?
3: what is the advantage of a d. c. motor?
4: what is the best way to rig up a variable speed drive to single phase ac motor if possible?
 
: is there a vfd that can be used to run a 3phase ac motor on regular current or do you need a phase converter.

Some VFDs, generally @ or below 2HP, will let you take in a single
phase @ 220V (think dryer, electric stove type of circuit, not "regular"
household 110V) and spit out 3 Phase, variable frequency (thusly,
variable RPMs) - so you can then use a 3 Phase motor.

Such VFD will set you back about $350, on average, depending on
brand name, enclosure etc. I'd always buy from a reputable source, saving
$100 here is a wrong thing to do.

2: is it possible to set up a vfd on a single phase ac motor without killing torque/power?

I don't quite get this one. Single phase motors are very inefficient, and
you can not find one with > 1.5HP. Also, due to construction, these can
not be VFD controlled . And if you try, most VFDs will shut off, sensing an
error condition (current in only one leg of 3)


3: what is the advantage of a d. c. motor?

DC has pluses and minuses. Upside: controllers are dirt cheap, compared to
VFD. DC motors of treadmill variety are very inexpensive too, something like
$50 for 2HP "rated" motor. The motors, however, are not TEFC, so one needs
to be creative when using these in grinder setting (with grit, metal dust etc).

Another upside: DC motors are typically very smooth and don't have any
resonance RPM-areas, like some of VFDs do .

Downside: brushes wear off, TEFC DC motors in decent HP are very expensive ($600) . Now, there're are BLDC motor (brushLESS DC), but controllers for those are as expensive as VFDs and that kills it .


4: what is the best way to rig up a variable speed drive to single phase ac motor if possible?

I'd abandon that idea right here and now :) You can probably get a very
decent range of SFPMs via simple pulley arrangement ,but that's as close
as you can get to "variable" RPMs with single-phase motor
 
:confused: thank you very much you cleared up most of my questions. ok now one more . if you buy a kmg variable speed grinder. how is that set up done.
is it a dc motor?
 
It's about time you blew the dust off that KMG and got it fired up Sam. Does this mean you aren't working 80 hour weeks for a change? Drop by and visit when you are in the neighborhood buddy.
 
Dan Gray said:
my switching system is, both the Surface grinder and the Mill switchs are hard wired to the VFD and then I just use one or the other when I need it :)
when I get my Disk gringer done I'll just add it the same way..
yes, what Mark said there is a lot of mention on this here and there..:)
Click to expand...

Dan

Your way will work as long as you don't have a brain fart and turn two or more on at the same time. I don't like to live quite that dangerously.

Jim A.
 
The ultimate cheapest variable speed:

Most newer makers and younger folks never saw one, but the cheapest way to made a variable speed setup is with a variable pulley. The motor is mounted on a movable track (or hinged) similar to the way the belt tension is normally kept right. There is a knob that adjusts this tension. The pulley has a rigid side and a movable side which is spring loaded. As the tension is cranked up, the pulley diameter gets smaller (the movable side moves out). I have used them on shop equipment before. They come in a variety of sizes.
They won't replace a good DC setup, but they only cost about $20-30.
Stacy
 
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