Phil Hartsfield Knives

R

revmic

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Oct 30, 1999
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There has been a discussion in the 'sales' forum regarding the hamon on Phil's pieces. A fairly serious charge has been leveled that the "visible diff. temp" line on Hartsfield's katana was achieved by bead/sand??blasting. As an admirerer of the Hartsfield line but not an "expert", I'd appreciate some input that is perhaps a little less mean spirited than some of the postings in the other forum.

Inquiring minds and and all that
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God is Soooooo good!
MC
 
from the peices I've seen it's a true temper line. As Mr. Hartsfeild keeps his method to himself I couldn't say for sure though. A friend of mine has gotten temper lines on A2 by packing the back in a heat sink so only the edge reaches critical temp during hardening. If I had to guess I think this is what Mr. Hartsfeild is doing.
 
Steve-

The only Martin blades I have seen with hamons were the first Wasabis, and they were etched. He says this on his website. I have had Martin and Hartsfield Japanese style knives and none of mine have had any form of a temper line.

-Bart
 
Larry Lunn made a long Tanto, short Wakizashi for me and attempted to do a Clay application to the blade and you can see the hamon line and shapes of the clay on the blade. It worked and it was A2 steel. Nice one, but had an emergency a few years ago and had to sell it to put a new Power Service into our house when the meter blew up on our pole! Oh well!

G2

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You can get a temper line in A-2 .A soft back and a hard edge. I am not sure how phil does his . Some one told me they were sand blasted in but I don't know. I have talked to him at different shows. very nice guy.
Cheers, Wally
 
As a owner and user of several Hartsfield knives and a sword, the hamon is not sandblasted or otherwise artificially inscripted on the blade. The blades are edged hardened (confirmed bay a rockwell test on one of my own blades). How he achieves the hamon may very well be as the other makers descibe, but it is a true hamon. I personally know Phill and have frequented his shop many time. As many of you have already stated, he is a very sincere and friendly maker, and unless he is lying, the hamons are true and the blades are edge hardened.

 
The hamon on Mr. Hartsfield's blades are created during Heat Treat, I found this out through a video that had an interview with Mr. Hartsfield.

The video is one that Larry Mcgill puts out called Mastering the Samurai Sword and has a couple of interviews with Mr. Hartsfield and he does speak of the hamon in the video and states that it is created during heat treat.

G2
 
Ok, we've got a real maker on this thread. Wally, if you differentially heat treat a blade, isn't it true that you need to etch the blade in say ferric chloride to really see the temper line distinctly?

My point is that I believe A2 is very much differentially heat-treatable, so to say "he etches to get his temper line" isn't any kind of accusation, just a fact (I think) that is one way to make the temper line more visible. Sandblasting (or beadblasting) would just be a way to finish the blade, and I don't think would really do much in the way of making a false temper line or anything.

One of you maker's help us out here.
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rdangerer@home.com

[This message has been edited by rdangerer (edited 08-01-2000).]

[This message has been edited by rdangerer (edited 08-01-2000).]
 
etching helps to see a temper line but isn't always needed. I get lines in 5160 that show through after a scotchbrite polish.
 
Hello

Regarding temper lines I have a friend blacksmith who does them drawing the back of the blades softer by hand (50 years + experience helps) and the tmper lines come very clear and can be seen right after you start polishing the blade - have never etched one to see if it gets better in any way.
I am finishing a large chisel ground tanto in 5160 heat teated by him and will try to post a picture of it in a couple days.

Ivan Campos

P.S. Bill Siegle, I have bough one of your tantos last year from Bill Claussen and really liked it - couldn't be better for the money. I sold mine but will order another one of these days.
 
I believe Phill creates his Hamon in the traditional way, by differentially heating. (Don Fogg does it that way too.) Only some of Phill's blades have a hamon. You have to pay substantially more for one his his blades that has one.
 
Wow..."ask and you shall receive"

Great responses guys, can anyone post a picture?

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God is Soooooo good!
MC
 
Well, I haven't seen more than a handful of Phil's knives, but you have to be careful about terminology with this sort of thing. First off, A-2 can be differentially heat treated, so you will get a difference in crystal structure between the back and the edge. The hamon is the line between these different structures, and on some steels it is very visible with the proper polish while on others it needs to be acid etched to be exposed. Many top knifemakers etch their blades to expose the hamon or temper line. I imagine that Phil's blades would require an etch to expose the line because of his typically rough finish. Maybe on his more traditional blades he polished them, but the rougher the finish the harder it is to see the hamon without acid etching. Where you run into problems is on blades that are not differentially heat treated. To have a "temper line" on such a blade you have to etch the blade to effectively draw a temper line in. This is a decorative process, not a result of the structure of the steel. A true temper line will only show up on differentially heat treated blades. All the rest have a fake temper line drawn in somehow. So, acid etching can mean a couple different things.

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The Hartsfield Blades with Hamon are differentially heat treated and have true temper lines.......................period

Just call Phill...
 
Could be he's edge austentizing -- Cover the back with an insulator and torch the edge. You can put a hamon-like temper line on stainless steel that way.

Still, for $7,000 I can get one made in Japan. A sword from Michael Bell or Francis Boyd, or two L-6 swords from Howard Clark.
 
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