Please help with learning to sharpen & hone

C

cckw

Joined
May 24, 2008
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I am learning to sharpen my own blades. I searched around and learned what I could on the mouse pad method and stropping.

I have questions:

Mouse pad:
1. I use one with foam base, then turn it upside down so the sandpaper is against the foam, right?
2. how do you determine the proper angle for the knife?
3. Since I'm stropping what is the highest grit I need to use on the mouse pad?
4. What is the lowest to ever use on a really bad knife?

Stropping:
I got the kit from knivesshipfree. it has bark river green & black compound and a paint stirrer (looking thing) with leather glued to front and back.

1. In a video on that site the dude said the direction say you don't need to heat the compound. But that is NOT what the directions say. So how hot?
2. What should the leather look like or feel like when properly applied?
3. What should it look like when being used? (shiny spots? dusty? etc)
4. How do you know when to add more?
5. If properly ready coming off the mouse pads how many passed on each color of the strop would be expected?
 
cckw said:
I am learning to sharpen my own blades. I searched around and learned what I could on the mouse pad method and stropping.

I have questions:

Mouse pad:
1. I use one with foam base, then turn it upside down so the sandpaper is against the foam, right?
2. how do you determine the proper angle for the knife?
3. Since I'm stropping what is the highest grit I need to use on the mouse pad?
4. What is the lowest to ever use on a really bad knife?

Stropping:
I got the kit from knivesshipfree. it has bark river green & black compound and a paint stirrer (looking thing) with leather glued to front and back.

1. In a video on that site the dude said the direction say you don't need to heat the compound. But that is NOT what the directions say. So how hot?
2. What should the leather look like or feel like when properly applied?
3. What should it look like when being used? (shiny spots? dusty? etc)
4. How do you know when to add more?
5. If properly ready coming off the mouse pads how many passed on each color of the strop would be expected?
Click to expand...

Mousepad.
1. It doesn't need a foam base all it has to be is a soft and has give to it. Then just staple it or hold it against something hard (wood, etc)
2. Since the mousepad has "give" lay the blade nearly flat on it just raise it a tad. If your going to reprofile just raise it a little and go at it.
3. Anything really, but I would start at 250 for reprofile and then work up to 600+ for razor sharpness.
4.250 to 350

Stropping.
1. Hot to touch use a hair dryer or use the knivesshipfree video where a guy uses a candle ( I use a lighter) it just need to be warm. DO NOT GET TO THE POINT WHERE THE COMPOUND MELTS OR TURNS LIQUID or the strop will be uneven and be horrible IMHO.
2. Should be smooth and even. Don't over apply you should still be able to see some of the skin (not bare just the pores coming up) under the compound this helps the abrasive action and polishing action.
3. It should start to turn gray then black after a while of use. You should hear a slight dragging sound when stropping that the burr hitting the leather.
4. When the strop turns black. If you feel like starting a new get some wd-40
and a rag and add some wd-40 to the rag and wipe the compound off and reapply to the strop.
5. If you want an all out polish do 20 strokes each side on the black. Then 50 each side on the green finishing with alternating LIGHT strokes about 10 should do (5 each side, but alternate each pass).
Hope I helped.
 
Sounds very clear. I'll work on it tomorrow. The video I watched didn't have a candle but I remember it saying part 8 or something like that in the one I saw. If I need that visual I'll try to find the rest of the series, but I think you have laid it out quite well.
 
I haven't watched the rest of the videos, but I will. I did what chococrazy outlined. I was doing the mouse pad pretty well, the strop I had loaded too much stuff, so I cleared it off and now am having great result.

For fastest learning I sharpened some of those cheap steak knives that are basically just stamped sheet metal. you see effects very quickly. I moved form those to a Chicago Cutlery piece, then to a filet knife and a low end benchmade with AUS-8. It has gone well enough I have offered to sharpen a friends D2 blade.

One thing I came up with on my own, I have a 10x jewels loop (cheap one off of Flea-bay) and check the edge to see when I have achieved a complete convex, rather then just rounding the shoulder and hitting the edge. Seeing at this level gives a lot of confidence when you are doing it right.
 
You can just use the compound like a crayon on our strops. No need to heat it.

:)
 
okbohn said:
You can just use the compound like a crayon on our strops. No need to heat it.

:)
Click to expand...

Heating allows for more even distribution and when you heat the leather the pores of the leather's skin so it literally absorbs the compound making it much more effective. So the argument that if you use compound on leather that the compound is doing all the work is wrong. I tested some Hardware store compound and it worked the same, but when you get into Cro2 the cardboard won't cut it; it severely screwed the performance up of the it. When used on leather my blades shined beautifully.
 
New question. I have 3M automotive sand paper, how long should one piece last. Of course there are a ton of variables. It's sharp and aggressive right at first, then less gritty after just a few swipes, from there it is very gradual on the decline. I am wanting to change paper, but don't know if it is time or if I am just getting impatient as I move to better knives. Of course I understand it is up to me, my question is based on wanting to act like a pro.
 
Every sharpening product has it trade off's, sandpaper breaks down from the point you start using it and that's just how it works. You could try and find some diamond lapping film (diamond sandpaper) but I dont know how much better that would be.




convex does not work for everything.
 
cckw said:
New question. I have 3M automotive sand paper, how long should one piece last.
Click to expand...

If you are trying to rebevel, you will probably need a few pieces of low grit to get the edge to it's general shape. For refining and finishing the edge I've found the sheets to work for quite some time - the longer you use them, the finer they become. For example, I have a 1500 grit piece I've used so much it's more like 2000 or finer because it's worn so smooth.

To answer your question, the same couple dozen or so sheets of varying grits have gotten me through rebeveling and sharpening 4 or 5 knives.
 
he's right, convex doesn't work for everything. However, when you get to a job convex won't do, refine the edge and try again. ;)

And being as you're actually learning to do it RIGHT by some amazing good fortune, I will give you free for nothing some advice you'll probably ignore. FAST run quickly and buy a full size combination (natural) belgian BBW/Coticule. It'll possibly go 300 or more, SHADDUP and spend the money. Ya hear? If you got to mortgage the cat AND yer mother in law..buy that natural double grit stone. Now, I said that cause I like ya. None of mine are for sale.

My favorite stones are a big industrial King 1200, my rough stone in the kitchen, a pre-wwII big vintage Aoto, a 4x2, 7x1.5, 8x2, 8x3 combo belgians, and some fancy japanese stones that I don't want to misspell, but high grit polish stones, roughly 5-6000 grit up to > 10-12000. Mirror polishers or you're doing it wrong.

One fat belgian natural combo will probably outlive you, good odds on it. Finest hone you'll never cuss and never sell.
 
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cckw said:
New question. I have 3M automotive sand paper, how long should one piece last. Of course there are a ton of variables. It's sharp and aggressive right at first, then less gritty after just a few swipes, from there it is very gradual on the decline. I am wanting to change paper, but don't know if it is time or if I am just getting impatient as I move to better knives. Of course I understand it is up to me, my question is based on wanting to act like a pro.
Click to expand...

The reason it's so grippy is because it isn't it's true grit when you buy it (more info on this in the DMT EEF break in thread same principle just larger scale because of diamonds).
Those first couple of swipes break it in to it's true grit. From then on it depends on pressure, number of strokes, and maintenance of the paper. 1 reprofiling will probably use 2 or 3 sheets maybe 1 and a half if used conservatively. You're sanding metal not wood so the paper will die out much quicker! 1 high grit sheet (1000+) should last you through a couple knives though since it isn't used as hard as the other grits.
 
hello i am soni i am telling you how to sharp a knives with the steel
Taking part in the Kitchen Cure? This would be a great week to learn how to sharpen your knives, especially given all the cooking you'll be doing in the final three weeks. Even if you're not one of the 800 plus Cure-takers, my guess is your knives haven't been sharpened lately, if ever.
Sharpening a knife is sometimes perceived as the most difficult knife care task; and it probably is. Modern stainless steel is very hard and, when sharpened properly, will hold a good edge for a very long time. When sharpening a knife you must have a high quality sharpener that features a rough stock removal surface (preferably diamond abrasive) and a finishing surface of hard stone or ceramic abrasive. The diamond and ceramic materials will cut away the steel on the blade's cutting surface easily as these materials are harder than steel. A hard stone will also perform this task, but the stone is only slightly harder than the steel and so this requires more effort on your part.Most times, simply using a kitchen steel on your cutlery will be sufficient. See instructions below.
bowie knives

Remember, Keep your knife sharpened -- a dull blade can be more dangerous than a properly maintained one.
Sharpening with a Steel
When a knife is used, the edge eventually becomes dull. The edge will turn either to the left or right side depending on how you hold your knife when cutting. Quality knives with high carbon/molybdenum/vanadium alloy have elasticity and can easily be re-aligned by a sharpening steel. Do not use a diamond-coated steel or a pull-through manual or electric sharpening device for maintaining the edge. These devices will destroy your turned edge. They can be used to sharpen, but not for maintanance.
Place the knife blade against the tip of the sharpening steel at an angle of approximately 20 degrees. Pull the knife down and across the steel, describing a slight arc. Repeat this action on the back of the steel to sharpen the other side of the blade. Repeat steps 2 and 3 five to ten times, alternating the left and right side of the blade. It is very important to maintain the angle of 20 degrees and to run the full length of the cutting edge along the steel from the hilt to the tip of the knife. Speed of movement plays no part in this process.
 
Troll activity seems to Be high tonight.
 
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