Pls help with info on CPM S30V for carving/bushcrafty use?

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fmajor007

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Apr 1, 2010
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Greetings Bladesmithy types!

I thought I'd venture over here in the hopes of getting a bit more definitive guidance on steel choice for carving and bushcrafty stuff.

I recently put together an EnZo Trapper in O1. Linky to the project thread:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1278151-EnZo-Trapper-in-O1-tool-steel-my-1st-ever-attempt-at-something-like-this!

I've heard Enzo does a great job on their O1 steel for the Scandi grind, but even with *very* minimal use, the edge has dulled already which is quite disappointing. I like O1 for knives (my Bryan Breeden custom is from O1 and it takes/holds a superb edge) and I like the EnZo Trapper profile, but find myself disappointed with EnZo's O1. Maybe this particular blank is a fluke or maybe I need to adjust my expectations as regards a Scandi ground knife - I dunno....

Sooooo, I'm considering doing another Trapper, but sure would appreciate a more expert opinion on CPM S30V with a Scandi grind (though I'd probably do a micro-convex via stropping).

What's your opinion of CPM S30V in this role?

ETA - I've googled and read many threads, but would like some more current, up to date info if possible!
 
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I wish I could offer some personal experience, the only S30V Knives I have are Benchmade folders from a few years ago. They seem very "chippy" to me, which is the heat treat issue. However, Benchmade has released a buschcraft knife with a Scandi grind in S30V. You may look into that knife and any reports on it.
 
Silly question: does the Enzo blank come hardened, and if so, what hardness?

O1 has pretty good wear resistance when heat treated right. It's nothing like S30V, or other high alloy steels, but it should not be disappointing. Do you know what the edge geometry is, ie. Thickness, and edge angles?

I don't work a lot with high alloy steels, so I'm not the best source of info out there on them. Others recommend Elmax and CPM3v for tough, high alloy steels. Might be something to look into, but I susoect you have a great treat/geometry issue with your knife.
 
Willie71 said:
Silly question: does the Enzo blank come hardened, and if so, what hardness?

O1 has pretty good wear resistance when heat treated right. It's nothing like S30V, or other high alloy steels, but it should not be disappointing. Do you know what the edge geometry is, ie. Thickness, and edge angles?

I don't work a lot with high alloy steels, so I'm not the best source of info out there on them. Others recommend Elmax and CPM3v for tough, high alloy steels. Might be something to look into, but I susoect you have a great treat/geometry issue with your knife.
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I think that Enzo's O1 hardness is 58-59 HRC (from the Brisa knife site).

I was hoping to get a little more input on S30V in a scandi grind being that this is the knife-makers shop talk forum.
 
I didn't see one offered on the Brisa website in S30V, so I assume you are going to grind your own. If you like O1 you can order some and send it out for heat treat to your specs.
 
I have switched all of my user blades kitchen knives included to s30v and s35vn. s35vn is basically the same but with the nyindium (I know that is spelled way wrong but...) added to help deter edge chipping. Personally I have not had any of them chip and I punish I mean PUNISH my knives. I guarantee you will be impressed with the edge retention.
 
Lo/Rez said:
I didn't see one offered on the Brisa website in S30V, so I assume you are going to grind your own. If you like O1 you can order some and send it out for heat treat to your specs.
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Thank you for the idea!

I'm up to my neck in yard/landscape projects and don't have the spare time it would take me. Further, I don't have the necessary expertise nor equipment to be grinding my own. I can do a little profile re-sharping, but that's about it.
 
rmbonham said:
I have switched all of my user blades kitchen knives included to s30v and s35vn. s35vn is basically the same but with the nyindium (I know that is spelled way wrong but...) added to help deter edge chipping. Personally I have not had any of them chip and I punish I mean PUNISH my knives. I guarantee you will be impressed with the edge retention.
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Yeah, the more I read the more I'm interested in trying S30V. It's harder to source though and *much* more expensive!

samuraistuart said:
Niobium AND Nitrogen in S35VN
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Alpha Knife Supply said:
Where did you read or hear S35VN contains nitrogen?

Chuck
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So, my faithful steel experts - aka samuraistuart/Alpha Knife Supply(Chuck) is S30V a good material for a scandi-type grind in a bushcrafty application?

Is S35VN easily sourced?

Again, massive thanks for the replies and encouragements!
 
Chuck, I admittedly am not too familiar with S35VN, but according to ZKnives and the steel chart....S35VN has 0.5% Niobium and 0.00-0.13% Nitrogen.

As far as those steels being used on scandi bushcraft....my opinion is they can be used...but not best suited. I am a carbon steel guy, and would like someone else who has better experience with those steels to give you a better answer. I would go with 3V, but out of the S30V and S35VN....I would use the S35VN.

Chuck...I don't suppose you have any S35VN in stock at the moment do you? You're steel selection is awesome , BTW. I think Tracy at Midwest Knife Maker (USA Knifemaker) does have a bit of S35VN if you are interested, FMajor007. Chuck does have 3/16" and 1/4" S30V at Alpha Knife Supply.
 
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samuraistuart said:
Chuck, I admittedly am not too familiar with S35VN, but according to ZKnives and the steel chart....S35VN has 0.5% Niobium and 0.00-0.13% Nitrogen.

As far as those steels being used on scandi bushcraft....my opinion is they can be used...but not best suited. I am a carbon steel guy, and would like someone else who has better experience with those steels to give you a better answer. I would go with 3V, but out of the S30V and S35VN....I would use the S35VN.

Chuck...I don't suppose you have any S35VN in stock at the moment do you? You're steel selection is awesome , BTW. I think Tracy at Midwest Knife Maker (USA Knifemaker) does have a bit of S35VN if you are interested, FMajor007. Chuck does have 3/16" and 1/4" S30V at Alpha Knife Supply.
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Thanks samuraistuart!

I posed this question to learn about S30V as it seems to be the top-rated steel for an EnZo Trapper knife blade ( *really, really* like the 3.6mm thickness and the blade profile in general). I don't have the tools to grind and profile a blade of my own (or the skill to do so to achieve something that looks half-way decent) and heat treating is waayyyyy beyond me so it would have to be sent out anyway....
 
samuraistuart said:
Chuck...I don't suppose you have any S35VN in stock at the moment do you? You're steel selection is awesome , BTW. I think Tracy at Midwest Knife Maker (USA Knifemaker) does have a bit of S35VN if you are interested, FMajor007. Chuck does have 3/16" and 1/4" S30V at Alpha Knife Supply.
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We stopped stocking S35VN. We tested it extensively and determined the edge holding was worse than S30V. A couple years later CATRA testing confirmed our test results. S35VN is more expensive than S30V. We could not justify paying more for less performance.

If I had to choose a stainless steel for a bushcraft knife I'd pick AEB-L. It is easy to resharpen, takes an extremely fine edge and has excellent toughness.

Right now our steel selection is lower than usual because we are in the process of moving. After the move we will get everything restocked and add a couple new steels. ;)

Chuck
 
FMajor007, Chuck's suggestion of AEB-L is a DARN good one for stainless bushcraft knife. 440C is another option as well. Out of the two...I LOVE AEB-L. I would personally not use either S30V or S35VN for such application. A bushcraft knife edge sees A LOT of abuse. Side forces on the edge apex are especially brutal. For a knife edge that will see heavy use, it is to your advantage to go with a finer grain steel, such as AEB-L. The higher the carbide size and volume, the weaker an edge apex will actually become when lateral forces are applied. Admittedly, the S30V and S35VN are powder metallurgy steels, so their carbide size is very fine.
 
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