precursor to Suehiro Rika 5000?

hardheart

hardheart

Joined
Sep 19, 2001
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I have a full set of DMTs - D8XX, D11X, D8C, D11F, D11E, D8EE, and a Naniwa Super Stone 10,000 (and more, but these are the relevant ones). I would like to add the Suehiro in before the SS10K for sharpening clad knives so I can polish the core steel wile leaving the soft iron cladding with a contrasting haze. I read elsewhere that someone does this with the Suehiro and the Naniwa, and says that it doesn't matter what is used beforehand. In anyone else's experience, is this accurate? I could use the 1200 or the 8000 (4000 in JIS) DMTs then move to the Suehiro and not get any other stones. CKTG has a packahge deal with a Beston 500, Bester 1200, and the Suehiro, and I was also looking to pick up those other stones. But, is it justified to have them? The DMTs will rebevel and repair a lot faster than the Beston, as will a belt sander and disc grinder, which I'm also getting. I guess the big questions are - am I going to stop at a 1200 finish on any knives (probably), and if so, is the Bester a better choice than the DMT for any particular steel/knife (dunno).
 
Tough question,

To reveal different artifacts of the steel it takes more than one stone and you only get lucky if it can be done with synthetics. The SR5k will have some similar qualities to a natural because it builds a mud which can be refined but overall it does not work like a j-Nat does.

The DMT 8k might leave a 4-6k quality sharpness but the scratch pattern is closer to 2k because of the depth the diamonds cut to. It's easier to go from the coarse DMT to a 1k waterstone and skip the fine diamond hones. I've found its better to have stand-alone sets than trying to do too much mixing and matching.
 
The CKTG set seems to have been put together from the sheer popularity of the combo, followed with either the SS10K, Kitayama 8K, Imanishi 10K, or maybe the Chosera 10K (though a lot say you can skip to it straight from a 1K, I'm not paying to find out :p) I'll probably get the set since it must work, and it isn't all that pricey compared to a lot of my knife-related purchases. It'll also stop me from considering the Sigma Power Ceramic 1K.

Probably end up with the Kitayama too, I keep looking it up. Really trying to avoid shopping for jnat polishers again, I don't need but want.
 
Nubatama stones are very new and seem like a sharpeners dream stone but I only know what I have been told and that's limited. I will be getting the 150 grit in a few days and plan on making a set of these stones. They are said to even be suited for sword polishers so it might work a bit like a natural.

I would avoid the set you are looking at, its not bad but its not really what you want. The SR5k is like the Aoto or naniwa green brick, it would be better if you just took the numbers away and called it a medium stone. it can prep a edge for high polish but a jump to 10k might be pushing it. When using waterstones the grit range you can span is controlled by wear resistance and bevel size, higher wear resistance or a larger bevel width and you will need to keep the span closer to make up for the loss in cutting action.

The kitayama Is a great stone if you like synthetic polishers. It will work similar to the naniwa but has a better feel IMO. I'm not a fan of this type of stone for the way it works but I have purchased it twice :o

The Imanishi is excellent for double bevel carbon steel knives but because its a polisher like the naniwa and kitayama its not as well suited for large single bevel or scandi blades. For those you really want a stone that releases the grit and makes a slurry. I have one if your interested BTW.

Pretty much all the finishing stones you mentioned will cover up and polish to a mirror finish which is opposite your intention.

What are you sharpening?
 
knifenut1013 said:
What are you sharpening?
Click to expand...
lol, nothing yet, just in the research phase to get ready to. Still got a few months before I even get back to the States. BTW, here's where I saw the fellow saying the SR5K to SS10K worked, good looking pic in the 4th post. http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/printpost.php?tid/868241/ Something like that, maybe try to bring out the iron a little more or not show the sharpening direction so much. I had a single bevel folder with a white steel core that my Kings were able to come close to giving that result. There's also the 6K Araashiyama to consider instead of the Suehiro.

I'm not too worried about wear resistance for this particular set of stones, I always have the DMTs and various ceramics for my 3%+C and 9%+V steels :D. I am expecting white/blue steels for this sort of thing, VG-10, ZDP, won't have iron laminate, AFAIK.

I'll think about the Imanashi. I just might end up in a situation whre I have the SS10K, the Kitayama, the Imanashi, and maybe eventually talk myself into the Chosera 10K, along with a couple jnats n the range plus a kiita, asagi, or karasu for the next level. A whole mess of polishers, and I just don't know what for.
 
1k & 6k Arashiyama + a natural finisher

I had the same question and that ^ was my answer.
 
You can go from a fine DMT to a Suehiro Rika 5K in no time.

I wouldn't get hung up with all the JIS to Americanized stuff for anything finer than 1,200 grit JIS/1,200 Americanized. There's not really a standard in the higher levels (a Lee Valley article comparing Bester/Imanishi, King, and Sigma Power Select II stones showed King's 4K to have 2.5 micron particles and 8K to have 2 micron particles and King's 800 has 25 micron particles just like a 600 grit DMT). My Norton 8,000 at 3 microns (oh how coarse! :rolleyes: ) cuts faster than the kings and leaves a shinier finish with no noticeable difference in sharpness.

I've heard many great things about the Arashiyamas knifenut1013 is recommending. One addict has told me the Arashiyama 6,000 (or Takenoko 8,000 if you want the same stone adjusted for inlation) does the super polishing of a Chosera 5,000 (superlative stone at a pathetically expensive price) only faster. Since I knew he rarely, if ever, has to eat his own words, I went out and bought a Naniwa 5K super stone (way different than the Chosera) and have regretted doing so.
 
what disapoints you with the 5k SS. i love mine, it polishes fast to a superb shiny edge, you can work a nice mud easy (way easier than the 10k) and create an ok contrast on kasumi knives if you are carefull and stay light on the pressure to "ride" over the mud
 
Sigh, every time I shop for stones, my list gets longer, not shorter. I will probably get both the SR5K and the A6K, since the SR5K is supposedly close to a 3K anyway and I can play with different edge finishes. And, I am looking at two lines of Sigma Powers, up to 13K. While still considering every other polisher mentioned in this thread. And perusing A-frames, JNS, JCK, JWW, CKTG, fine-tools, japan-tool, and a thousand other sites. With half a dozen tabs of forum discussions.
 
Opinions may vary but to me the A6k needs to be used with the arashiyama 1k. The 1k will act a lot like a natural with its slurry/mud refining the bevel surface more than a 1k should. It will also start bringing out the grain of the steel. Moving on to the 6k a mud will need to be raised with a diamond plate and you will again use the stone like a natural working the mud/slurry and refining the scratch pattern. Pressure will be key to the results received, heavy pressure will yield a cloudy glossy polish and light pressure floating the mud will yield a more kasumi finish. Using the 6k with no mud and lots of water yields a high polish with a bright surface and very keen edge.
 
hardheart said:
since the SR5K is supposedly close to a 3K anyway and I can play with different edge finishes.
Click to expand...

The finish could be due to the stone having a loose, vitrified binder. Measurement of cutting force or friction would be a better judge than looks (though unpopular, soulless Glasstones tend leave edges both shinier and sharper than their grit ratings suggest).
 
True, but looks are my main concern for this middle range. A 3K or 5K edge would be a fine stopping point on a kitchen knife if I'm not concerned with a full polish, so I would not be dissatisfied either way. The lower polish level is just something I would play with (more/less mud, drier/wetter, lots/little pressure) as I progress to another stone. A polished bevel is generally pretty easy, and it doesn't always equal sharpness at the edge, such as rounding edges with a strop.
 
Had one. I don't mind mud, but aoto's at another level. But if it's the best route, I'll get another. A longer lasting synthetic would of course be better, but so would steels that never dulls.
 
Lol, only in a perfect world.

The natural Aoto is a excellent stone for removing fairly coarse scratches while still being able to polish into the 4k range. I used one to finish the sides of my SY Regulator after thinning and it brought out a very cool wood grain like pattern. You could easily stop with a Aoto but its also a great stepping stone (no pun intended) to a finisher which would highlight the Hagane (hard steel).
 
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