Preferred cold weather clothing - wool, fleece or ???

M

Michael Bennett

Joined
Mar 2, 1999
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I'm looking for clothing camping/hiking and other outdoor activities in cooler/colder weather myself. I'm curious to hear others' thoughts on the topic. Let's say temps to -15F (-26C, if I did the math right) worst case.

Which do you prefer: wool, fleece, polypro or ???

I'm tending toward the natural materials such as wool for the outer layer. Mallory and Ervine climbed Everest wearing silk and wool. Of course they died up there, but that was state of the art at the time, unless you're talking animal furs.

The bigger problem with these is weight, in my mind. The modern fabrics, fleece and polypro are lighter, I believe. But they melt if you get too close to the fire.

I own some fleece that I like for the inner, too. I'm trying to get away from cotton (Cotton Kills), though it is tough because most clothing out there seems to be cotton or blends.

Your thoughts?

Mike
 
Its all a weight game. More modern synthetics have some fire retardent built in. Synthetics are tougher, weigh less and are cheap.

I like Buffalo fibre pile type with a pertex outer, as a next to the skin body warmth system when mildly cold and wet. My ten year old jacket is still working. Fibre pile loses out if more warmth is needed as it gets heavy once you start bulking it out to gain those extra toggsof warmth. Warm when wet though.

Snugpac Softy jackets are extremely warm for their weight. Very light, very warm and packs down incredibly small. Down side is that I wear one out every two years.

New concept that works and is also extremely quiet and waterproof is Nomad UK fleeze system. Expensive but different.

I'll try and find some links.
 
For a less expensive route I advise folks get mil surplus poly pro thermal top and bottoms or the mil surplus fleece bib and shirt. Buy scandanavian or german wool combat pants and poly fleece tops and put a Gortex, or equivalent, layer over it. The underwear can be had in light, medium or expedition weights the fleece bib and shirt come in "broil" only. The Gortex pants can be worn over the thermals with a pair of shorts. This whole combination is used in our wet to snowy winters that range from -15 to +50 in a single day by adding and stripping layers as temp and activity change. In your neck of the woods I'd probably add a heavier Gortex uninsulated parka with room for a thick poly pile jacket or vest and a good pair of wool or poly gloves under goretex mittens.

Take care.

Mike
 
I prefer wool for the aesthetics, but fleece is much more practical on trips where weight is a factor. Fleece is much lighter than wool, and drys fast (you will get wet). Wool is more bombproof, and will last you a lifetime.

As a matter of fact, the only drawback to fleece (I try to stay away from fires while wearing plastic) is that by itself it's useless in a strong wind - you might as well be wearing a cotton tshirt. The 'windstopper' membrane seems to work ok, but I will always carry a shell anyway, so the windstopper is unnecessary - and it makes the fleece breathe not-so-well.

Good luck.

db
 
Okay, so I don't have any good advice to give, but I've got a whopper of a story. (And it's all true!)

The movie "Snowbound" is a true story about a young couple and their baby who got stuck in the snow in N. Nevada. I was in the same snow storm, and trying to get to some hot springs in the area where they were stranded - of course not having any idea that they were there. (Thank God we got turned back by a 26-foot snowdrift at the foot of Doherty Pass!)

We had bungees on the wheel chains of the flatbead truck that hauled all of our gear (enough for a small militia). As we drove the bungees froze and snapped, making us get out repeatedly to fix and re-rig the bungees.

We had driven around a blockade on the road at Klamath Falls, and for the whole ninety miles to Lakeview we might have seen two other vehicles. Lakeview was pretty much closed down. The Safeway had empty shelves and almost all of the gas stations were out of gas. The locals knew that we were outsiders and were shocked to see us. When we told them that we had come in from K. Falls they said that the road had been blocked for 3 days and not a single truck had gotten through to resupply the town. I would like to think that maybe we gave them hope, but maybe we just got them that much more frustrated.

We finally got to the top of Warner Pass on New Years night, and that's where we found out from locals that Doherty was blocked by 26 feet of drifted snow. So we turned around and headed back to Lakeview, finding several stranded vehicles that had gone into the ditches. We hooked up and hauled them out, slowly moving along the highway from car to car getting people unstuck.

By the time we got back to town the New Year's celebrations (whatever they might have been) were over, the town was shut down, and we had no place to stay. We knocked on caretaker's door at the Lake County Fairgrounds and asked to use the stables. Instead he opened up a concession stand and let us sleep in there. And so we weathered the storm.

The next day we set out back towards K. Falls, and found a good camp at the top of Quartz Mtn. Pass. We pitched camp on the snow and dug in for two days of fun. When we finally packed it up and went home we had a new appreciation for the cold and snow. Little did we know that our circumstances were so favorable when compared to a lonely trio still missing somewhere in the foothills west of Gooch Table. We got out with nothing worse than a few worries, but they lost their toes.

If you haven't seen the movie "Snowbound", go get it.
 
In very cold temperatures [ and you are getting there] you have to layer. Sure, the old guys wore wool. And the arctic travellers that did often died because of it. Ditto the climbers.
Wool is best for fire, that's true. You can use it instead of a poly mid layer, but the stuff is heavy and a lot depends on the weave. I don't have any of the new fire-retardant poly so I can't say how well they work.
I like silk or a good wicking polypro for a first layer. Silk won't last as well, but it won't stink. I find it works better. Cabelas and MEC have some good stuff at decent prices.. Poly of some sort as a next layer. All the outfitters have an incredible range of treated poly in various insulating levels. Wicking in that layer is critical for your survival in really cold: you will sweat and the sweat will freeze. The real question is where, how close to your skin, will that occur.
One choice you didn't mention is Primaloft. I love Primaloft. It is almost as warm as down, very light, but it insulates when wet and dries quickly. This could be your second layer. It's what I depend on when I'm really active.
If it's really cold, you need a serious insulating layer like down or fur. With down, primaloft or poly you need a barrier or shell layer with dryloft, windstopper, xcr or something similar.
I have no experience with fur and that's probably not what you were thinking of. Alot of First Nations, who know, swear by it though.

I would check out Integral Designs for Primaloft and Feathered Friends for down. But the key is to layer.
 
I love the feel of classic Woolrich shirts and pants when I'm out camping. For practicality on treks and patrols though, I go for synthetics. I start with Polypro or Cappiline undies, then Polarfleece, and a Gortex shell. I havn't done Antarctica yet, but variations on that set up (ie: Adding and subtracting a layer or two or three) works for just about everything else.
PS. Don't put absorbent materials like cotton near the skin. You want the moisture to get wicked away and not stay near the body. Plain old black dress socks (the thin synthetic ones) are always my first layer on my feet. They help alleviate blisters and keep the moisture away.
Hope that helps
recondoc
 
I find Merino wool to be an excellent first and/or second layer. It won't smell after even very long use, it's comfortable, and very warm. It will even insulate when wet. It does take a long time to dry however. Check out www.icebreakernz.com.
 
I was a meter reader for a utility, avg 15 miles a day, 5 days a week. Polypro was a revelation for me, more comfortable and less binding than fleece, a med weight suit of this and issue cotton pants and insulated bomber jacket with a toque and that was all I needed on 98% of winter days, -10 degrees was a perfect work day. But I had the best insulated boots (with little silk booties) I could find and I kept active the whole day, and knew that after 7 hours I would be home and drying my kit out. When in the arctic we swaddled in the great issue down gear, and never worked too hard. And cast lustfull eyes on the fur in caribou skin gear of the Inuit. I heard it was great, but too warm for heavy exertion.
Anyway, for short term exertion in winter polypro beat wool, fleece and down almost always in my experience.
 
Thanks all,

Sounds like a lot of combinations will do fine. I did get a chance to check out some wool pants at a local Army/Navy store. Good stuff. Appreciate the info. Decisions, decisions.

Mike
 
If price is no object and you like washable wool:
http://www.kingofthemountain.com/
They have an interesting technical section.
I have NO personal knowledge*, but know one person who said it is good stuff...the one who loaned me the catalog to peruse.

or how about this site:

http://www.wiggys.com/
"All insulated Wiggy's products have only one form of insulator, LAMILITE" (to quote from one of their pages.) I recall someone mentioning this site before.

Anyone use some of these products?

*I live in Miami, Florida now. :cool: :D
 
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