Proper treatment of 52100? Help please

E

elyfarms

Joined
Jan 28, 2007
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I've been working with 52100 steel for some time now and after reading the article in the April 2007 Blade Mag. I am wondering if I am handling this stuff right. Does anyone out there want to share their knowledge or a web sight that describes simply the 1) Normalizing proceedure 2) annealing method, 3)austentizing proceedure, 4) quenching (what kind of oil) (what's the best way to quench, edge only or tip to tang? and if it's tip to tang what's the best way to soften the back?) 5) tempering. I do have a programable kiln and have not been using it to its full potential. Dumb me. What can I say, there's so much to learn and so little time. If someone out there can help I would greatly appreciate it. :o
 
I have not read the information you saw in BLADE...

What did they write that has caused you to question your system?
 
I started a topic like yours about 2 or 3 months ago.

I have a nice little supply of 52100 ball bearings and just wanted to know what I should do with them given my short list of tools that i have to work with? (A gas forge, a O/A torch, O heated oil quench tank, and a kitchen oven)

I didnt find much help here right away on this forum,,,
Im still a bit disappointed by that fact too...

The guys who know the answer (and this forum has a few steel egg heads), are unable to share the answer with terms I understand,

But I just wanted to know what to do?,
Im not interested in reading a book or going back to school just to Heat treat this fool bearing...
Websites and talk of curves and noses are mostly meaningless to me,,,
I just want the answer, not a general direction where they guess I might one day stumble on the answer..

I just got this ball bearing, (a common item, this is a common steel, it's been around for a 100 years), and I only wanted to know whats the best way to use it with my tools? (a normal question, no big deal)

But I kept asking around and in the end, I found some guys who spoke in a manner I could understand,,,
they were the common men of steel that gave me the understanding I needed to finish the knife I had started.

They didnt tell me about how to use tools that i dont have, they didnt list systems for steels I dont use.
They told me what to do, and how to do it.

What I found was that there are a few guys who understand that 40 tons hay in the barn is of little value to the cows untill you toss it out of the loft and down onto the floor where the cows can eat it.

I have a few Ed Fowler videos now that I picked up along the way that are of GREAT value as far as HT 52100 steel, and the results of my own beginner blade tests that tell me Im on the right track
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My system is to normalize 2 times, Anneal overnight, and to HT the cutting edge once or twice to get it right, and to then temper a few times at 400.
Good luck, I will be watching how far you get as Im still very interested in learning the answers you receive...
 
Ed Fowler is "The Man" when it comes to heat treating 52100 steel for knife blades. Ed's books explain it in simple and easy to understand terms. He is always willing to help us newbies, and even though he understands it far beyond most peoples understanding, he has a way of explaining it so that the rest of the world can understand what it's all about.
 
Alan Molstad said:
I have not read the information you saw in BLADE...

What did they write that has caused you to question your system?
Click to expand...

The article is on page 102 and made me question some of the proceedures I am using to refine the grain of the blade, and also the type of quench oil I am using.
 
Alan Molstad said:
I have not read the information you saw in BLADE...

What did they write that has caused you to question your system?
Click to expand...

The article is on page 102 and made me question some of the proceedures I am using to refine the grain of the blade, and also the type of quench oil I am using.
 
We have put all the informatioin we have learned about 5160 and 52100 into a couple of DVDs that are easy to understand and all the procedures we talk about work and demonstrate the use of 'low tec.' stuff in most knife makers shops, the price is very reasonable, just about covers the cost of productiion, we priced it that way to encourage makers on a budget to seek what I term High Endurance Performance Knves.

Give me a call or visit out sites.
 
Thanks for showing me the website, Ed. I will get on there and read and learn. If I have any other questions I will call.
Ed Fowler said:
We have put all the informatioin we have learned about 5160 and 52100 into a couple of DVDs that are easy to understand and all the procedures we talk about work and demonstrate the use of 'low tec.' stuff in most knife makers shops, the price is very reasonable, just about covers the cost of productiion, we priced it that way to encourage makers on a budget to seek what I term High Endurance Performance Knves.

Give me a call or visit out sites.
Click to expand...
 
Alan Molstad said:
Where did you get that type of toy?
Click to expand...

Alan
A programable kiln can be found in the blade magazine. Ususally some of the suppliers will have a full or half page add that shows various products. Check Texas knife, Jantz supply, etc. There are a couple different brands at least to choose from.
 
John: The first one, 'The forging construction and function of the using knife, Bearing to Blade, 52100" has been available for about 15 years.

The second, "Knife Talk Volume I" is about a month old. Rex and I demonsrate and discuss forging theory and practice, thermal cycles and heat treating in the development of ultra fine grained 52100 and 5160 knife blades. How to develop it, how to test it in your shop. The information we have learned in the past 10 years, Rex in the Lab, another metalurgist, Doc Daugherty other knife makers and I is included. Everything we discuss is backed up by the work Rex did in the Lab. No high tech. verbage you have to fight to understand or equipment you don't need.
 
Heat,quench,temper.

The more you repeat these 3 steps , the more superfantabulouse performance you can get :)
 
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