PSK Heresy! Ditch the fishing kit?

Chad Ward

Chad Ward

Joined
Nov 13, 2001
Messages
234
Okay, I know we all have our own takes on the personal survival kit (PSK). Some of us have a Swiss Army Knife and a lighter and maybe some bandaids in the car, others have enough gear to last a couple of weeks in the Arctic, all carefully weighed, shaved and packed like a Chinese puzzle.

But one thing has always puzzled me (at least since I have become a little more knowledgeable about this stuff), why the focus on food procurement? Why snares and a fishing kit?

If I'm lost out in the middle of nowhere, my job (IMO) is to get found -- as quickly as possible. If I have to stay out there so long that hunger becomes a serious consideration, then, perhaps, there's something wrong with the signalling gear (or lack thereof) that I've stuffed into the kit. And there's definitely something wrong with the trip information I was supposed to convey before setting out (even to the grocery store).

C'mon, you can go weeks without food. The priorities, as I see them are: 1)First Aid, 2)Signalling, 3)Fire and 4)Shelter and 5)Water. Fire and shelter might be reversed depending on how wet or cold you are and what the weather conditions are. Food is way down the list.

The rationale: First Aid first -- it's tough meet any of the other needs if you're hurt. Signalling second -- my job is to be found, so I'll be setting signal fires, tramping SOS's in the snow, running fluourescent surveyor's tape up a tree, anything to make the rescue easier (if, of course, weather and conditions permit. If I'm wet and cold, fire/shelter moves up the list). Then comes making camp comfy for the wait and finding drinking water.

So when it comes to packing a PSK, why waste the space with fishing gear? That same square inch or two could be used for more paracord, surveyor's tape, a bigger signal mirror, more tape or bandaids -- any number of things that would be more immediately useful.

The gauntlet has been thrown :p. Whatcha think? Am I nuts? Have I had a brilliant flash of insight?

Chad
 
I have always questioned the usefulness of a few hooks and some line, as well as snare wire. Fishermen tote a LARGE amount of gear into the field; poles, lures, leaders, etc...and still get skunked. How am I going to catch the elusive fish with my pitiful stuff? I was once told that more useful is a small treble hook to snag fish, birds, or whatever with. I agree.

As for snares, I grew up in a suburban enviroment, as probably a lot of us did. When learning about setting snares one small factor was left out of my class...that the critter IS STILL ALIVE! Now, this is fine if it's a squirrel or some other small furry animal, but if you've managed to catch, oh, say a young raccoon or a 'possum these critters are not about to let you club them to death without a fight. Is this someting we really want to risk in a situation where we're lost, hungry, cold, wet, etc?

I have picked up the gauntlet...and softly put it back down:rolleyes:
 
If you leave out your fishing kit & snare wire, you're obligated to carry a miniature pack of playing cards instead. If lost, set down and play a game of solitaire. Within 3 minutes someone will come along and adise you to play the black ten on the red jack. If the kibbutzer doesn't know the way back to civilization, at least you have ~ 120 lbs of long pig.

I think the fishing kit and snare wire do as much for morale as anything. In many a survival situation, feeling like you're still in charge of your own destiny is important. IMHO that attitude is worth the ounce or two & the square inch for me. Here, where I know the edible plants and local fish & animals I carry my PSK with items chosen to help me walk safely to a town over 2 days, less to help me be found. If I were in Alaska or Thailand I might choose different items for my PSK.
 
And then there's the notion that some of us might not be opposed to getting 'lost' now & then. Hey, a little fishing & hunting while you're waiting/trying to be 'found' might be rather nice! If I get lost in the great outdoors, I want to be comfy, happy, and full.

Regarding successful fishing, in a survival situation you're better off setting a trot line than holding a pole. Throw your bait out in the evening, pull in your catch in the morning. For the minimal amount of time involved, why not bury a fish in the coals while you climb the hill with your signal mirror?

Your point is a very good one. We should have a substantial and logical reason for whatever we include in our kits.
 
Yep, I agree. A fed lost guy is a happy lost guy, lol.

Prepare for the impossible and you are sure to be ok for anything less.
 
I opt for the fishing gear for a number of reasons.

1# being that just because it is fishing gear doesn't mean you have to fish with it. for example fishing line can be used for 1000s of things. snare wire can also be used for 1000s of things. one thing about snare wire is you can use it for trip device to slow down a pursurer of some sort. You can rig all sorts of things, repair things, traps, only your imagination is limited.


2# ya just never know.....if you knew you wouldn't hop in that boat for a 3 day tour. Many times I have gone out of the house, met a friend who was going to the next city or somewhere. Next thing you know you are hundreds of miles from where you thought you'd be. My point is.....life is unpredictable, the amount of space hooks and a lead weight take up seem well worth it.

Sometimes you go out into the woods without notifying anybody, then it might be awhile. why not fish for a bit?

anyway that is my take on the psk
 
Chad,

I agree with the basic premise, but I'm keeping the fishing kit in my PSK.

I do, however, disagree with your priorites. Remember the rule of threes. You die in: 3 minutes without oxygen, 3 hours without SHELTER in inclement weather, 3 days without water, etc....To my mind the priorities should be: First aid, shelter, signaling, water, fire. Circumstances may alter this, for instance, in really bad weather you may need fire and shelter, but...anyway, that's my two cents.

Take care,

Andy
 
Originally posted by texascarl
If you leave out your fishing kit & snare wire, you're obligated to carry a miniature pack of playing cards instead. If lost, set down and play a game of solitaire. Within 3 minutes someone will come along and adise you to play the black ten on the red jack. If the kibbutzer doesn't know the way back to civilization, at least you have ~ 120 lbs of long pig.
Click to expand...

I carry the line for other uses, and just a couple of hooks and split shot. I carry a seperate small tin for fishing if I leave the good 'ol desert.

Utah is something like #48 of the states when it comes to available water, and even though it nearly tops the list in hatchery grown trout, if you can find a place with fish, you can get a RIDE...

Kinda like what I used to jokingly tell scouts in California. "If you're lost, clear a 50' circle, light a match and CDF (Ca Div Forrestry) will show up to check on the smoke..."

No. Here in the desert you need a three year old. Tell him/her to "STAY OUT OF AND AWAY FROM THE WATER." The child will be in a puddle of water in two minutes, regardless of the fact that that valley hasn't seen rain in 27 years...
 
LOL, Chad, I think you've had a brilliant flash of insight!!!!
I have often thought of abandoning my fishing gear from my PSK and re-pack my PSK in a smaller tin. But then I think, heck, it's "just in case". And of course, you know Murphy's law....hehehehe, just when I toss it out, I will need it.LOL. Besides, I enjoy fishing.:D
 
Chad Ward, you have casually tossed out the concept of being able to go "weeks" without food. I wonder if you've tested that theory? As with 3 minutes without oxygen and 3 days without water, the effects of weeks without food are progressive. For a few days you are just hungry, then you get weak and don't want to even get out of a chair, then you start to get emotional and make stupid mistakes, and later, the possibility of making life threatening mistakes is very real. I know, because I've gone for almost four weeks without food. It was self inflicted and a stupid thing to do, and something I don't ever want to repeat! For that reason, I'm going to make calories a part of my survival gear -- and to hell with the extra weight! I'm not just going to pack a little fishing gear but some food too!

Unless each of us has experience with this concept, none of us know exactly how we will be affected. I did this at home, I don't know how badly it would have impacted my trying to get found when lost, but I know little after two weeks would have been done with a clear, calculating head. I didn't die after 3½ weeks but I certainly wouldn't have been very effective in supporting my own rescue.

My point is that this is a dangerous concept to throw around so loosely. Let's be careful and be serious about this.

Regards,

Bruce (the skinny!)
 
Bruce-
Point made, point taken. The effects of NO food are dramatic after ten days or so, varying by individual and situation. Still, I think Chad raises a valid question.

Logic dictates we include fishing gear of some sort on our PSK. Stated another way, Chad's question might read: what is the real quantified value of fishing gear as might be found in a standard PSK?
And the response I suspect he seeks is limited to the value of that gear in actually providing food.

I've responded (to the same question on another forum) that fishing gear is more than mere fishing gear. It is another collection of resources that MAY be used for fishing, and that I've used it in many other ways as well. But his question was directed at getting food. Who, among us, has fed him/her self with the fishing gear in the PSK and how?
-carl
 
Regarding the usefulness of a fishing kit in real practice:

My brother and I were camping in the mountains one time and ran out of food (poor planning). I was able to gather plenty of plants, providing some interesting soups and teas. But it was my brother's fishing kit that netted us the only meat we had, which was not only nourishment but a greatly appreciated variety in our diet of cattail-thisle soup with strawberry & rose leaf tea. We were camped on a tiny stream (maybe 3' across) but he was able to catch a surprising amount of fish.

That being said, we also need to add into the equation that most survivors are found within 48 hours. Beyond that your chances are statistically slim. Of course, that's why we are on this forum, because we want to be the ones who can beat the 48-hour odds. But it's still worth considering what the chances are that you would even be lost for more than 48 hours - much less for two whole weeks.

I'll still keep the line and hooks, though.
 
I've pretty much left fishing gear out of my survival gear. I carry some line in my sewing kit that could be pressed into fishing duty, and also include no more than 2 or 3 hooks. Fishing gear is more easily improvised than many other items.
 
are training, training, training!

If you carry fishing gear but never attempt to use it in training or never have fished, then I think you will run into problems. But if you go fishing now then you have the skill/knowledge necessary to be a successful fisherman.

In Ron Hoods survival camping video, there is a member of his group which could a fish with a make shift rod and a fishing kit from his mini kit. if I remember correctly it didn't take days only an hour or so. In fact in that video all the members had to catch some food either by trapping or fishing or whatever.

Another point is hunting and fishing are proactive actions to survive where someone's hope might be too dependent on waiting to be found. hunting and fishing say whatever happens I am gonna make it through this!


if the rescuers don't come when expected a person who is lost can really panic to the point they become self destructive. hunting and fishing keeps things in perspective.
 
I really appreciate all the responses. This is exactly what I was looking for.

One vital point that has just come up is the fact that most folks are rescued within 48-72 hours. I've been hungry that long before (wrestled through high school & college -- and was too lazy to lose weight before the season :rolleyes: ).

No, I don't plan on sitting on my ass and waiting if walking out makes more sense. And there's enough stuff in my gear to gig fish if necessary. The real point behind all of this is a complete reevaluation of my PSK. That means questioning every single item in it for its value.

Perhaps some context would help. I have what could be considered three "layers" of mobile gear. We won't even get into what's in the tornado supplies at home :rolleyes: .

I have on me (or with me) a cell phone, Leatherman Juice, Zippo lighter and large Sebenza at all times.

Up front in the car is an ABC fire extinguisher, Atwater Carey Expedition first aid kit augmented and tailored to my needs, Leatherman Wave, SureFire 6P with spare batteries and a SureFire 9N rechareable.

In the trunk are:

1) Big box: This is a 3'x4' (I think) Rubbermaid box in the trunk. It holds an air compressor w/flat fixing goo, jumper cables, gas can, funnel, folding shovel, 8'x10' tarp, a 5'x6' wool blanket, hiking boots and basic tools.

2) Carry Bag: This is my old Jansport college bookbag. It also goes into the big box, but is packed separately so I can carry it with me if necessary. It's got another first aid kit, extra wool socks, two liters of water, antiseptic wash, rain poncho, magnesium fire starter with tinder tabs, Potable Aqua, folding knife & dogbone sharpener, DEET-heavy insect spray, work gloves, duct tape, 100' of paracord, power bars, titanium coffe mug, Esbit pocket stove & heat tabs, lifeboat matches and a large fixed-blade knife. I'll probably add a couple of tea & coffe bags.

3) PSK: This is a small zip-lock poly bag with wire saw, Fox Mini-40 whistle, Photon II microlight, lifeboat matches, ferro rod, bandaids & ibuprofin, 10' of monofilament line, heavy sewing needle, 2 tinder tabs & signal mirror.

As I said, I'm in the process of completely re-evaluating the PSK, which is why I asked the question in the first place. I'm trying to keep it as small as possible while still being useful. The PSK is intended for the pants or coat pocket at all times. It is the last-ditch, cryin' in the woods, all your gear gone and nobody love you no more, livin' a Delta blues song kit :D .

So, how am I doing with it (and do I really need a fishing kit)?

Take care,
Chad
(cross posted in so many forums that I'm having trouble keeping track :rolleyes: )
 
Carl hit the nail on the head. I wasn't questioning the value of line (or even hooks & sinkers), but of their use as food procurement.

The best response I've seen is:

Originally posted by chrisaloia
Another point is hunting and fishing are proactive actions to survive where someone's hope might be too dependent on waiting to be found. hunting and fishing say whatever happens I am gonna make it through this!
Click to expand...

This really makes sense to me. I can see fishing and snare making as proactive morale boosters rather than sitting around feeling sorry for yourself.

Again, this is exactly the kind of debate/exchange I was hoping for. Good points on both sides with solid reasoning. I appreciate it.

Chad
 
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