Psychology of survival

Joe Duder

Joe Duder

Joined
Jan 22, 2013
Messages
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You can have the perfect knife, kit and skills, but if you don't keep a good frame of mind, things can go bad faster than one thinks they can.

I stumbled upon this video today and thought some of you guys would enjoy and possibly benefit from it.

Enjoy.

[video=youtube_share;RkywHVooL_E]http://youtu.be/RkywHVooL_E[/video]
 
Good find Duder -- in concurrence with your finding, (my .02 cents here) no piece of kit can replace a solid psychological foundation for survival / readiness or good technique.
 
xxwjtxx said:
Good find Duder -- in concurrence with your finding, (my .02 cents here) no piece of kit can replace a solid psychological foundation for survival / readiness or good technique.
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I completely agree.

Not to open a can of worms here, but take a look at Cody Lundin. He actually teaches survival for thousands of dollars a class. Teaching in his own environment and conditions that is. He was taken out of that scenario and thrown a partner and into environments that he wasn't used to. Conditions and situations didn't go the way he anticipated or used to and you can clearly see him start to crack. If it had been a real situation I'm quite sure his partner would have left him behind to fend for himself and then he would have really been in trouble. It just goes to show, we're all good at surviving in our own environment and conditions, but what happens when we are taken out of our element and things start falling apart all over?
 
I love Mears. I think one of you guys has his bushcraft quote in your signature:

"Bushcraft is what you carry in your mind and in your muscles"
 
solid4ever said:
I love Mears. I think one of you guys has his bushcraft quote in your signature:

"Bushcraft is what you carry in your mind and in your muscles"
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I like him too. Unlike the other outdoors men or survivalists (what ever that means), he makes bushcraft and thriving in the bush look easy and almost elegant.
 
Joe Duder said:
I like him too. Unlike the other outdoors men or survivalists (what ever that means), he makes bushcraft and thriving in the bush look easy and almost elegant.
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Well said. I think so too. I certainly have a great deal of respect for the skills that the other crop of TV show survivalists display, but Mears separates himself from them in that he seems to genuinely love the work. It always seems like a battle with the other guys. MAN VS. THE WILDERNESS. this epic battle of survival. Ray has this almost academic quality to him. Like a professor of bushcraft. He seems to authentically love being in those settings. And those 'survival' moments with him seem to be reduced to "fun things you can do outside (while shipwrecked)". I can't watch 10 minutes of those other guys. I've got every Ray Mears show on tape.
 
Love Mr. Mears. In a survival situation, together with Ray you'd come out of the wild fatter than when you stepped into it. That's the kind of knowledge and security level I like.
 
Thanks for the video Joe. I'll check it out tonight. Can't say that I agree with you about Cody Lundin. I think he defines calm and relaxed in the outdoors. Seems to me he was always the sensible one on Dual Survival while Dave or Joe were doing off the wall dangerous stuff. And doing it all barefoot, or in wool socks if he was in the mountains, ... that is outdoor elegance at its finest.

I'll add Tom Brown to the discussion too. I took his Standard class about 4 years ago and was very impressed. He talked a lot about the notion and mindset of 'survival' (a phrase which conjures up images of panic and fear), and that once you were comfortable in the outdoors with next to nothing you were no longer surviving, you were just living on the Earth like we've been doing since the beginning of time - which is a very relaxed mindset, shifting from fighting against nature to living in harmony with it.

I'd also like to say that I have heard over and over again people wanting to say who is the BEST wilderness man out there. Who cares. Lots of people are good in the wild. Lots. To me that is like saying who makes the best knives? Well of course it has to be Fiddleback! Ask Andy though and he'll rattle off ten guys who are better than he is and that he'll never be that good. Lots of people make good knives is my point, and lots of people excel in extreme and trying conditions in the outdoors. In case this sounds snarky it isn't at all meant to, and thanks again for the thread.
 
Great post Ken! I agree completely. I have taken taken classes from all sorts of folks including Tom Brown Jr. as well as the folks on the other end of the survival spectrum. I find that with the right mind set I can learn something from just about anybody even if it is what not to do. I usually end up spending the most time with the ones that have something to teach that others don't. I have learned some good bushcraft techniques from some great teachers, but Tom Brown Jr. gave me a different way to see the world. I use the awareness and tracking I learned from him ever day and once it helped me play a role in helping saving someone's life.
From the folks I know who know Cody Lundin personally, they all say he is the real deal. From the few episodes I saw, it seemed like they were always trying to build up the interpersonal drama and just the drama of the show in general for tv's sake. I think most of those shows try to build in and amplify as much drama as possible because that is what most people want. If I am going to watch one of those shows, it is to learn any skills I can or get new ideas. I try not to pay much attention to the rest.
I have been working with kids in the outdoors for about fifteen years. One thing about the survival shows is that they get a lot of kids stoked on being outside and learning bushcraft skills. I think that is pretty cool.
 
Seems to me he was always the sensible one on Dual Survival while Dave or Joe were doing off the wall dangerous stuff. And doing it all barefoot
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I love you Ken, but that sounds like a contradiction if I've ever heard one. I used to like Cody a whole lot, but his passive aggressive, egotistical, patronizing attitude just got old. I didn't like how Cody would try to patronize Dave and Joe every time they suggested something that Cody disagreed with. I've coached sports and instructed on the job training. When you treat people as children it changes their whole attitude towards you and the job and it takes the fun out of learning. In a real survival situation I'm sure his attitude could make things go bad very fast.

Did you see the last couple of episodes of dual survival?
 
Hey guys, been a little busy as I've been studying after work everyday for a certification exam later this year, but since this topic is one of my passions, I'll take a quick breather to put in my .02 (well, more like couple of disjointed bullet points):

- All these people mentioned above know their stuff, and if you take what they have to "teach" under the context of the environment they typically work in, I think many of us will learn a lot about not just "survival," but actually learn how to coexist with nature. Dave Canterbury for example prefers to use the phrase wilderness self-reliance instead of survival...learning to smooth it instead of roughing it in the wild.

- I did see the last episode of dual survival with Cody (which was more of the behind the scenes bonus episode than an actual DS episode), and some of Cody's behavior did seem a little irrational (and even disconcerting) to me. I must admit, I was never very fond of him because I too found him a bit judgmental and preachy. And I wasn't too fond of how he jabbed at Dave Canterbury after Dave was fired from the show. Dave posted a video subsequently apologizing for embellishing his resume (which he probably should've done awhile back, for example when people started asking about his background at the BuschraftUSA forum), but I didn't think it was necessary for Cody to post a memo on his website criticizing Dave's character (because seriously, hasn't he, Cody, and all of us lied before?) With all that said, I wouldn't be surprised if I met Cody in person (through his class for example), and ended up liking and respecting the guy because 1. I'm sure he knows his $hit, and 2. We know that DS is for entertainment and the way the "hosts" are depicted can be unfair and different from their typical character. For example, compare Dave C.'s personality from DS, and how he is on his YouTube channel. And I've also met Dave in person through his school, and found him to be very different than how he was on DS. Same thing goes for Tom Brown, there are a lot of disparate opinions about his character.

- At the end of the day, we as "consumers" of such materials and the ones who're providing them are all people, and we all make mistakes, or even knowingly do wrong things. But there are a lot of good work being done by all these experts, and I wish they could all respect one another, and facilitate an environment of learning and sharing of knowledge. That wasn't a very smooth transition to a conclusion I must admit, but I lost my train of thought towards the end, and I must get back to work :P

I guess the real conclusion is, Fiddleback kicks A$$~
 
catalystman80 said:
2. We know that DS is for entertainment and the way the "hosts" are depicted can be unfair and different from their typical character.
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^^^ This. The producers of all these entertainment shows care about one thing: ratings. And while I hate it with every fiber of my being, drama sells. If Cody or Dave or anyone else for that matter get along well, work together, and succeed in self rescue (or whatever the goal is), there is no show. Because only us wilderness geeks would be interested. In order to reach a broader audience, they select clips that make their figures look petty and arrogant. The worse these "heroes" looked the better we feel about our messed up lives.

I've never met any of them or had any formal survival type training (though that sounds awesome). But I would not dare judge someone based on how a tv producer chose to present them. I know all to well how easily comments and situations can be taken out of context.


Michael
 
Joe Duder said:
I love you Ken
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Aw, shucks. Love you too Duder!

Joe Duder said:
I didn't like how Cody would try to patronize Dave and Joe every time they suggested something that Cody disagreed with.

Did you see the last couple of episodes of dual survival?
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I thought they both patronized each other's approach, probably largely by the design of the show - dual survival, more than one way to do things, and we'll show you two perspectives from the relative safety of a scripted situation.

I have only seen one or two episodes with Joe in them, so my perspective is really from the first couple of seasons with Dave & Cody.

I remember one particular episode when Dave took off at dusk to go hunting. Cody thought it was ridiculous for Dave to go out alone, or for the two of them to go out (too dangerous) and that Dave's actions put them both in harm's way. What happens if Dave gets hurt or lost? Meanwhile, Dave says the exact same thing but from the other side of the coin, i.e. Cody is letting the team down by not supporting his partner as backup in the hunt. And without food they're toast in the long run. So... they're both right. It all depends on which perspective you take - play it safe or push the limits of the situation. What I heard as I watched the show was both of them bickering about the other's technique or decision making process. And it seemed equal to me but maybe I had blinders on because I liked them both.

It is important to remember that it is a tv show and they can edit it however they like. As other's have said, drama sells. Dylan talks a lot about the reality of filming and being a part of Top Shot and how different it was from what ended up airing on tv. My hope is to get to train with Cody someday (it has been on my radar of things to do) and I can give a fully biased report once I'm back. :D
 
I've heard that the last couple of episodes were a bit off for Cody. Haven't seen them yet but I'm curious to.

In that hunting example above I think a lot of their perspective comes from what they are comfortable with. For instance Cody always seemed content to eat bugs, larvae, roots, and plants. But Dave thought that wasn't food, he was gonna find a pig or a rabbit. So, one guy is content to sit tight and eat grubs while they other says no way where's the meat?

On another note, I've never even heard of Mr. Mears so I'm glad to have his stuff to look forward to. Sounds like he is a genuine champion of the wilderness.
 
I like Joe and Cody for their different virtues. I think the inner douche was getting the better of both of them near the end. That and Cody just seemed burnt out with the show
 
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