Quality files for axe work

W

Wayne Tabor

Joined
Nov 3, 2020
Messages
1
I need a source for a quality file for profiling axes. Nicholson files are no longer good or reliable since they are being made in Mexico and Brazil. Most European files seem to be out of stock everywhere I look.
 
I have actually had good luck with the modern Nicholson files, not as long lasting as the old US made black diamonds but the QC is good and they're always well formed.

Yes look through the files at an Ace Hardware or True Value hardware , especially a locally owned location in a small town where old stock tends to hang around.
There was still a loads of US made Craftsman until last year at my local hardware ( I bought up everything I k e I could use ) and they still have US made Nicholson file cards and file handles in stock.
The files are all imports now though.
 
My best files are Black Diamond, I also like Kearney and Foot, Simmons and American Nicholson. They cane be bought for a couple of dollars each at flea markets or yard sales. They may be rusty and seem dull but a good cleaning with a wire wheel, will leave them clean and sharp.

Bill
 
I file a lot of axes. Full grinds too. And I buy 12" Nicholson mill bastard files from Home Depot. Yes, they are made in Mexico, but that cut just as good as any other file at first. I get about 5 or 6 axes out of each file. Which equates to hours of filing. Between 8-12 hours of filing.


crbnSteeladdict said:
http://www.grobetusa.com/8-INOX-hand-file-cut-00-item-30-213v/
Click to expand...

CrbnSteeladdict has here suggested the finest file money can buy. Also the hardest at HRC72. Grobet are swiss cut though. I buy either 0 or 00 cut. That's the most coarse and second most coarse they offer.
And 8" is the longest I've been able to find. That said, for ultra hard temper and for getting through the oxidation layer nothing beats a Grobet Inox file!
Good luck!
 
I have to wonder how they manage to attain a hardness that high. Most testing equipment can't even register a reading that high accurately due to limitations of the testing equipment/method, and the highest hardness I've seen cited of a fully quenched steel is about 68 after quench and cryo. They may use a vapor deposition coating of some kind on them.
 
I'm not familiar with how they further harden them beyond what is attainable by conventional methods. As you say, I think it's done chemically.
Nor can I really vouch for them being that hard, because I don't have testing equipment nor any real experience in determining hardness.
All I know is when a brand new Nicholson skates, it's time to grab the Inox!
The one I'm currently using is 00 cut, and it produces filings so small that it works great on mushrooming too. You very rarely have to clean the file out. Just wipe the filings off every so often.
What I'd like to know is this, let's say for the sake of argument that their advertised hardness of 72 is correct. What is the maximum hardness an HRC72 file can cut? 68? 70? 72?
Because I have several hatchets, dinne chisels (of course) and a couple axes that this file just can not cut!
I'm talking stupid hard. Knock your socks off hard! Diamond stones were the only way to achieve an edge. And lots of time.
The Inox files do last though. I've learned be mindful to not tap the file back down on to the axe after resetting to begin another file stroke. They are so hard that I broke tiny pieces off from many teeth doing that with my first one. This second one is over a year old and still cuts unbelievably well.
 
Yankee Josh said:
I'm not familiar with how they further harden them beyond what is attainable by conventional methods. As you say, I think it's done chemically.
Nor can I really vouch for them being that hard, because I don't have testing equipment nor any real experience in determining hardness.
All I know is when a brand new Nicholson skates, it's time to grab the Inox!
The one I'm currently using is 00 cut, and it produces filings so small that it works great on mushrooming too. You very rarely have to clean the file out. Just wipe the filings off every so often.
What I'd like to know is this, let's say for the sake of argument that their advertised hardness of 72 is correct. What is the maximum hardness an HRC72 file can cut? 68? 70? 72?
Because I have several hatchets, dinne chisels (of course) and a couple axes that this file just can not cut!
I'm talking stupid hard. Knock your socks off hard! Diamond stones were the only way to achieve an edge. And lots of time.
The Inox files do last though. I've learned be mindful to not tap the file back down on to the axe after resetting to begin another file stroke. They are so hard that I broke tiny pieces off from many teeth doing that with my first one. This second one is over a year old and still cuts unbelievably well.
Click to expand...

Chances are good, in that case, that the file itself is a conventional file of good, high hardness, but then an additional coating is applied to create an extra hard skin on the outside. Hardness testing files are usually graduated in steps of 5 RC, and materials of equal hardness will scratch one another. The larger the difference in hardness the more effective the cutting action will be, and the less wear will occur to the abrading implement. In the case of axes even your Inox file skates on, the skin has probably worn off of the teeth on that one and/or you may be dealing with a layer of magnetite (black oxide) on the surface of the axe, which is about 70 HRC. Scuff up the surface with a sharpening stone to reveal bright steel and see if it'll bite then.
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
Chances are good, in that case, that the file itself is a conventional file of good, high hardness, but then an additional coating is applied to create an extra hard skin on the outside. Hardness testing files are usually graduated in steps of 5 RC, and materials of equal hardness will scratch one another. The larger the difference in hardness the more effective the cutting action will be, and the less wear will occur to the abrading implement. In the case of axes even your Inox file skates on, the skin has probably worn off of the teeth on that one and/or you may be dealing with a layer of magnetite (black oxide) on the surface of the axe, which is about 70 HRC. Scuff up the surface with a sharpening stone to reveal bright steel and see if it'll bite then.
Click to expand...
I've been at it long enough to know that man.:D I was either through the oxidation layer or none was present on the ones I'm talking about. . This steel is legitimately so hard that a brand new Grobet wouldn't cut it. I was still using my first one at the time, but was keeping another brand new one (the one I'm now using) in its paper wrapping for use only on such occasions.
I've done over 150 full grinds now and there's a few that are so hard it beggars belief. Most are within a given range, some are excellent and a few are truly exceptional. But those hard ones are beyond my normal scale of thinking about hardness.
I always figured that like hardness would at least scratch like hardness, as you said.
Isn't HRC68 the hardest regular carbon steel can achieve?
 
About, yeah. So chances are the 72 RC is not accurate. You should at least be scratching the steel if it's equal in hardness. Especially since it's just plain-jane carbon steel used in old axes. 1095 as-quenched only attains about 66.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top