Quality knife for under $60?

Joined
Mar 31, 2001
Messages
88
My birfday is comin' up in a while, and i want a new knife.. Right now all i have is a jag. I beat the crap out of it. I play with it entirely too much. I'm glad i have no social life, because it would get in the way of my manipulating. Anyway, i want to get a quality knife for my b-day... All i've heard so far is the only readily available knives that are quality at all are jags and BMs (although i know jags aren't quality... but i mean, not terrible.) Is it just me, or is something kinda whack here? There are only 2 knives that don't suck being produced? One being $15, and the other being $150... 10 times more expensive... Needless to say, i can't afford a BM (sides, i'd rather wait to see what comes out in the future before i'd drop that much cash, even if i had it..).. Although i could get a knife maybe up to $60 (even that would be on the expensive side for me...). Is there any quality knives that i could afford?? I don't want to have to end up asking for the whole line of jags for my Bday, when i know i'm just going to have to be working on them replacing crap like pins and tightening them and using liquid metal like every day... Yeah, BTW, thanks for all the knowledge you guys pass on... I wouldn't have a clue if it weren't for all o' yas-
-Gibberish*
 
You may just want to hold on for awhile, or get another Jag to hold your attention till Oct. IIRC, Mike mentioned that a major manufacturer was planning to release a nice balisong with a target price of 49.99, and bring it out in Oct. I think they're looking to grab that middle market between BM's and Jags as well.
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">is something kinda whack here? There are only 2 knives that don't suck being produced?</font>

There are lots of quality knives being produced, but most of them are not balisongs.
Balisongs are a bit of an exotic item. They're illegal in more places than not. Many dealers even in places where they are legal, don't want to carry 'em for whatever reason. Finally, the balisong is actually a deceptivly difficult knife to make and make well.

Due in no small part to the high activity on this forum, several manufacturers are reconsidering this market right now. But, developing and introducing a new product is very expensive. I have no idea what BM paid for the moulds for the 42's handles. But, based on prior experiences with this sort of thing, a hundred grand would not surprise me. Add another fifty grand for factory tooling. Plus a couple of man-years of R&D time, and you can see that BM dropped a good fraction of a million on this project. That's what it costs to bring a product to production.
But, there's other things to consider too. A company can only support a certain number of new product development projects at one time. They have only a certain number of people, limited facilities, and limited money. They have to pick the projects that they think have the best chance for success.

Finally, a company can only keep a certain number of models in production at one time. If nothing else, there's only a certain number of square feet of floor space in the factory. A successful company is one that allocates those resources to the highest return and most successful products.

A balisong project is an exotic with a limited and restricted market. It's a risk. It's a risk economically, but it's a risk politically for whomever champions it.

If you're the marketing VP at a major knife company and you decide to commit your company's resources to a conventional tactical folder three things are true: First, nobody's going to object. Second, you're gonna have some success with it. You can always just cut the price a bit because people will buy a tactical folder. It's a proven, well-established market. Besides, if all else fails, you can always blow 'em out through K-Mart or something and at least recoup your investment. And, third, even it sales and return-on-investment fall short of expectations, well, it'll be ok. Afterall, you made a sound decision to pursue a well-known product in a well-established market. You can always blame it on manufacturing or sales anyway.

But, if you decide to do a balisong, three very different things will be true: First, you're gonna have a hard time selling the idea internally. You're gonna face a thousand objections like, "We've never done anything like that before. We don't know the first thing about balisongs. How do you know they'll sell? What if they don't? We don't know how to sell that? What if the dealers refuse it? Can't we just do something we know, another nice simple tactical folder where we know what we're doing and can be assured of at least minimal success?" Second, if they don't sell, you're company's gonna be stuck with 'em. K-Mart is not an option. And third, if sales and return don't beat every conventional tactical folder the company has ever done, you're gonna be looking for a new job for having suggested such a stupid, risky, unknown thing as a balisong when we could have used those resources on a tactical folder that would have done better.

Fortunately, BM has proven the market with the 42. BM took those risks and made those committments because BM belives in balisongs all the way up to the corner office. brought the 42 out with modest expectations. They had no idea that this thing would be the home run that it's been.

The litte guy who's never struck out, but never done anything really great just stepped up the plate. The coach isn't expecting much. Maybe a base hit. A ground double if we're lucky. But all of the sudden the ball's over the fence and he's taking a walk around the bases. Nobody expected that!

Why have so many people had to wait for months for a 42? Simple. BM tooled up to build about a hundred a week. On the day they started production, they already had the second largest backorder in the history of the company! They worked to make a hundred a day on equipment designed to make a hundred a week and got that down to with just a few hundred when all of the sudden there was a second surge of orders. And the order line hasn't stopped ringing yet!

This has proven the market for balisongs and made it possible for other companies to think about balisongs.

I doubt very seriously that Microtech would have considered a balisong product if BM had not done the 42.

The 42 proved this market and, by doing that, made balisong products thinkable for other makers.

But, thinking about a product and actually having one to sell are two different things. It takes time to develope a new product. This is especially true when the new product is rather different from anything you're currently doing.

In a year, I think the balisong market will be dramatically different than it is now. But, for the moment, we've got:

Charming China Cheapies

Jaguars

Benchmade

A few custom makers


(While I don't know anything official, as far as I can tell Bear has discontinued their balisong line. They were recently purchased and, I suspect, their new owner wanted to "focus the product line".)


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Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com
 
Hey Chuck!

Ironically, I have mould making and spin casting capabilities at my facilities.
smile.gif


We could have allot of fun with that technology!
wink.gif
 
Thanks for the insight. I know that making balisongs is a risky endevour and whatnot, i was just curious (EXTREMELY HOPEFUL) to see if there was some knife that i missed over... I don't want to have to buy jags until october : (... I know that microtech has some stuff up their sleeves, i've been reading the forum constantly... Just making sure i haven't missed something... The bears look like a good choice, but i hear the handles snap and what not, which sounds like a jip... woof... i'm depressed now.... there is no hope for me-
-Gibberish*
 
www.knifeshop.com has the Herbertz Balis. these might be better than the Jags and Bears (I havent seen newly made Bears in awhile, whats up?) Also the italian ones wont hold up to daily use but they sure are purty (www.skm.to)
Happy early Birfday

Nate
 
They look close they have elongated slots on the handles and I know Herbertz makes some good quality knives. Im not sure about butterflys though. If you arent sure what they look like, I can email you a pic or if enough of you want it I can post it here and I stand corrected, my email from they quotes the price at $20 USD and says Magnesium handles, however the website says Zinc Handles and $17 USD (S&H not incl of course) they have Damascus Bear bowie bladed Bali's too and the cheap Chinease knives for like $7 USD. My suggestion is to email them about shipping if you live in the US since importation is a sticking point. When I ordered some knives from a company in europe that werent legal here, Customs swiped them but all I got was a letter saying that I must have not realized they werent legal and I was free to come claim them (which I did not do) HOWEVER a note to anyone who choses to import questionable objects: My neighbors wife is the Post Master (Mistress?) here and she told me after she found out what happened (because I was concerned about getting fined or arrested) "If you get material seized often enough, they'll "flag" your address and watch all overseas shipments. Due to the 'net, people make shipping mistakes all the time so unless is some ANFO or something similar, they'll usually let you go" I only offer this as some firsthand and factual knowledge since we are dealing with overseas companies. I am not advocating importing illegal goods in anyway however.
As a sidenote, I have bought all my knives from people here in NY so as far as carrying them home in my hand to and from my car when I bought them, I wasnt breaking the law as far as I know. But, if I buy a balisong that was shipped into the US, before I owned it, is that balisong more illegal to own than say my BM 42?

I know this is way off topic and I appologize but the first line or so fits
wink.gif
 
I think when jags and stuff are imported into the US they are not assembled yet, or something-
-Gibberish*
 
I like the way those italians look but they don't hold up. There sole purpose seems to be filleting up another. But I actually have found that they make great fruit knives or steak knives!:P

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I have a sword in my pocket!
 
You might try to find some Bear MGC. I have 2 they are damascus blades a drop point and a tanto style. I've had them for a couple of yrs. and their still pretty solid, and their made in the USA. Smokey Mt. Knife works carried them, their site is www.eknifeworks.com.
 
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