Question about sharpening stones

[ffp]

i've seen alot of sharpening videos, including lot of murray carter and read sharpening material and i'm wondering if it's possible to get a razor sharp edge in a knife without expensive stones. In my country this good stones are a bit expensive.
So, i have this norton stone here:

and was thinking to buy this one which have two faces:

I want to know if i can get the razor sharp edge with any of these stones and if i can, what's the difference to do it with this one or the 1k-6k grit stones (time wasted sharpening, maybe?).

Also, i don't know the grit of those stones, can somebody tell me that?

 

[Nullity]

Plenty of people achieve sharp edges with cheap stones. It is more about knowing how to sharpen than the stone.
Murray Carter advises a 2 stone setup, a coarse and a fine.

Make sure to make/get a leather strop. It really helps me get a refined edge.

 

[yoda4561]

If by razor edge you mean an edge that easily shaves armhair, you can do it with almost anything, including paving bricks, coffee mugs, and the matte finished edges on a rolled down car window. A 2 sided norton india or crystolon will put a shaving, aggressive cutting edge on most knives. The crystolon will cut almost anything you throw at it, the india leaves a finer edge. You may as well get a good quality norton because even those are only 18-30 dollars for a coarse/fine 8x2 combo stone. If you're talking about barber straight razor level sharpness, you'll need MUCH finer (and yes, more expensive) stones to get there.

edit: Regarding grits, it's something like 100/280 for the crystolon coarse fine, and 100/320 for the india coarse/fine. The stones you pictured should be crystolon or some other variety of silicon carbide in the same grit range. This thread shows you what that grit level is capable of with great care and just a small bit of refinement. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...th-a-coarse-edge-off-Norton-Sil-Carbide-Stone

 

[ffp]

I didn't mean barber razor sharp, just sharp enough to shave arm hair and an edge that wont be easily dulled. So, even the one in the first picture, which i have right now is enough to get this edge? It doesn't have 2 faces.

 

[yoda4561]

That first one is probably a coarse or extra coarse crystolon, it's possible to get an edge that shaves but it will likely hang and tear on something as delicate as tissue/toilet paper.

 

[HeavyHanded]

I didn't mean barber razor sharp, just sharp enough to shave arm hair and an edge that wont be easily dulled. So, even the one in the first picture, which i have right now is enough to get this edge? It doesn't have 2 faces.

Keep in mind, the combination stone you pictures is not a waterstone. As relates to Murray Carter, you could emulate his "scrubbing" method of grinding that he demonstrates on his 1K waterstone, but you will not be able to emulate the backhoning or stropping technique he uses on his 6k. When working a hard oil stone, you'll get best results finishing with a light edge leading stroke. To use his backhoning method you'd need some polishing compound of some sort and a stropping surface - this could be as simple as a piece of hard leather or paperboard. My favorite simple set-up consists of a combination stone some white compound, and a few sheets of paper. When I've finished sharpening off the fine side of the combination stone (I use mineral oil as a lube), I'll collect the oil, stone, and steel "mud" from the surface of the stone using a sheet of paper. Wrap this paper around the stone and use it for a strop. You'll wind up with a real nice-cutting edge capable of shaving arm hair no problem. If you want a more refined edge, wrap a fresh sheet of paper around the stone and apply some fine polishing compound to it. Use this for a strop. Either way, a plain dry sheet of paper makes a nice finish strop.

The canoe stone in the first picture might give you a nice enough edge, difficult to tell. I believe they come in different grit ratings, a fine one will work well but the combi stone is a better choice for smaller knives. The canoe stone is mostly for larger tools.

 

[ffp]

Thanks.
So I'll buy this 2 face stone.

It's my first sharpening so maybe i don't get a good edge easily. I'm planing to reprofile my edge with the first face until it gets sharp and then finish with the fine face. Always removing burr sliding the blade on wood every 5 strokes on the stones. And after that i'll strop with a piece of leather or news paper.

Just checking if i got all the procedure right

 

[ffp]

English is not my primary language so could you please explain what is "backhoning"? And what stropping technique he uses in 6k stones?

Also, should i use water on this two faced stone? (i don't have the oil)

I've seen carters using news paper and cardboard, what is they for? They are better than the fine side of this stone? (

 

[yoda4561]

I prefer water, you can use them dry too. If you do try oil in the future, you want a lightweight oil, like lamp oil or a kerosene/oil blend.

 

[HeavyHanded]

English is not my primary language so could you please explain what is "backhoning"? And what stropping technique he uses in 6k stones?

Also, should i use water on this two faced stone? (i don't have the oil)

I've seen carters using news paper and cardboard, what is they for? They are better than the fine side of this stone? (

Backhoning is the same as stropping, only done on a stone. There is a distinct shift in how he uses each stone (1k, 6k). The 1k is for grinding a fresh cutting edge, the 6k is for refining that edge. He normally doesn't use a lot of leading strokes on his 6k if any. You cannot do that one the fine side of a combination stone, its not the same composition as a waterstone.

Mineral oil is sold at pharmacies as a laxative. Any oil can be used, even thin cooking oil - you'll want to wash the stone well with soap and water after using. You can use water, or soapy water and it will help but thin oil is a better choice in my humble opinion - its what most stone manufacturers offer for sale with their products.

The stone can also be used dry but you'll want to wash it well after using.

The paper and cardboard are used to remove any lingering burrs and provide a final polish to the edge.