Questions about two different blade steels

S

StormRunner

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Dec 5, 2012
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Hello I am wondering about two different types of blade steels.

EN45 & RWL-34

What are the pros and cons of each steel type?

Is RWL-34 as strong as the carbon steel en45?, or is the powdered stainless steel weaker?

Is this powdered steel suitable for most environments? or would EN45 be the best choice?
 
John Grimsmo uses RWL-34 in all of his folders (except damascus obviously) and it seems like a pretty nice steel.
 
From a quick search it appears EN45 is a Carbon spring steel much like 5160 or 9260, A lot different than RWL-34 which is very similar to CPM-154. RWL-34 is a stainless, is generally going to be ran harder, will have noticeably better edge holding (due both to more carbide content and higher hardness). EN45 is definitely going to be tougher, its used more for things like Kukris and swords. RWL-34 is more for folders to small and medium fixed blades, EN45 is more for larger fixed blades and choppers IMO.

EN45
C 0.55%
Si 1.75% (more Si than 5160, so may not perform quite as well)
Mn 0.75%
S 0.05%
P 0.05%
 
RWL-34(is a powdered ,very clean swedish steel) is a similar to ats-34 but with a little vanadium-probably would hold a decent edge,plus good corrosion resistance

en45 carbon spring steel,probably tougher-won't hold and edge as long as rwl-34 ...corrosion prone,

heat treat will obviously have a bearing on all of this.
 
Rwl34 is great stuff. Easy to sharpen, no rust, decent edge holding. I have it in a very thinly ground custom folder and it takes average use on the farm without any problems.
 
Thanks guys for the replies, now what if they were both heat treated to about 57 hrc?, what would be the better blade steel? Or is it just preference? Because it sounds like rwl-34 is strong, tough, can take a scart edge all while being corrosion resistant. While en45 is tough, can take a decent edge but not as long as rwl-34.
Also how would someone keep rust from forming on en45 steel? Would it take constant wiping off of water?, and how fast woukd en45 corrode?
 
StormRunner said:
Thanks guys for the replies, now what if they were both heat treated to about 57 hrc?, what would be the better blade steel? Or is it just preference? Because it sounds like rwl-34 is strong, tough, can take a scart edge all while being corrosion resistant. While en45 is tough, can take a decent edge but not as long as rwl-34.
Also how would someone keep rust from forming on en45 steel? Would it take constant wiping off of water?, and how fast woukd en45 corrode?
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What is the knife supposed to do? Is it a machete? Large chopper? Pocket knife?

57HRC does not mean much if a person heat treating it does not follow heat treat specifications. One can get 57HRC with less then ideal heat treat.
 
Its a reproduction wwii knife, one purpose blade i want for my collection. I ask about the steel because i collect knives that are ready for work. Its a poker pretty much. What would be the optimal heat treat for either steel? What would be the better steel?
 
StormRunner said:
Its a reproduction wwii knife, one purpose blade i want for my collection. I ask about the steel because i collect knives that are ready for work. Its a poker pretty much. What would be the optimal heat treat for either steel? What would be the better steel?
Click to expand...

This is my two cents but since you want a knife for a collection I would advise to go with RWL-34 as it has significant higher corrosion resistance.

Here are pdf's for you to see the heat treat recommendations.

RWL 34 Highest edge strength - Michael West

http://michaelwest.dk/knive/rwl34-datasheet.pdf

From the manufacturer Damasteel:

http://www.damasteel.se/files/7613/6963/9883/Damasteel_Martensitic_Stainless_Steel_RWL-34.pdf

You will notice the recommended tempering temperatures and obtainable hardness range from HRC-58-64. The tempering process of 4 and 5 include deep freezing to -80 degrees Celsius or -140 degrees Fahrenheit. Those are IMO the tempering areas that will provide the best balance between edge retention, toughness and corrosion resistance.

RWL-34 is IMO one of the best all around steels available with high obtainable hardness, corrosion resistance, edge stability, toughness, strength and wear resistance.

If you want higher corrosion resistance have a look at 12C27M from Sandvik, however, to prevent warpage it is recommended to do plate quenching of the steel. Most makers today can do post heat treat grinding however care should be taken not to overheat the steel.

EN45 from my understanding and research is the same as S7.

S7 pdf from Crucible:
http://www.burgessknives.com/media/S7.pdf

S7 falls into the category of a Shock Resistant Tool Steel according to my resource Steel Heat Treatment Metallurgy and Technologies by G. E. Totten.

The following characteristics are expedited.
Resistance to Cracking: Highest of the group
Approximate Hardness: 47-57 HRC
Machinability: Medium
Thoughness: Very High
resistance to Softening: High
Resistance to wear: Low to Medium

Here is an article on enhancing the wear resistance through cryogenic treatment:

Click on this

If heat treated correctly and at HRC of 57 EN45 will outperform RWL-34 in toughness. However, you will have limited corrosion resistance. RWL-34 will be a good balanced steel between properties and require less maintenance.

On your previous question....at 57HRC IMO you are wasting RWL-34. RWL-34 IMO should be somewhere between 62-64HRC with cryo treatment. At 57HRC you will struggle to beat EN45/S7 for toughness.
 
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EN45 would be more similar to that used in a WW11 knife. If that amount of realism is important.
 
StormRunner said:
Its a reproduction wwii knife, one purpose blade i want for my collection. I ask about the steel because i collect knives that are ready for work. Its a poker pretty much. What would be the optimal heat treat for either steel? What would be the better steel?
Click to expand...

MacDonald Arms, right? I'm going with RWL-34 on a second pattern F/S dagger from them mostly for it's corrosion resistance since it won't be a user. For that model's originally intended purpose either steel would do fine with the right heat treatment. The original S/S daggers had forged carbon steel blades.
 
So if a man were heading to afghanistan, what would be the best steel as a user then?
I ask because i would like to know lol, also if say, if for whatever reason the guy going there also was sent to a jungle and then back to afghanistan then what woukd be the better steel for both places? [ For a scenario ]
 
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