Questions for those familiar with the CRKT Sting Dagger...

PocketKnifeJimmy

PocketKnifeJimmy

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Aug 4, 2013
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I had been looking into purchasing a CRKT Sting Dagger.
It was designed by A.G. Russell, with the CRKT version being a licensed copy of it.
AG Russell had them made years ago by the Wingen/Othello company in Solingen Germany, with these CRKT renditions being made in Asia.

That's where my questions comes into play... While searching online for one, I noticed most vendors had them listed as being a made in China product, while a couple vendors had them listed as being made in Taiwan.

I decided to order one, (which I received today), from a very reputable online vendor, one that had the knife listed as "made in Taiwan".

When I looked at the box label, it does read Taiwan.
But, nowhere on the knife itself do I see a marking telling it's country of origin.

So... Were these CRKT Sting Daggers being made in Taiwan all along, with the made in China listings simply being a common mistake?
Or, were these knives being made in China, and then switched to having them made in Taiwan, (or maybe vice versa)?
Also, if these have been made in both countries, is there any way of telling which is China made and Taiwan made, (other than the box label)?
In other words, would one find subtle differences between them?

I purposely sought out to buy it from a vendor that had it listed as "made in Taiwan", and at least as far as the box label states, I got what I wanted.20220526_124459_(1).jpg20220526_124406_(1).jpg

Here's a picture I found online of an original AG Russell Sting, (which were made in Solingen Germany), and it's is a beauty!
While the CRKT version is nowhere near as finely finished as the original, it does well at closely following the original knife's design 👍

Screenshot_20220526-133010_(1).png
 
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PocketKnifeJimmy said:
I was looking into purchasing a CRKT Sting Dagger.
It was designed by A.G. Russell, with the CRKT version being a licensed copy of it.
AG Russell had them made years ago by the Wingen/Othello company in Solingen Germany, with these CRKT renditions being made in Asia.

That's where my questions comes into play... While searching online for one, I noticed most vendors had them listed as being a made in China product, while a couple vendors had them listed as being made in Taiwan.

I decided to order one, (which I received today), from a very reputable online vendor, one that had the knife listed as "made in Taiwan".

When I looked at the box label, it does read Taiwan.
But, nowhere on the knife itself do I see a marking telling it's country of origin.

So... Were these CRKT Sting Daggers being made in Taiwan all along, with the made in China listings simply being a common mistake?
Or, were these knives being made in China, and then switched to having them made in Taiwan, (or maybe vice versa)?
Also, if these have been made in both countries, is there any way of telling which is China made and Taiwan made?
In other words, would one find subtle differences between them?

I purposely sought out to buy it from a vendor that had it listed as "made in Taiwan", and at least as far as the box label states, I got what I wanted.View attachment 1828635View attachment 1828636
Click to expand...
Wow if they are making them in Taiwan I want one now! I have noticed this trend with other daggers from other makers as well. Sometimes being listed as Taiwan and sometimes China. I wonder if they are being pressured by somebody not to use Taiwan so as to not offend the PRC...
 
The listings for these CRKT knives all state them as being made of 1050 or 1055 Hot Drop Forged carbon steel.

I don't know if that means some were made with 1050, and others with the 1055, but I have noticed that as well.
 
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PocketKnifeJimmy said:
I was looking into purchasing a CRKT Sting Dagger.
It was designed by A.G. Russell, with the CRKT version being a licensed copy of it.
AG Russell had them made years ago by the Wingen/Othello company in Solingen Germany, with these CRKT renditions being made in Asia.

That's where my questions comes into play... While searching online for one, I noticed most vendors had them listed as being a made in China product, while a couple vendors had them listed as being made in Taiwan.

I decided to order one, (which I received today), from a very reputable online vendor, one that had the knife listed as "made in Taiwan".

When I looked at the box label, it does read Taiwan.
But, nowhere on the knife itself do I see a marking telling it's country of origin.

So... Were these CRKT Sting Daggers being made in Taiwan all along, with the made in China listings simply being a common mistake?
Or, were these knives being made in China, and then switched to having them made in Taiwan, (or maybe vice versa)?
Also, if these have been made in both countries, is there any way of telling which is China made and Taiwan made, (other than the box label)?
In other words, would one find subtle differences between them?

I purposely sought out to buy it from a vendor that had it listed as "made in Taiwan", and at least as far as the box label states, I got what I wanted.View attachment 1828635View attachment 1828636

Here is a picture I found online of an original AG Russell Sting, (which he had made in Germany).
It is a beauty! The CRKT version does at least follow the basic bones of the design fairly well 👍

View attachment 1828644
Click to expand...

Well here you have it from CRKT itself:
FqgA1LP.jpeg
 
PocketKnifeJimmy PocketKnifeJimmy , good afternoon bud. I'm kinda excited just that they still have them. It's been years ago, but I had what I THINK was the original German made teflon coated version. I'm positive it was black, and about 10 or so years ago. It was a sweet little knife if you want it for it's intended purpose: a smooth and solid little fighting knife.
Problem was I was not wealthy and ended up losing it to a buddy of mine, who'd been dying to get it from me, not literally 😉😁, in a poker game. He wouldn't risk losing it back. Now that I'm reminded of it, I may just have to get me another one. It was a sweet little defensive carry.
If you're thinking of a widdling and carving toy, I don't recommend it. Also double check to be sure if double edged blades are legal to carry where you live. In some states a dagger/boot knife is like a felony illegal weapon.
 
It's too bad that these are done by CRKT instead of Cold Steel.
Cold Steel's Drop Forged series is done with a better grade carbon steel and are better executed in their final milling and finish.

These CRKT versions are okay, but only achieves a mediocre level of execution.
Again, Cold Steel's Drop Forged series of daggers and knives are definitely a higher level in their final milling and finish, including having a more consistent/evenly done sharpening edges, and... are made of a carbon steel that most would consider an upgrade over what CRKT uses to make the Sting. The Cold Steel drop forged knives have an awesome buttery smooth finish throughout... Not so much on the CRKT, which does leave some evidence of the forging and milling operations done on it.

Not bad, CRKT, but a little bit more effort would have really gone a long way.
But, again, for what the item is and it's going price tag... it's not bad.

20220527_022220.jpg20220526_124406_(1).jpg

Btw, how CRKT manages to avoid marking the knife with a country of origin, is beyond me 🤔

Here's a picture I found online of an earlier CRKT Sting with it's markings clearly stating it's grade of steel and country of origin. It also shows none of the milling marks on the blade that mine has, and... it's edge sharpening goes further down the blade and is much better done.

s-l1600.jpg

So, one has to wonder why these markings are not found on current specimens?
I mean, no longer a country of origin, and no longer the steel grade used?... Imo, that seems a wee bit shady. And, with so many reputable websites listing them as "made in China", one has to wonder 🤔
 
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I decided to email CRKT, as another member above did, to ask specific questions about these knives. Here is what I sent, and hope they respond...

I recently ordered and received a CRKT Sting one piece forged steel dagger.

It states it as being a made in Taiwan product on the box label, but has no country of origin markings whatsoever on the dagger itself.

My questions are...

Has your company always sourced these Sting daggers from Taiwan?

If not, are there any tell tale markings that confirm the knife being from one or the other country?

And, why and how are the knives allowed to be sold without a country of origin marking on the dagger itself?

I appreciate any insight you can provide concerning this matter.

By the way, many reputable online vendors/dealers are listing the CRKT Sting as being a China made product.
Not marking the knives with a country of origin makes matters very confusing. Country of origin does still matter to a lot of us consumers.

Again, any insight on this matter will be greatly appreciated.
 
I hope you get an answer. It may be some simple error, or a diabolical conspiracy involving Chinese pressure, or just a bunch of people in tje stores who don't know the difference between Taiwan and China. We get folks in that category here sometimes.
 
Jimmy will get the answer straight from the horse's mouth. In the meantime, I can add my two pence, from what I've seen over the years.
The markings on the blade (country and steel) are not a legal obligation. They are used as a marketing prop or sign of pride or just plain honesty (say what you do and do what you say).
Country of origin : today, if it's not mentioned, means the brand thinks it could deter some customers. So, probably, China. Japan, Taiwan were deterrents to some people years ago but have become synonyms of quality. They would be marked on the blade.
Steel quality : if nothing is marked, you get one of the cheapest option available (probably stainless still, because who nowadays wants a blade thats stains or rusts ?).
Just my thoughts.
Out of curiosity, I checked my CRKT Sting 3B : no country = China. No steel quality = 3Cr13, 5Cr15, 8Cr13Mov.... who knows ? On the other hand, the finish is absolutely correct, with even grinds and clean cutting edges (checked when resharpening it recently : no edge widening or changing shape). However, the central ridge (spine), is slightly off at the tip on one side.
Markings are : Sting 3B A.G. Russell Design, and a serial number (2025), on one side. First Production CRKT. on the other side.
On a side note : A.G. Russell's Stings were not produced only in Solingen OR China. My Sting 3 was produced in Taiwan, with 440C (both printed on the blade) and A.G. Russell was quite proud about it : "it's even better than the first Stings".
 
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There are two Chinas: One is called the People's Republic of China, aka the ChiComs, the other is called the Republic of China, aka Taiwan.

So, "China" can refer to either.
 
Taiwan has earned a reputation for high quality of production. PRC China is currently still very much on the opposite of the quality spectrum. So, really, if a knife is made in Taiwan, I'm pretty sure the brand would mark it on the blade.
 
TC said:
There are two Chinas: One is called the People's Republic of China, aka the ChiComs, the other is called the Republic of China, aka Taiwan.

So, "China" can refer to either.
Click to expand...
Taiwan has never put "China" on their products. They use to use "ROC" (Republic of China) but since the mid 1980s it has been solely "Taiwan".
Even Taiwan's passport now says "Taiwan", whereas in the past it said both "Republic of China" and "Taiwan".
China (PRC) used "PROC" in the mid 90s but then changed to a/k/a plain "China" as an image change. Which stands to date.
This applies not just knives but various export products.
Today "China" refers strictly to the PRC.

lwmWy6.jpg
STkvWC.png
 
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KenHash said:
Taiwan has never put "China" on their products. They use to use "ROC" (Republic of China) but since the mid 1980s it has been solely "Taiwan".
Even Taiwan's passport now says "Taiwan", whereas in the past it said both "Republic of China" and "Taiwan".
China (PRC) used "PROC" in the mid 90s but then changed to a/k/a plain "China" as an image change. Which stands to date.
This applies not just knives but various export products.
Today "China" refers strictly to the PRC.

lwmWy6.jpg
STkvWC.png
Click to expand...

I understand that. Perhaps I should have been more clear: I was referring to some vendor making a statement about the country of origin. They may be a bit more sloppy in that regard. But technically correct.

But I'll agree that "China" is mostly understood to be the PRC.
 
If they choose to respond, I will certainly share their response with you folks here.

My hunch was/is that their current Sting daggers are in fact made in China.
They not having a country of origin on them, where before they did, makes me think that they wanted to keep the origin change under the radar.
So, while I have no proof of any deceiving tactics being done here, the lack of a country of origin marking on these knives, is fishy in itself 🐟

Things that make you go hmmm! 🤔
 
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I own one and, as I have said in another thread, I don't care where a knife is made as long as I like it and the price is "right."

I only bought the CRKT Sting because I couldn't (and still have not yet been able to find) an "original" Sting to buy. Have seen a few over the years but the conditon/price hasn't been "right" yet. So, I'm still looking.
 
Certainly, it's a case of "to each their own".

Me, personally, I want to trust that when the website I order from states that a knife is made in Taiwan, and the product's box states made in Taiwan... That it actually is made in Taiwan 😔

Ymmv, but in my eyes, this ain't good... Especially when the knife itself has no country of origin markings whatsoever 😠

I believe we, as paying customers/consumers, should be able to trust the specifications that the manufacturers say they are. Whether it's steel grade, hardness range, handle material, or country of origin... I should be able to feel comfortable trusting.
I currently own only a few CRKT products, including one of their USA knives that TOPS made under contract for them...
Well, I now know that this Sting dagger is my last CRKT purchase.
 
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