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quick Bowdrill question

RescueRiley

RescueRiley

Joined
Mar 22, 2006
Messages
5,944
While I have ben successful in friction fire making using certain types of woods.
I sometimes notice when I try to use some wods My spindle almost a hard glassy, shiny suface on it... Bad wood selection or Poor technique? any advice would be helpful, Thanks.
 
Sounds to me like wood selection, but I'm about as far from expert as you can get.
 
I'm far from an expert, either, but I'll throw my two cents in here. I made a bow drill set from a dried palm frond (hey, I'm in San Diego; what do you expect?). I have the same thing as far as the end of the spindle and the divot in the hearth being glazed/glassy, but it seems to work just fine. It still produces a hot coal, but it makes the most God-awful squeaking noise when working the spindle. All of the fire bow sets I've ever made — from any wood — got glassy with use, but seemed to work.
 
Could the glassy appearance be from resin in the wood? I would assume something like this would happen if you tried to use pine.

This is only a guess as I still want to make my first one myself.
 
i think it might be resin (although it is not pine or ever green wood).. but once it glasses over there is no chance of getting a coal. one though was that it might occur if I spend to much time doing light strokes (insert misc. masturbatory joke here) while warming up the set.
 
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That seems odd to me, John. Even though mine is glassy, it still produces a coal. Maybe it is the kind of wood, or maybe I'm not understanding just how glassy yours is. You might try tossing a little sand or dirt into the divot and giving it a few strokes (another opening for joke) to break/grind the glaze.
 
Most likely resin. If not a resinous wood it could be either not enough pressure or not enough speed. Some harwoods will glass over too.

For fun, keep the set and try a longer 2 man bow drill. You will be shocked what normally bad woods will produce a coal.
 
Put a few grains of sand in the hole. Must be sand not fine dirt. This will help keep things from glazing.

Soft, dry, non-resinous woods will produce a coal at around 700 degrees.
Hard woods burn at a higher temp, thus require a higher temp to produce a coal. Sometimes as high as 1200 degrees before you get a coal.
1200 degrees is a lot of calories and often the hole will glaze over before you get a coal. A few grains of sand may possibly help to keep from glazing.
 
I have found, more often than not, that technique is the problem when things go sour.

As Kevin alluded to... most woods will work under the right conditions. Glazing is not a big problem. It may get a little noisy... lol... but you can keep going. Its all trial and error. Sometimes you need more pressure, sometimes less... spin faster, spin slower... the solution can vary.

Good luck
Rick
 
Is your spindle and hearth the same wood? Sometimes woods of equal hardness will do that. Try a softer hearth board.
 
Either not enough pressure, or drill material is too hard. Having said that, if drill and hearth are different hardnesses, drill must be the harder, at least in my experience.

What you're doing is essentially fire-hardening the drill tip. (driving the moisture out).

Over the years, I tried using grains of sand - never worked for me, YMMV.

If your drill glazes, take a rough, coarse stone and 'sand' the glaze away, and retry with more pressure. A lot of books tell you to carve away the glaze with your knife, but then you end up with a lot of little facets, that have to be worn down before you maximize the friction between the drill and the hearth. If that doesn't work, find a softer drill. (I'm assuming, of course, that you're not using resinous wood).

Just my 2 cents.

Doc
 
Thanks for the advice..Managed to squeeze a tiny little coal out of it...Just had to bear down hard,,, Thought I was going to drive it through the floor..LOL Great stuff Guys... Thanks.... Reading the dust helped too....It was the right color but not Fuzzy enough..to granular.. which means (get ready for the innuendo) I had to go faster and harder...... Thanks again.
 
dawsonbob said:
I'm far from an expert, either, but I'll throw my two cents in here. I made a bow drill set from a dried palm frond (hey, I'm in San Diego; what do you expect?). I have the same thing as far as the end of the spindle and the divot in the hearth being glazed/glassy, but it seems to work just fine. It still produces a hot coal, but it makes the most God-awful squeaking noise when working the spindle. All of the fire bow sets I've ever made — from any wood — got glassy with use, but seemed to work.
Click to expand...

I know what you mean about that squeaking noise, almost reminds me of a turkey all....LOL I usually put a little sand in the divot... Sometimes that works, other times I've tried sawdust, which actually worked to my suprise.. I'm still in the learning process for the bowdrill as well...
 
Tuxdad said:
I know what you mean about that squeaking noise, almost reminds me of a turkey all....LOL I usually put a little sand in the divot... Sometimes that works, other times I've tried sawdust, which actually worked to my suprise.. I'm still in the learning process for the bowdrill as well...
Click to expand...

I've had squeaks with other types of wood over the years, but the sound from this palm... well, I don't know. It sounds like a small animal being killed. I'm amazed that coyotes don't come running when I use it.
 
I only get glazing when using Desert Ironwood - is this a problem? ;)

I have had this situation when the spindle was too hard. But with more pressure and speed - I could overcome it.

I usually just roughed it back up - a pinch of sand in the hearth - and go for broke.

TF
 
dawsonbob said:
I've had squeaks with other types of wood over the years, but the sound from this palm... well, I don't know. It sounds like a small animal being killed. I'm amazed that coyotes don't come running when I use it.
Click to expand...

The squeaking may be happening because the spindle is not straight.

When I get it as an almost constant squeal it's usually that the top of spindle is off kilter in the handhold because of a crooked spindle head or handhold hole. Check to see if both of the tips line up. Brief, inconsistent squeaks mostly mean my form is not keeping the spindle braced and straight.
 
I do know one thing !! Not to do it too late at night... Puts the neighbors in a rather un-neighborly mood:D... Also will sometimes draw in the stray cats or a fox, if you do it just right...lol
 
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