RBO Grinding Room Build (12'x6.25') - Looking For Advice

J. Keeton

J. Keeton

Joined
Nov 15, 2005
Messages
1,209
Well it's time for me to actually follow though on a grinding room. With my new shop deployment I want to keep the dust down from day 1! I have a space sectioned off that's about 12ft by 6-1/4ft to turn into a grinding room. While it's not quite as wide as I'd like it to be I have limitations due to an attic door.

This is the basic overview of where I'm planning to place it in the shop:


I plan on putting a door and window (for light) on the 12' wall something like this (but the window will be 24x27 and door space designed for 32 pre-hung) :


-------------------

Before I buy the materials and start the project I'm looking for some advice from all of you for features I should incorporate into the room and things to look out for. I've never had a grinding room before so this is uncharted territory.

Some things I'm thinking about:

1.) Size -> Is my space large enough (I think it is, but won't have a ton of room for expansion... With a 32'' door I probably couldn't fit a surface grinder in there... If I get acquire one. (not sure about this - The Grizzly G5963 - 6" x 12" Surface Grinder is 33'' wide so that may fit) - Right now I just have a 2x72 and disc grinder to put in there... maybe a vise stand and angle grinder work too. Also thinking I'll wheel in the buffer when I want to use it.
2.) Walls -> Behind the grinders I'm planning on using metal roof sheeting or concrete Hardie board to protect from sparks. Also considering using thick plastic stapled to the framed walls to seal the room (and make sure the grinders don't ever back up to those walls.
3.) Venting -> I guess I'll consider installing an exhaust fan that exits the building? Maybe with a box fan filtered intake for the room?
4.) Vacuum -> I don't have a metal dust collection system spaced out, but I'm assuming this would need to also fit in the room and potentially exhaust outside into a steel barrel.

-------------------

Here are some old threads I've been browsing on this topic

J. Keeton

Thread 'Show Me Your Grinding Room! - (Please!) :)'

Hey yall, I'm going to be moving to a new shop soon... and I'm going to have the space to frame up a plastic enclosed "grinding room." I'd love to hear and see how some of yall did yours! Any tips and tricks would be greatly appreciated.

This is what I'm looking for:

- Sweet Pictures of your Grinding Room if you have one!
- What tools you have in or think should be in your grinding room? (grinder, buffer, drill press?, welder?, just wondering yall's thoughts on this one)
- Is it worth cutting a hole in the wall for an exhaust fan? or try an internal air filter?
- Any...
  • Like
ep3757

Thread 'Grinder Room or No Grinder Room'

I currently do not have a grinder room in my shop but have been contemplating getting one done. I work sitting down because that is how I got used to working and now have a hard time being steady working on my feet. All of my equipment is right around my work table and I can move from one machine to another in now time but I battle with the dust constantly. The question to you all that have a grinder room is do you find it to be a lot of going back and forth from one area of your shop to another and is it worth it for you. My concern is that I'm a full time maker and time is money for me...
I

Thread 'Small grinding room (closet)'

Hello,

Long time lurker, first time posting. I posed this question over at Iforgeiron, but I figured I’d get more traction here.

So i’ve about had enough of the constant layer of metal dust on EVERYTHING around my small shop. Ive cleared a small corner to build a simple grinding room (closet in this case) and I have a few questions for those of you with such luxury’s.

What is the smallest area you’d feel comfortable with around your grinder? I’ve cleared about a 5x5’ area in a corner, and that’s about the max I could go. Is hoping to squeeze a 2x72 and myself in there a bad idea? I...
A

Thread 'Grinding Room Pros and Cons'

Hey Gang,

I'm currently remodeling my new shop and I've decided that part of the remodel is going to include building a grinding room. I'd like to put my current grinding equipment (2x27, surface grinder) along with a horizontal grinder and maybe one other future purchase.

I don't want to make it too big, I'm thinking around 10'-12' x 15'-20', but I haven't measured this out yet. I'm redoing my floor and now that I have everything on one side of my shop, I'm going to use some masking tape to lay it out.

My goal is to isolate dust, in my last shop dust got into everything.

So if you...
  • Like

-------------------

I'm open to any suggestions here and would love to see pictures if anyone has a grinding room set up!


Cheers,
JKeeton
 
My knife shop is 12'x6'. It is small but it works.

I have my 2x72 grinder on the inside corner of the work bench which really helps with usable work space in the small shop.
 
Focus on dust collection/ventilation flow. I'd put the dustiest machines near the output vent. Leave room for horizontal grinder if possible or at least convertible vert/hor grinder. Looking good!
 
Intake and exhaust fans with filtering on both. Clean air comes in from the rest of the shop, and filtered air exhausts into the shop. This is important if you have heat and A/C.
If you exhaust outside, you will need an outside air intake or it won't work well.
 
As said dust collection is very important ... especially in a small airtight space.

One suggestion would be to move the doot to the center of the wall and put a 30" deep bench across both ends. You can mount a lot of grinding equipment that way and have plenty of room behind you. You will get the same amount of workbench space, but has a 6.25'X7' open area. Two people could be working with no interference.
 
Bill DeShivs said:
Intake and exhaust fans with filtering on both. Clean air comes in from the rest of the shop, and filtered air exhausts into the shop. This is important if you have heat and A/C.
If you exhaust outside, you will need an outside air intake or it won't work well.
Click to expand...
I do plan on having a mini split running in the main shop area. Are you saying that an exhaust fan leading to outside the building won't be ideal in this scenario? Not sure I understand this
 
An exhaust fan leading outside won't work worth a darn unless you have an inlet from outside. Air has to come in before it goes out. Equal pressure, and all that.

If keeping the grinding room temperate is important, the exhaust fan will suck the tempered air out, and replace it with outside air. If keeping the grinding room a comfortable temperature is not important, the outside inlet/exhaust is great. But remember-in the summer it will be hot, and in the winter it will be cold.

The ideal scenario may be to use a dust collection system within the grinding room, with filtered air coming in and going out to the rest of the shop. A large shop vac with HEPA filter may be all you need as a dust collector, but it will be noisy in the grinding room when it's running.

If you trap most of the grinding particulate by using a water-filled spark catch bucket, a dust collection setup within the grinding room that exhausts in the grinding room, and filtered air exchanged with the rest of the shop- you'll be doing better than most people who grind knives.
 
If you're concerned about the size of your door I'd just put a 34" or a 36" door in there. Better to do it now than regret it later, and 2" or 4" shouldn't make all that much difference.

Eric
 
instead of a wall, my grinding area is segregated from the rest of the shop via a translucent tarp held with shower rings to a length of pex I mounted to the ceiling with brackets. I stapled a strip of 6mm poly inside the curtain, covering the gap so the air gets sucked in from above. Behind pegboard, I have 2 10" and 1 20" box fans with furnace filters mounted into boxes I built on the other side of the wall. On the same side of that wall, I have a huge shop vac with a vortex and the pipe from the vortex goes through the wall, coming out just below the rear of my grinder. Over the peg board, I have stainless steel mesh taped on, which captures a lot of the bigger stuff including steel before it hits the furnace filter and I can easily vacuum it off.
fwiw
 
Bill DeShivs said:
An exhaust fan leading outside won't work worth a darn unless you have an inlet from outside. Air has to come in before it goes out. Equal pressure, and all that.

If keeping the grinding room temperate is important, the exhaust fan will suck the tempered air out, and replace it with outside air. If keeping the grinding room a comfortable temperature is not important, the outside inlet/exhaust is great. But remember-in the summer it will be hot, and in the winter it will be cold.

The ideal scenario may be to use a dust collection system within the grinding room, with filtered air coming in and going out to the rest of the shop. A large shop vac with HEPA filter may be all you need as a dust collector, but it will be noisy in the grinding room when it's running.

If you trap most of the grinding particulate by using a water-filled spark catch bucket, a dust collection setup within the grinding room that exhausts in the grinding room, and filtered air exchanged with the rest of the shop- you'll be doing better than most people who grind knives.
Click to expand...
Nice, thanks for the detail!
 
I'll try and sum up some of the main points:
1) Air exchange - Air in - Air out. Whether in and out of the shop or in and out of the building, it has to be one or the other. Outside air is best if the Texas weather allows it. The surface area of the return air IN port should be roughly two to three times the area of the powered exhaust OUT port. Normally, there is no need to have a fan or blower on the return air. A screen to keep bugs and such out is wise.

2) Air filtering - It can be part of the air exchange or separate. Separate is usually better. In a small enclosed grinding room, a hanging independent filter setup is a good choice. Most are HEPA and have a remote control. Most also have a delayed stop feature that runs the fans about 30 minutes after you shut the unit off. This does a lot to clear the air of the superfine dust in it. They regularly go on sale at Woodcraft and are also cheap from places like HF.
NOTE - filters will clog fast. Clean them often. Replace filters regularly. They aren't good forever, even with vacuuming the often.

3) Grinder dust/spark collection - A dedicated dust collector with some sort of spark trap is a must. A metal type dust deputy and a 5-gallon tub make a good one for a small shop. It is often wisest to put it outside the grinding room and route the smooth metal duct through the wall (don't use flex/corrugated duct). Amazon and other places sell the dust deputy top unit fairly cheap and you just add a snug lidded pail as the collector. While it is tempting to get the cheaper plastic dust deputy, for a grinder you really need the metal unit. If you have separate grinders for wood and metal, the plastic units are fine for the wood. A drywall bucket will work for the wood catch bin, but a metal container is needed for the sparks and metal dust. Look for a metal 5-gallon paint container. You can buy new empty 5-galloin pails pretty cheap at paint stores and big-box hardware stores (see image below from Zorro that sells for $16). An HVAC reducer makes a great catch funnel. They come in all sizes and shapes. I like the rectangular and square ones. Home Depot and all the big hardware stores have a big selection as well as all the duct and fittings needed ( see image below). If you have a tight budget, use the shop-vac to run the dust collector and unhook it from the deputy when doing regular cleanup or attaching to other tools like bandsaws. The bigger the shop vac the better.

4) Lighting - You can't have too much light. Put 5K to 6K spectrum LED lights over each work area. At least two 48" light units for a space your size. Attach the to the ceiling, as hanging lights get a thick coat of dust on the topside.
Your window may be nice for someone outside watching, but will be useless for lighting. I have windows down the walls of my grinding booth so I can see out into the shop and people can see me grinding. I just framed the openings and had1/4" glass cut to fit. I used 1/4-round to put it in place. I would suggest you place the window on the end of the long wall at the corner of the open shop area. That way you have sight of the shop and anyone in the shop can see you. I also suggest using a 36" storm door for the entry. Again, clear view or things. Just screw the hinge to the framing studs. That is what I have.

5) Fireproofing - Making the bench tops from metal, cement board, poured cement, or covering them with thin sheet metal is best. Have the grinder arm extend past the bench edge by a good amount to keep the sparks going straight down into the catch trap. Make the walls behind the grinders the same as the bench tops. Hardie/cement board is an excellent choice, as well as sheet metal. Be aware that drilling Hardie and cement board needs carbide bits. The grinding room needs its own 10# to 20# fire extinguisher. CO2 is the best because it will not cover the entire room in white powder that takes days to clean up. Keep trash cans emptied and paper and cardboard out of the grinding room.

6) Floors should be unencumbered and easy to sweep and vacuum. If the concrete is rough surface, consider painting it with an epoxy floor paint. Attaching the benches to the walls on the sides and back eliminates legs. On longer benches, use cantilever legs that go from the wall/floor point to the front of the bench. The arrangement I suggested with two benches at opposite ends of the room works very well for maximizing working floor space. Put the door in the center of the long wall.

7) Using the space wisely - Space in a shop is precious for most folks. I envy those guys with a 60X40 shop, but hear that they even have space issues eventually. Rolling carts are a good answer. In a small grinding room, an HF 18X24" shop cart, or a little welder cart, can hold the accessories, a small shop vacuum, abrasives and belts, etc. It can be moved as needed ... or rolled out of the booth if not needed right now. A second plus is it can be rolled outside the shop and blown off with a leaf blower.. Clear plastic storage bins with tops can be stored under the benches with all sorts of things you want close at hand, but not collecting dust. They are easy to clean off. Smaller clear bins are great for things on the benchtop. Avoid trays and open top bins and boxes, as they slowly fill up with grit and dust.
Use wall space wisely, but avoid any solid shelf. Wire closet shelf is a good idea if you need shelves. Pegs and such can hang wheels and arms if needed. Just remember that EVERY surface collect dust. They will all need regular vacuuming or sweeping the dust off to fall on the floor.

8) Power - put three quad 120VAC outlets on the wall 12" above the benches in your small room. Low outlets are pretty much useless in a grinding room. Put a 220 duplex outlet on the wall at each end if using my layout, or at 48" from the ends if sticking with one long bench. Have separate power circuits for the grinding room.
Have a three gang switchbox at the door. one for the lights, one for the exhaust fan, and one for the separate air filter.
Put the switch for the dust collector on the wall near the grinder. If using the two bench setup I suggested, make the dust collector switch a three-way circuit so you can turn on and off from either end of the room.

Hope this helps - Stacy

1748369494342.png1748370035939.png
 
Last edited:
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
I'll try and sum up some of the main points:
1) Air exchange - Air in - Air out. Whether in and out of the shop or in and out of the building, it has to be one or the other. Outside air is best if the Texas weather allows it. The surface area of the return air IN port should be roughly two to three times the area of the powered exhaust OUT port. Normally, there is no need to have a fan or blower on the return air. A screen to keep bugs and such out is wise.

2) Air filtering - It can be part of the air exchange or separate. Separate is usually better. In a small enclosed grinding room, a hanging independent filter setup is a good choice. Most are HEPA and have a remote control. Most also have a delayed stop feature that runs the fans about 30 minutes after you shut the unit off. This does a lot to clear the air of the superfine dust in it. They regularly go on sale at Woodcraft and are also cheap from places like HF.
NOTE - filters will clog fast. Clean them often. Replace filters regularly. They aren't good forever, even with vacuuming the often.

3) Grinder dust/spark collection - A dedicated dust collector with some sort of spark trap is a must. A metal type dust deputy and a 5-gallon tub make a good one for a small shop. It is often wisest to put it outside the grinding room and route the smooth metal duct through the wall (don't use flex/corrugated duct). Amazon and other places sell the dust deputy top unit fairly cheap and you just add a snug lidded pail as the collector. While it is tempting to get the cheaper plastic dust deputy, for a grinder you really need the metal unit. If you have separate grinders for wood and metal, the plastic units are fine for the wood. A drywall bucket will work for the wood catch bin, but a metal container is needed for the sparks and metal dust. Look for a metal 5-gallon paint container. You can buy new empty 5-galloin pails pretty cheap at paint stores and big-box hardware stores (see image below from Zorro that sells for $16). An HVAC reducer makes a great catch funnel. They come in all sizes and shapes. I like the rectangular and square ones. Home Depot and all the big hardware stores have a big selection as well as all the duct and fittings needed ( see image below). If you have a tight budget, use the shop-vac to run the dust collector and unhook it from the deputy when doing regular cleanup or attaching to other tools like bandsaws. The bigger the shop vac the better.

4) Lighting - You can't have too much light. Put 5K to 6K spectrum LED lights over each work area. At least two 48" light units for a space your size. Attach the to the ceiling, as hanging lights get a thick coat of dust on the topside.
Your window may be nice for someone outside watching, but will be useless for lighting. I have windows down the walls of my grinding booth so I can see out into the shop and people can see me grinding. I just framed the openings and had1/4" glass cut to fit. I used 1/4-round to put it in place. I would suggest you place the window on the end of the long wall at the corner of the open shop area. That way you have sight of the shop and anyone in the shop can see you. I also suggest using a 36" storm door for the entry. Again, clear view or things. Just screw the hinge to the framing studs. That is what I have.

5) Fireproofing - Making the bench tops from metal, cement board, poured cement, or covering them with thin sheet metal is best. Have the grinder arm extend past the bench edge by a good amount to keep the sparks going straight down into the catch trap. Make the walls behind the grinders the same as the bench tops. Hardie/cement board is an excellent choice, as well as sheet metal. Be aware that drilling Hardie and cement board needs carbide bits. The grinding room needs its own 10# to 20# fire extinguisher. CO2 is the best because it will not cover the entire room in white powder that takes days to clean up. Keep trash cans emptied and paper and cardboard out of the grinding room.

6) Floors should be unencumbered and easy to sweep and vacuum. If the concrete is rough surface, consider painting it with an epoxy floor paint. Attaching the benches to the walls on the sides and back eliminates legs. On longer benches, use cantilever legs that go from the wall/floor point to the front of the bench. The arrangement I suggested with two benches at opposite ends of the room works very well for maximizing working floor space. Put the door in the center of the long wall.

7) Using the space wisely - Space in a shop is precious for most folks. I envy those guys with a 60X40 shop, but hear that they even have space issues eventually. Rolling carts are a good answer. In a small grinding room, an HF 18X24" shop cart, or a little welder cart, can hold the accessories, a small shop vacuum, abrasives and belts, etc. It can be moved as needed ... or rolled out of the booth if not needed right now. A second plus is it can be rolled outside the shop and blown off with a leaf blower.. Clear plastic storage bins with tops can be stored under the benches with all sorts of things you want close at hand, but not collecting dust. They are easy to clean off. Smaller clear bins are great for things on the benchtop. Avoid trays and open top bins and boxes, as they slowly fill up with grit and dust.
Use wall space wisely, but avoid any solid shelf. Wire closet shelf is a good idea if you need shelves. Pegs and such can hang wheels and arms if needed. Just remember that EVERY surface collect dust. They will all need regular vacuuming or sweeping the dust off to fall on the floor.

8) Power - put three quad 120VAC outlets on the wall 12" above the benches in your small room. Low outlets are pretty much useless in a grinding room. Put a 220 duplex outlet on the wall at each end if using my layout, or at 48" from the ends if sticking with one long bench. Have separate power circuits for the grinding room.
Have a three gang switchbox at the door. one for the lights, one for the exhaust fan, and one for the separate air filter.
Put the switch for the dust collector on the wall near the grinder. If using the two bench setup I suggested, make the dust collector switch a three-way circuit so you can turn on and off from either end of the room.

Hope this helps - Stacy

View attachment 2886311View attachment 2886321
Click to expand...

YES SIR! I'd say that helps! Thanks for the detail as always, Stacy. This gives me a lot to ponder...

I'm opting to do a mini-split install before this grinding room since the shop is currently unbearable to be in... The air handler inside will be outside of the grinding room... likely here due to some outside the building constraints:



--------------

Do you have a link to some pictures of your grinding room, Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith ?
 


Progress made!

- split system installed (18,000 BTU)
- 12' by 6.25' room framed up with space 38'' opening for 36'' door (if ever needed)
 
Nice!! High ceiling too, what is that, ten feet?

Eric
 
Looks great! I'm getting ready to get a mini split for my shop as well. I think 12000 BTU will be plenty for my space though.
Linus
 
I'd frame a 24X30 window to the right of the door, and an 18X30 window on the end wall over the benches. More shop visibility, fewer surprises.

Don't forget to put in a ceiling socket to plug the hanging air filter into.
 
Linus Knives said:
Looks great! I'm getting ready to get a mini split for my shop as well. I think 12000 BTU will be plenty for my space though.
Linus
Click to expand...
I've installed 2 so far... will be installing a third in my gym. As far as advice goes I'd air on the larger side, the cost variance isn't high and you'd rather it work less than being on full tilt all the time.
 
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