remember the alamo bowie

J

Johan van Zyl

Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Messages
372
I am very anxious to write up the history of a certain knife that I have. Got it in 1966 and have great sentiment for it. A good source of information recently claimed it is a Western W49, made in Colorado. On the blade is etched "REMEMBER THE ALAMO" and a year date "1836". Rosewood slabs. Could I possibly be helped in this forum to get more information on this knife? Seems the blade is chrome vanadium tool steel. Questions I would like answers to:
What does it mean when we say it is a Western W49?
What did this knife cost new?
Was it sold with a sheath?
What is current value?
Were many made?

I would greatly appreciate any and all help!
 
Sir,
Your knife was made by the WESTERN CUTLERY Co. in Colorado, before CAMILLUS purchased that Company. W49 is the models # designation. THe basic model knife is still in production, shown here off our webpage...

cam-western.jpg


The current model is no longer Chrome 'V' steel, but 420HC. The current suggested retail price is $99.95. Sheath included.

As far as the commemorative model that you have, I will have to do some research as to the value now and then, and as to whether it came with a sheath or not. Keep an eye on this forum and we will post the info when after researching it for you.

Thanks for the interest!

------------------
Stay Sharp!
Will Fennell
Camillus Cutlery
www.camillusknives.com
 
Dear Mr. Fennell
I thank you most wholeheartedly for your valuable input so far. Yes, I will be looking out on this forum for any further information. I guess what would be of ultimate importance to me, would be to receive a picture (scan) of the REMEMBER THE ALAMO W49 knife. It's not that I don't trust the source that said mine was a W49, but a scan would give me the "proof" I need to ultimately document my knife's identity. When I compare my knife to the top knife in your picture above, I note mine does not have the "bird's head" type of buttcap shown. And mine's guard is not so pronounced as in the pic. When looked at along the length of the blade, mine's guard has an oval shape.
 
Dear Sir

I have just communicated with my other source on the history of my REMEMBER THE ALAMO knife. He said he looked at a book (The Knifemakers who went West) showing some Western catalogs. The 1960 cat. does not show this knife. He says the 1968 cat. does show the knife. He also states the list price in 1972 was 27 bucks, sheath included. He does not have access to the in-between catalogues. I have exhausted this source now and look to you for your kind assistence.

I got this knife second-hand in 1966. If it could talk, what stories would it tell me! It got into South Africa somehow.
 
I located several older Western catalogs
showing the model #49 Bowie knife. The earliest listing is 1964 and this model was
offered with either a leather sheath or mounted on a wall plaque. In 1967 a flexible
swing sheath was introduced.
If you would like copies of our records, with out charge, just email me your postal mailing address.
Tom Williams
Camillus Cutlery Co.

 
Tom

I thank you most wholeheartedly for the information you sent me. It arrived safely at my address yesterday. The broshures are important to me as they give clear information about Bowies.

Thanks once again for your professionalism and interest.
 
Hi Johan,
I reckon this knife was made to capitalise on the publicity generated by the John Wayne film The Alamo. I bought mine for £6 sterling in 1970 (brand new). I confirm the brass crossguard is oval when viewed along the blade. Mine is etched Remember the Alamo 1836
the last stand of
Jim Bowie Bill Travis Davy Crockett
The knive has a leather sheath. As to value well this is difficult, as a commemorative item I had not reckoned it
particularly valuable but as a part time dealer I attended an auction at Tennants (Leyburn Yorkshire England) where
one was described as " late nineteenth century commemorative " To my mind this was wrong as I recognised it
immediately. It was sold for £210 sterling. Bowie knives are of course very collectible and it is certainly a very impressive heavy knife.
Regards Dave Tait
 
Dave,
If it wouldn’t be too much trouble could you relay to me any other markings on the knife provided by the maker? On the earliest versions of the Western Bowie the markings where on the blade. In the late 60’s or so they changed to putting the markings on the brass guard. There are several variations on how these knives are marked. I’ve been collecting information in the hope of being able to narrow down the date of manufacture of the different variants.

Thank you.
 
Here is a picture of mine with a couple of friends. It is marked with the year mark "K". 1997 = "A".

100-2441.jpg
 
edbeau said:
It is marked with the year mark "K". 1997 = "A".


Before others jump in on the typo let me elaborate a little on Western’s history. for those who aren’t familiar.
1911 H.N. Platts sells his interest in W. R. Case and Sons, and with his wife Debbie Case moves his family from Pennsylvania to Boulder Colorado and starts the Western States Cutlery and Manufacturing Company ( by this time the Platts family had been heavily involved in American knife manufacturing since 1864)

1956 Western States Cutlery changes it’s name to Western Cutlery Co.

1977 Western Cutlery starts the practice of putting a date code on the blades of most of the knives they produce starting with the letter “A” . This practice continues into the year
1991 with the letter “O”.

1978 Western Cutlery moves it’s manufacturing from Boulder to Longmont Colorado.

1984 Harvey Platts (the grandson of H.N. Platts) decides to sell the Western Cutlery Co. to the Coleman Co. Harvey stays on in the role of Chief operating officer until 1986.

1989 The Coleman Co. is acquired by a holding company and Coleman/Western is rumored to be up for sale.

1990 a group of four investors buy the Western operation for $780,000 in an attempt to revitalize the brand.

1991 Camillus buys Westerns trademarks,tools and dies, distribution and raw materials at auction for a reported $90,000. Camillus successfully reintroduces several of Westerns patterns.

2007 February 28 Camillus closes. Later that year Acme United Corp acquires the Camillus brand and all of its attendant brand names, including Western.
Click to expand...
 
Yup, there is a typo, 1977 = "A".

Sac Troop, that is a very good bio of Western. When I started collecting Western's there was very little information on the company and its long history. I bought a few Western catalogs from the bay and the history was written in as part part of the catalogs. Copies of my catalogs can be found on http://www.collectors-of-camillus.us/Western/Western.htm I will be saving your information, Thank You.
 
sac troop said:
Dave,
If it wouldn’t be too much trouble could you relay to me any other markings on the knife provided by the maker? On the earliest versions of the Western Bowie the markings where on the blade. In the late 60’s or so they changed to putting the markings on the brass guard. There are several variations on how these knives are marked. I’ve been collecting information in the hope of being able to narrow down the date of manufacture of the different variants.

Thank you.
Click to expand...
Dear Sac,
I have examined the knife which apart from the inscription bears no other markings. It is not the same as the photos submitted by edbeau. A photo of the knife described (not great quality, I will re-photograph it)
is on my website www.richmondmilitaryantiques.com.uk]
Regards Dave Tait
 
Last edited:
edbeau said:
Dave, your link is incorrect should be http://www.richmondmilitaryantiques.co.uk/ I looked at the knife and it doesn't appear to be any Western I know. The w-49 is on the top of my picture and it always looked like that.
Click to expand...

Hi Edbeau, Thank you for pointing out the bad link, your courtesy much appreciated. My bowie knife as you say would appear not to be a Western, I wonder if it could be United Kingdom made, I will try to research Sheffield makers etc over here. When I have re-photographed it I will post a decent photo to see if anyone can help.
Thank you, Dave Tait.
 
Sorry for being away so long.
Dave thanks for your reply. If you don’t find much help from this forum on your Bowie you might want to move your question along with photo’s to the Bernard Levine forum on this site. More general knife interest there than would be on our Camillus threads and someone may recognize that knife.

Oh by the way I loved that India made “deaths head commando knife” you sold on your site! Only about the third one I’ve seen. One of these days I’m going to have a chance to hold one.

Thank you everyone for the kind words about the brief chronology about Western.

Edbeau I know what you mean about finding information on Western Cutlery. I’ve been keeping a binder with notes and pictures in it. Yes some of yours are in it! The Catalogs on the collectors site I keep copying to CD. IMHO a lot of the records we would like to find from Western Cutlery were more than likely thrown out by people from the Coleman years and possibly never sent to Camillus after the acquisition. But might as well keep digging you never know when you might find a nugget.
 
You can use any of my pictures as they help with our search. As you noticed I am a wood handled Western collector. Before I sent my scans of my catalogs to IRV, I was sending a CD of my catalogs to people free.
 
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