replacement for big bowie.

L

leonc

Joined
Mar 6, 2001
Messages
43
Hi guys,
i thought this forum would be the right place to get an answer.
i have a 1940 collins legitimus machete with a 13inch blade for light work, and a bowie, again with a 13inch blade, with a 6/16ths of an inch blade thickness, and 2.5 inch blade width, for the heavy stuff, chopping firewood, pounding stakes, fighting off t-rexs, that sort of thing. i know an axe would be better, but i like the big blade, and it is shaving sharp so is versatile.

However, i put a huge ding in the blade on a nail, chopping drunk whilst camping with friends (i know, dumb of me, but at 4am, with a gorgeous blond asking for more fire because she is frightened, wouldn't you?).

I need to get another big bowie, or similar knife, heavy, large, and capable of a nice edge, as whilst the knife is still useable, it was never finished (i got it as a blade blank.) and the handle is tape, no guard, and i just want an excuse for another big knife!

I was looking at the mineral mountain bowies, the busse big stuff, the livesay sandbar, or rtak, or maybe a hossum. the livesay and hossum are more fighter oriented though, aren't they? i want something BIG, as an example, i use the spine of my bowie to smash 5inch logs, when i am worried about nails in them, or when i want kindling. it would need to be big, and take a lot of punishment. i am a big lad, so weight isn't a problem, and fighting ability isn't an issue, as in the uk, if you defend yourself with more than a Q-tip, you are locked up.
money? maybe £150, or $220 would be the highest i could go to, tho obviously, as a knife knut, i could scrape together the extra couple of hundred for something really special.

please give me ideas, gents, as i am really enthusiastic about this now i have set the wheels in motion, as it were.
regards,
leon.
 
I was just noticing that the May issue of Tactical Knives, based on the cover at least, may address the kind of tools you are looking for.

Check out www.tacticalknives.com and look at the link for this month's articles. It will show you the cover and the knife there immeidately made me think of your post.
 
Can't recommend a blade in the 13"-plus range from the makers below, unless you custom order from them. But I think they all do custom lengths.

Newt Livesay's blades are fine user blades in 1095 steel at good price points. His Recon Combat Machete (RCM) has a 12" blade & is a heavy duty chopper. I really like the RTAK he makes, although the blade is only a bit over 9-1/2" inches long IIRC. With incredibly nice geometry and finish for only $150 USD, the RTAK is a winner in my book. (review & links to specs of RTAK here: http://www.jungletraining.com/rtak.htm) It has full flat double-ground (non-chisel) primary grinds, rounded spine (a VERY nice touch), a handle comfortable enough to chop with all day long & still leave hand strength for industrial drinking bouts that night, a durable coating on the 1095 blade, and a secure very durable Kydex sheath with webbing drop-beltloop. The primary angle is pretty low on the RTAK, so it digs in deeply when chopping. However, I did chip the edge a bit when I inadvertantly hit a steel wagon side with it, since his heat treat leaves the edge around RC 60. But that hard edge is wonderful to work with when you're cutting or whittling or using it as a draw knife. Newt's WASP model also looks like it would be a fine chopper, but I've not worked with that blade personally.

I like the Busse blades a lot for heavy use. The blade geometry and steel can take a huge beating and still be functional. You could look into the Basic 9 for about $224 USD. http://onestopknifeshop.com/store/busse-combat-basic-9.html Again, you get a lot of performance for the price you pay. The nice thing about the M-INFI steel in the Basic models is that it is much less likely to chip from hitting nails than many other steels when you're fulfilling your chivalrous duty to warm the gorgeous blonde. In a Kydex or cordura/Kydex combo sheath, you've got a great blade in a very good carry system. If you are willing to pay $350 USD you can step up to the Busse Battle Mistress, which is an indestructible blade that could easily become a multi-generational family heirloom. This is not to denigrate the Basic 9, which is pretty bombproof in its own right. But the BM is definitely the ultimate in Busse blades.

Otherwise, how about just looking at a machete. Anything from that fine looking Greco shown at the link above to an Ontario military issue model for about $15 USD. Speaking of Ontario, for a lot less than your upper price limit, they make some bigger blades in their Spec-Plus line. While not up to the Busse standard by any stretch of the imagination, they are also not priced like a Busse. http://onestopknifeshop.com/store/spec-plus-index.html
 
thanks for the replies, guys.
i do love the look of that john greco la duena (did i spell that right?). it is a lovely looking blade, reminds me of the first knife i ever REALLY wanted, the blackjack mamba, too expensive for me as a 12 yr old. now i am 25 tho, something like that could be on the cards. first tho, i wanna get something BIG! i like machetes, and like the way the collins legitimus glides thru vegetation like it isn't there. took a lot of work on the edge, as whoever owned it in the 57 years between it's issue and my buying it, really buggered up the blade, but now it shaves and slices like it should. it just doesn't have the cojones for smashing thru things like the bowie does.
i will look more closely at the livesay, and the busse, as this INFI intrigues me.
any other suggestions, gentlemen?
cheers,
leon.
 
How about a quality khukuri, Leon? There has been a great deal written about them so I don't go into detail here other than to say one would meet all your criteria & be well within your budget. I have a few pix of mine at the "toys" link below, but your best bet would be to look through the Himalayan Imports forum here on BF. Have fun choosing.

------------------
Cheers,
Brian

He who finishes with the most toys wins.

NOTE: My old PhotoPoint site is no more. Follow the "toys" link to my new site.
 
Leon,
Check out Himalayan Imports' Khukuries. HI has a forum under "Makers and Mfg's"
You might find what you are looking for at a price that wont bust the bank.

Besides a Khukuri from Nepal is just full of exotic tales,etc.
wink.gif
 
i like khuks, used to have a lovely ww2 surplus khuk, prob an ang khola, 14" blade, half inch thick, lovely. chopped thru ANYTHING! had a rat's tail tang tho, and when handle broke, was no good.
i like the ak bowie tho, will look into that.

cheers chaps!
leon.
 
leonc:

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">i want something BIG, as an example, i use the spine of my bowie to smash 5inch logs, when i am worried about nails in them</font>
Click to expand...

Unless the log is rotten, you would have a lot of trouble breaking a 5" stick with a maul let alone a ~1 lbs bowie. In regards to the nails, get a quality steel with enough toughness to resist fracture and hardness to resist excessive compaction and all a nail will do is slightly roll/impact the edge, to a depth of a fraction of a mm. Here is a shot of a Battle Mistress after chopping up some seasoned bone and being pounded into a bunch of nails :

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/images/bm_bone_nails.jpg

There was some edge impaction and rolling from the nails but it is not large enough to be visible on the picture. I broke the nails in half after I pried them out of the stump. They had been cut a little more than halfway through. The blade will easily cut them in half cleanly if you use a vice (as will just about any decent heavy use blade).

Allen Blade makes very large bowies (10+ inches) like you are describing. He uses differential tempering on 5160 so the blade should be very durable. I have not used his large blades, bt 5160 is a solid steel and his smaller blades that I have seen show quality workmanship. I would drop him an email (allendotc0m@aol.com), and ask for a price quote and an estimated delivery time. Be sure to mention some of the above so he has an idea of what you want the blade to be able to do.

-Cliff


[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 06-15-2001).]
 

".. Unless the log is rotten, you would have a lot of trouble breaking a 5" stick with a maul let alone a ~1 lbs bowie...."
cliff, i agree that it isn't the easiest thing in the world to do, but if the wood is plenty dry (but not rotten.), and i have enough room to swing, i am a big lad (5'8", 250lbs.) and have enough power to add to the bowie's own weight to smash those logs with the blade's spine. better than risking the bowie's edge on unknown wood or nails. of course, when drunk, i forgot to use the spine when smashing pallet's, and torn the edge on a nail.
the bowie takes a lovely edge, and holds it surprisingly well, it went thru 2 12inch diameter branches in my girlfriends garden, and all it needed was steeling to make it shaving sharp (edge had rolled a bit.).
however, i don't know the blade's provenance, it was given as a blade blank to me by an ex-girlfriends dad, and i don't even know the steel.
what i wanted was answers from gentlemen like yourself, cliff, and jeff randall, and others on the wilderness forum, who know what blades will do what i ask of them.
i would love a battle mistress, but cannot afford one, and am not sure of the dual grind they have, even though i would love to try that infi steel.
i am basically looking for a heavy, heavy-duty, beater bowie. long, holding a good edge, with plenty of weight to it, as i am not a man with a lot of finesse when it comes to big knives. i wanna lotta steel!

thankyou for your answers, and information, i will look into each suggestion. please, if anyone has any other suggestions, let me know, as i don't often have the money to purchase a big blade, and want to make sure i make the right choice.
 
What type of wood is it? The wood that is cut normally around here is Pine, Juniper, and Spruce, a little Birch and Oak but not much. For any of those you would have little chance to break them when seasoned, in the 4-5" range even with Pine which is by far the weakest. That is a bigger piece of wood than a 4x4", and it would be very impressive indeed to break a 4x4" in half by hitting it with a 1-2 lbs knife. I can't imagine even doing that with a decent sized maul, say 8 lbs. The length of the wood matters of course, but with a really long piece of wood, even dry, you would probably just induce anough flex to absorb the shock.

I have a lot of seasoned wood that needs to be cleaned up, about 1 truckload or so, most 1-2 years seasoned, but some 3+ years. I can't see me being able to break any of sticks of any size with a decent large knife. It would seem to me to be much easier to jump on them and break them as you can generate a lot more power that way. Even then though, I would not be able to break a seasoned piece of wood 4x4" sized. If there are nails in them that would probably not be a good idea though as even a steel plated boot will not stop a nail under than much thrust. All you would need though it another piece of wood to serve as protection and place that on the wood you indend to break and jump on that.

Interesting idea though, I'll break out a few knives, including some large khukuris (3+ lbs) the weekend and an 8 lbs maul and see what I can do on some scrap and felled wood.

As for the Busse dual grind, its only an edge grind, if you don't like it, change it to full flat or convex, whichever you prefer. Besides Allen Blade I'd also suggest you contact Running Dog knives and see what kind of price and wait they would have on a 15n20 large bowie :

http://www.runningdogknife.bigstep.com/

-Cliff
 
hi cliff,
thanks for replying. i agree that breaking these lumps of wood isn't easy, some wood is tougher than other wood, but i think these were soft wood, like pine, and to be honest cliff, i am a big chap, and quite strong, and using the full swing, and full weight of a big heavy knife, bracing the wood between the ground and either a block or holding it upright with my hand, it does smash, breaking in the middle, and splintering around the impact point, making cool kindling for firemaking.
i think everyone uses different techniques, whatever works for them, but whilst i do stamp on wood to break it if i can, i did it once, slipped, and landed on another piece of wood, which hurt a lot, and now i find if i can use strength to bust the log, i do.

don't use a khukri, as the spine is curved, and will not hit properly. my bowie is straight, and hits like a .458 win mag!
 
does it really matter what kind of wood it was? -- that's not the question.
leon, check out becker knife and tool. they may have the kind of big chopper you want.
and you may want to peek at this thread.
http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum41/HTML/001166.html
aleX.

------------------
"i flip you... i flip you for real..."

"come and get one in the yarbles, if you've got any yarbles."
 
thanks for the ideas, and links.
various people have mailed me pics, and ideas for custom makers who may be suitable in style, or price. thank you for these.
i am interested in the becker brute, and the basic 9. the battle mistress looks good, but i can't afford one yet. i like the himalayan imports birgorka bowie, it looks like it was built to take punishment, and come back for more.
i am not too worried about the size/weight of a knife for carrying, as i could never use it as a belt knife; in the u.k, that would be asking for trouble with the law. i just carry my big knives from car/bag/tent to whatever job needs doing, then back again. belt carry isn't a consideration.
this thread is doing nicely, does anyone else have ideas for the ideal tree-beater, abuse-at-will, bowie?
 
leonc,
I'd go for the big Becker, as its the nearest thing to the Blackjack Marauder II which I have and works well in the UK. With the money you save over a Busse or high end custom you could also buy a Granfors Burks forest axe.

Other "gucci" kit for vehicle carry would be a Glock spade. This summer I fancy one of those rachet/lever action long handled tree pruners as punted at the Game Fairs.
 
leonc,

i have a becker brute, it seems to work well for me ofr the tasks you have in mind, and it wont dent your pocketbook like a busse or custom knife will.

i have used a baton to hammer it through large logs without difficulty, had some edge damage when i hit a rock with it, but resharpened easily with a diamond rod, and at under 100.00 us you wont get hurt by the price, i love that knife, it is a serious chopper, as anyone who ownes one will tell you.

alex
 
leonc:
You WANT a BK&T Brute!! But you should also look at the BK&T new machete...a 14" blade which is thinner then the Brute but it chops like a "house-a-fire". I was chopping some brush with mine and hit a hidden brick. I thought for sure the edge was a gonner but when I looked at it and scraped away the brick dust....no damage to the edge.
I also have a H.I. UBE Special that I am sure you could cut up a battle tank with and not faze it. All their products have a lifetime guarantee aginst breakage of the blade AND the handle.

------------------
Ron,
Bremerton, Washington
0071.gif
 
Leon, the AK Bowie from Himalayan Imports was designed almost as a joke; the guys on that forum wanted to put an end to the unspoken "who can build the toughest survival knife" competition so the AK Bowie was conceived, with its thickness at three quarters of an inch or more. It is an exercise in overkill, and although they are well made like all HI khuks, it's like carrying an anvil around with you, hanging off of your belt. However, you will never be able to destroy it, if that's your main criterion. But if you like knives with 13" blades, the AK Bowie is going to be too short for you.

Personally, I love big knives too. I have every model of khukuri made by HI with the exception of 3 or 4, and I think you would really like a UBE (Uncle Bill Especiale). This model has the curve of a khukuri for powerful chopping, but has a beautiful upswept tip that is very functional for stabbing and slashing. It gives the whole knife an exotic, Arabian-esque look. It has fullers like an AK, but deeper and longer. The OAL is 19" IIRC, but you can order one to be custom made to any length within reason, for just a little more money. If you don't like the spike tangs that most khukuris have, order the UBE with a "chiruwa" tang (full tang). I like them so much I have two, each by a different maker.

In addition, HI offers a lifetime guarantee on their knives. Busses are awesome--I own several and can recommend them without reservation--but that INFI steel is super expensive, and they must pass on the cost if they're to make a profit. For those on a budget who still want a super tough, BIG knife that will hold an edge, HI is the answer. Where else can you get a unique, hammer forged, all hand-made giant knife with a lifetime guarantee for under $200? Gurkha House also has excellent khukuris with lifetime guarantees and great prices, but they don't have anything similar to a UBE model, which is what my post is about.

------------------
Molon Labe

[This message has been edited by X-Head (edited 06-21-2001).]

[This message has been edited by X-Head (edited 06-25-2001).]
 
If you absolutely insist on using a knife for chopping firewood, the khukuri is the best blade for the job. The edge geometry makes it the most efficient chopping knife ever invented.
However, why use a knife for axe chores? Get a good quality belt tomahawk with a hammer poll and you have an axe, hammer, emergency skinning/butchering tool, good fleshing tool, and an excellent CQB weapon.
Check the following forums:
http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum36/HTML/000349.html
http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum44/HTML/000179.html
Hope this information is of use to you.
TWO HAWKS
http://www.2hawks.net

 
alex :

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">does it really matter what kind of wood it was?</font>
Click to expand...

The strength of wood varies tremendously depending on the type. A piece of clear pine for example is so soft you can run your fingernail along it and make a deep track. Try the same thing with hickory and you can't marr the surface. Different woods also require different edge geometries.

I forgot about the HI bowie, that seems ideal for the above.

-Cliff
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top