Codger_64
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A recent post in another thread by Roland brought up an old and mostly forgotten (by me anyway) pattern, the 172S. We still have little solid information on this knife with which to trace it's history. Over the years several people have speculated on it, but no authoratative answers have come out. The dirth of examples (that I know of) suggests a small production both in timespan and quantity. Was it a marketing flop? A production headache? A stopgap pattern between more successful hunting knife designs or to use up surplus components from another production item? Maybe it was a special factory order for Sears, Belknap, Kresge, Norm Thompson or someone else? Idle speculations for sure. But an interesting mystery nonetheless.
I'll begin by reposting the stolen... err... borrowed posts from the other thread.
The earliest archive mention I found with a search was this one from 2004:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=315670&highlight=172S
An interesting earlier post from LT. I edited out the references to pictures which are no longer there, and also for brevity. The entire unedited thread can be viewed still by clicking the link.
He makes some useful observations about the pattern, some of which we have repeated in our own observations above.
PS-There are a few errors made in this last referenced post such as the meaning of "S" on the tang, but we are reading this post six years later with the benefit of years of research in the interim. And I am still very prone to make mitakes miself!
I'll begin by reposting the stolen... err... borrowed posts from the other thread.
Here's another rare one: Schrade/U.S.A. 172S
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the blade is similar to the 148 series from the 1960s. the 172UH was first produced '71-'73. where exactly the 172S came in i'm not sure, but the plastic handle is not Staglon. it's got a very "plastic" look to it (i.e. el cheapo) and it's light weight, adding a cheap feel. i think Schrade was trying out different plastics for a stag like look before settling on Delrin which became the material for both "Saw-Cut" and "Staglon".
it actually looks better in the pic than in person.
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the above 'facts' may not be much more than my imagination as i cobbled this together from bits of old posts. but: Codger knows ! maybe he'll get some accuracy here.
roland
I believe you pretty well covered what is known about the pattern at this time Roland.
1. The blade is similar to the 148 series from the 1960's
2. The 172UH was first produced '71-'73.
3. Where exactly the 172S came in we're not sure
4. The plastic handle is not Staglon.
5. It has a very "plastic" look to it (i.e. el cheapo) and it's light weight, adding a cheap feel.
6. We think Schrade was trying out different plastics for a stag like look before settling on Delrin which became the material for both "Saw-Cut" and "Staglon".
7. It looks better in the pic than in person.
Eric, Dale or someone else may hold a critical piece of the puzzle of this knife's history in the form of a record of production, a meeting note, a flyer or inter-office memo. But until something more definate surfaces, we can look more closely at what we know for a fact at this point. The construction closely relates to the Imperial Kit Carson. The tang says post-1973 which was after the '49er series made it's debut. Therefore, we know the handle material wasn't a predecessor to Staglon. Maybe it was a try at a cheaper styrene replacement?
Michael and Roland, I'm working on it, so far I've found the info re. the initial offerings of the 172UH, but nothing yet on the "S". Interesting to note that the initial 172UH's used 165 boxes. It is the 148 blade, as was the Kit Carson blade. That "S" model might just remain a mystery (is it for sure an S, or is it a 5?).
Eric
Re: 172S (yes, S, not 5)
Eric, there is a bit of info here: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=315670&highlight=172s
but it was a bit of a mystery then too.
and Michael, it seems you have one, or did have on Dec. 25 2004: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=326494&highlight=172s
seems odd to me that this would have come out after the S-W 172UH of '71-'73, which was d/c after only 2 years, and after Staglon had already been chosen as a major handle material.
could this have been made at the Imperial, R.I. plant, pre 1971, and the "Walden" left off the stamping because it did not originate in Walden, N.Y. ?
roland
The earliest archive mention I found with a search was this one from 2004:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=315670&highlight=172S
...your knife was made after 1974 sometime in the mid seventys. I believe the S means it is stainless. This handle material was used during this period and was brought into production with Schrades accquisition of Imperial I have attached a pic of a similiar knife with I believe similiar handle material in the same pattern, it is an Imperial Kit Carson edition marked Imperial Providence RI. The blade pattern under the Schrade tang is usually called a 148 and was made in several handle materials including leather wrap. This material was used in the late 60tys and 70tys under Schrade Walden pre 1972 and just Schrade post 1972. I have included a pic of the 148 Schrade Walden in the early Schrade plastic....also the Kit Carson...
The plastic handle on you knife was another attempt at finding a material to simulate real stag. This was less expensive than staglon but not as nice ( weight, feel, ect) and was not used for long. Strangely enough a couple of years ago Schrade started using a delrin stag material which is quite visually similiar to this style of handle....The Kit Carson has no model # so I guess the 172 was Schrade designation for it. Like a lot of Schrades this limited attempt into the retail market while being fairly rare is not worth a lot of money but, would be invaluable to someone attempt in to find unusual issues. LT
An interesting earlier post from LT. I edited out the references to pictures which are no longer there, and also for brevity. The entire unedited thread can be viewed still by clicking the link.
He makes some useful observations about the pattern, some of which we have repeated in our own observations above.
PS-There are a few errors made in this last referenced post such as the meaning of "S" on the tang, but we are reading this post six years later with the benefit of years of research in the interim. And I am still very prone to make mitakes miself!