RMJ and “normal” tomahawks

H

harryf3

Joined
Feb 9, 2008
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I’ve read that the RMJ hawk (especially the shrike) is the perfect tool for demolition, breaching etc.
I see there are too many kinds of hawks out there, tactical and traditional.

What happens if someone continuously hits a cinder block, a lock, any hard thing anyway with a “normal” hawk?
Will he break the handle? Will he destroy the edge?

What makes the RMJ so special? The steel? The heat treatment? The design?
I understand that the RMJ is actually a one piece design. But will the edge withstand the hard hits on the cinder blocks?

Is that a truth or a myth? I’ve read all the stories with soldiers who escaped by making a hole in a brick wall etc but I’m skeptical. What if they had a normal hawk?
 
I can't speak on RMJ hawks, but it isn't that hard to break a cinder block or brick wall. A hammer would work fine but would not have the optional cutting edges. If you needed to use a normal hawk- I suspect most could do the job - would probably show some damage.
 
The tacticals i've owned have blunt short edges to take abuse which is why they don't do very well at cutting. A RMJ would survive just about anything abusive you could throw at it.

My Vec Hawk on the other hand with a modified Cold Steel Trail Hawk head came very sharp. It would dull it's nice edge smashing into hard objects but it's not going to break either due to the heat treatment and low hardness.

So yes it would tear up the edge on a traditional over a tactical but only because the tactical is dull in the first place;)
 
I think people over look just how tough a traditional hawk can really be. Take one of Coal Creeks Jack Hawks for example the way Steve heat treats those things I have no doubt that it could smash its way threw cinder blocks if you had too, would it be the best hawk for that probably not but then again an RMJ wouldn't be the best for a woods tool either but it could do it.

The weak point for a traditional is going to be the wooden handle but any hawk with a good heat treat on a good hard use steel like 52100, 5160, 4140, or S7 (there are others this is just the first four that came to mind) will break darn near anything. Also laminated steels such as what H&B Forge (1095 cutting bit wrapped in a 1018 body) or Wolf Creek Forge (1075 cutting bit in 1020 body) does can take just a worth while beat down and remain sharp as well.

If I was going to build a hawk for the sole purpose of breaking stuff it would be a full tang in 4140, if it was for purely chopping, cutting, and other non abusive tasks I would take a wooden handle hawk in 52100, if it was going to be used for throwing, chopping, cutting, and in a pinch demo tasks I would go with a wooden handle in a laminated steel with a mild steel body (1018 or 1020) with either a 1095, 1084, or if I was lucky enough to find a blacksmith willing to do it a 52100 (52100 will holds its edge a good bit longer than 1095 or 1084 but it also costs a lot more and to find a piece small enough for a cutting bit it would more than likely have to be forged from either ball bearings or scrap pieces of 52100 stock) cutting bit.
 
My RMJ Shrike isnt too dull, I've chopped small logs, cleaned fish,beheaded a copperhead,vines,fig bars, etc. May not finely slice a tomato but I don't think it's dull. I have not attacked cinder blocks or a car.
 
If I owned a Shrike I would most defiantly need to go car shopping within a week, and have to explain to my wife why the trunk of her car is no longer attached to the rest of the car.
 
I have never broken the head or bit on a traditional tomahawk, and I've been using them for a good 30 years.
 
Let's not forget what kind of tool is used to break cinder block or brick - even rock, for that matter. It's a tough convex chisel made from steel, whether hand held or part of a striking tool. After a hard days work with one, it might need touching up, and the thinner hawk edge would, too.

The point of carrying or using the Shrike type hawk is that it's multipurpose. A traditional hawk may not even have a poll, and certainly shies away from the rolling head design with a protruding handle. Sure, it can split and break manmade masonry, it just doesn't have the other features of being a demolition tool. Doesn't mean it can't be used that way, but it's more a woodcraft design simply because of the needs for the age it was invented.

Really the same reasons there are different knives - features are related to what it's used for. I have a Campanion and I've beat it on asphalt to see how the edge would hold up. And, I'm still trying to get all the chipping out, years later, but it sure can take it a lot better than I would expect a BM Osborne Rift.

I can't resist: Different strokes for different folks.
 
Thank you very much for yous answers guys. Really very helpful.
From what i understand the rmj is still the best as a demolition - breeching - entry - multipurpose hawk that can still do some wood cutting if needed.
 
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