Ropes: What kind and how long?

golok

golok

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Oct 20, 2000
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I see movies and documentaries of climbers and others using all kinds of rope to haul things up a slope and bring an injured person down.

Now, I want to know if I am going mountain climbing, what types of rope should I bring along and what lengths do I need?

Are these ropes generally on the heavy side?
 
Look for a 'kernmantle' rope, this braided style rope is much stronger (and more expensive) than a regular twist-laid rope. As a plainsman, I'll defer to others who live within 800 miles of a mountain regarding other details. :)
 
For extraction/rescue, top-rope climbing, rappelling, general use - look for static rope, 7/16" or greater diameter (Bluewater makes some excellent ropes that are affordable). Length based on expected need. The rope is relatively heavy (get a dry coating - wet rope is _heavy_)

For lead climbing, look for dynamic ropes - the added stretch will absorb some of the shock of a fall.

Next you need to look at a harness( can fashion a swiss-seat out of webbing or rope), 'biners, a belay device ('biners will work), possibly ascenders & pulleys if deemed necessary.

If you are rock climbing - good shoes!

Mountaineering -good boots!

Ice climbing - ice axe, crampons, ice screws,etc..

Depends how far you want to go.
 
Before you go out on the hills, take the time to get some training on ropework. There are certain basic skills and knowledge that are key to this - and which cannot be effectivly learnt from a book.

Regards,

Ed
 
There are many kinds of "climbing". When you are doing lots of rope work up and down cliffs, etc., you are not typically backpacking to the site since you will be carrying many pounds of rope!

When I go out, all I need is paracord, and lately I've taken to a much smaller line that has more than enough strength to do what I need done (lash poles together, hang food bags from limbs of trees, etc. and weighs about 1/2 as much per foot as paracord.

From what I've seen, rope work is not something you just go and do. It takes a lot of training, and a lot of apprenticeship with more experienced rope workers before you even think about striking out on your own.
 
I agree. Ropework is not something you just decide to do. To do it safely, you need a lot of training and practice. It is not something you usually do by yourself, unless you are doing a double rope rapp.

There are lots of books on the subject, but it is best to go out with an experienced person for awhile.

As far as rescue, there are many considerations and it is best left to experienced people. We have a saying, "Don't send victims to victims". Not to be mean...but even with good intentions, without training you are likely to become a victim yourself.

We have helped many people who get over their heads and get stuck. Unfortunately we pick up a few people who get in over their heads and take a digger too.

Maybe you can check for climbing clubs in your area? An indoor climbing gym will let you practice climbing in a safe environment and teach you some climbing skills too. Good luck and stay safe.
 
I have some 11mm kermantle that I sometimes take along on hikes. It can get heavy so I usually take a short 50' length. It is more than enough to help us over anything we may want to get into.

n2s
 
"mountain climbing" is a very broad definition. For instance, if you are doing single pitch sport routes (ie bolts are preset onto the rock for your protection) you will likely use up to a 60m long rope (9.5mm to 11.5mm dia) or two ropes (8mm to 9mm dia)- dependant on the method of protection you are using.

If you are multi-pitch climbing (ie routes longer than the rope you are carrying) you may use ropes of the same length as for single pitch sport routes, but you will be required to build anchors at each belay (same diameters as above) also for waterfall ice climbing.

If you are doing general mountaineering, you can sometimes get away with a thinner rope because you are not usually expecting to severely load the rope dynamically (ie one 8.5mm dia half-rope dynamic) same goes for glacier travel.

As you can likely see, it can get confusing in a hurry. The very real problem is that there are many mistakes to make which will quickly kill you or your partners if you are not skilled and informed. My suggestion for you is to contact one of the local climbing gyms or clubs in your area (if there are any). More than likely they will be glad to help you out. Or, you may start by reading the book, "The Freedom of the Hills" which is an excellent reference text to get you started.

Cheers,
D
 
You do NOT want static line for your safety line while climbing!!!!! :eek: Lead climbing or top-roping... It matters not. You'll get hurt if you use static line to stop your fall!!!! I've seen it happen. For rappelling and all other things... fine. Then static line is what you want. Otherwise, for catching yourself after peeling off, ONLY USE DYNAMIC LINE!!!
 
Kampfjaeger,
Just curious if the injuries you refer to were caused by the anchor or pro failing when loaded by a whipper on a static line? Or, did the lack of dynamic response in the line cause "shock" damage to the climber (ie, like if you fell 2' onto a multi-pitch hanging belay anchor while only attached with a static daisy - which feels like your hips and kidneys have been crushed)

I have an interest in the mechanisms of injury regarding climbing accidents. If possible, could you elaborate on the circumstances surrounding the injury related to the use of the static line?

Climb safe,
D
 
Sure Diligence... 2 levels of pro pulled out on the climber. POP! POP! and then stopped at the third level. Whoever set them put the cams into some brittle rock. Which ended up dropping him about 12 feet. I was not there with his group so I really cannot comment as to the particulars of how he laid his protection. But, as he was using static line, his fall came to a rather abrubt and harsh stop. He had blood in his urine for at least a week. This was a "simple" top roping climb up in CT a few years back... Maybe a little over a hundred feet to the top. I wish I could remember the name of the place - It is a really popular climbing spot around New Haven.

At any rate, there could be any number of factors that could have contributed to the injury... The harness itself could have been sitting wrong on him. However, popular consensus among our "expert" (take that with a grain of salt) group is that had the guy been tied in with dynamic line, the shock of the fall would have been vastly diminished and probably not have injured him.

I've tried both static and dynamic line under test conditions where we intentionally peeled off to see what the difference felt like. And it felt awful to have the static line stop you compared to the dynamic line. But judging by your post, it would seem to me that you have a bit more experience in these matters than I, and I would probably defer to your judgement. My lead climbing experience is rather limited and I've only been on one multi-pitch climb (and we were only about 8 feet off the ground the entire way.)

*For those of you who are not in the know, we were 8ft off the deck because we were "bouldering". It is a way of safely practicing your techniques as there really isn't anything you can't practice at that height*:)
 
I spent about a dozen or so years with rock and ice climbing as my obsession. I've put in my share of time on the sharp end of a rope. My advice is:

"DO NOT USE A STATIC ROPE TO LEAD OR TOP-ROPE!" Period.

Static ropes work fine for spelunking or haul ropes where they will not take a dynamic load (falling body). Their lack of stretch actually makes them better for haul lines & jumaring.

But if you are in a position where you may fall even a few feet, use a dynamic rope. I'd recommend kernmantle ropes over twisted or "laid" ropes because the kernmantle ropes IME remain more supple and handle better over time.

It's just a matter of using the right tool for the job.
- Static rope: hauling, caving, jumaring
- Dynamic rope: any time a falling load may need to be caught

For those interested in how things can go wrong while climbing, check out the American Alpine Club (and Candadian Alpine Club) "Accidents In Mountaineering" books. They put a new one out for each year.

Golok asked: Are these ropes generally on the heavy side?
Click to expand...
A typical 150 meter 11 mm rope weighs about 7-8 pounds. But it seems to get much heavier the further you have to carry it. ;)

HTH, -- Greg --
 
The use of dynamic line is most definately required for lead climbing or where you can expect a dynamic load on the system (top roping included). For long abseils, caving and rescue situations a static line is often used to reduce the amount of "stretch" in the system.

I am not completely surprised that these fellows were lead climbing on a static line. Had they been using a dynamic line, it is possible that the two pieces of pro would not have pulled. It's hard to say though, as much of the pro that I have seen other people put into place (and trust their well being on) is, quite frankly, crap.

Dynamic ropes are rated and designed to stretch and absorb the energy caused by a factor 2 fall (thus limiting the force that a leader fall causes on the anchoring system and the climber).

"Rokjok"...just posted my message and then saw your response.....I have to agree with your recommendation to read the Accidents in North American Mountaineering - good reference text as to what can go wrong. Ever been up in the Canadia n Rockies enjoying our ice? Awesome routes up here!

Cheers,
D
 
No bad answers here. To simplify, a standard rappelling rope is a STATIC rope, 150', 200' or 300' in length, 7/16" in diameter. It gets alot more complicated, but this is standard.
The standard climbing rope used to be (20 years ago) 11mm in diameter and 150' in length (45 meters). At that time, a rope cost around $130. Over the years, the standard length has become 50 meters, or 165' in length. A new standard is being established- 60 meters in length, just under 200'. This is a good length for long pitches with complicated belays, or for basic "toproping". In this time, the standard diameter has shrunk to 10.5 mm or even 10mm.


Most manufacturers sell a basic climbing rope- 10.5mm by 50m, usually selling for 100 to 120 dollars. This is sufficient for 80% of climbing.

Bluewater, PMI, New England, Mammut, Edelweiss, etc...
 
Originally posted by Diligence
Ever been up in the Canadian Rockies enjoying our ice? Awesome routes up here!
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I never ice climbed in Canada or in Alaska. So I guess I can't say that I've seen Nirvana in its vertical and frozen state. :( Maybe in my next life ...

KindStranger has the more contemporaneous info on what climbers are using these days. Those longer lines were just coming into vogue when I hung my rack up a decade ago. Must give the lead climber an extra pump, adding those extra 30-50 feet to a pitch. ;)
 
Originally posted by RokJok
Unfortunately I never ice climbed in Canada or in Alaska. So I guess I can't say that I've seen Nirvana in its vertical and frozen state. :( Maybe in my next life ...

KindStranger has the more contemporaneous info on what climbers are using these days. Those longer lines were just coming into vogue when I hung my rack up a decade ago. Must give the lead climber an extra pump, adding those extra 30-50 feet to a pitch. ;)
Click to expand...

60 meters has become popular for two reasons.
1. It allows for toproping longer sport routes- the kind where a 50M rope is just a little too short.

2. It allows the rope itself to be used to set up two belays, or at least prevents coming up a little short at the next belay(ouch!).
 
If your doing mountain climbing you should already know what rope you need. If not then you should get some qualified training. It's not easy to learn on the job.
If you want some stout rope just in case 25ft. of 6mm should get you out of most jams. Also 1 or 2 carabiners and a pulley are nice. And wild country (?) makes a nice rope clamp that works with a carabiner, it jams the rope into small teeth. It is not really designed to use on 6mm rope if I recall correctly.
Another thought is use use 1in. tubular webbing instead of rope. With webbing you can get a better grip.<><
 
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