S&M Quality Control and Customer Service?

O

onejim

Joined
Apr 25, 2011
Messages
453
Roughly two years ago, when I was getting back into knives, I bought a 2011 S&M Heritage jack ebony wood.

I loved the thing when it arrived despite its flaws. But as the time went on and the honeymoon ended and I slowly started to be more aware of the flaws. Now I'm really upset about the poor quality, especially considering the $90+ price tag.

Since then, I have purchased several knives.........Case, Buck, Kershaw, Victorinox, ZT, Spyderco, Benchmade. Most of which were nearly half the cost of the S&M.....or just a few dollars more........and nearly flawless on the QC/FF.

The main blade is fine with great walk/talk/snap, but the secondary blade's pull is the lightest ive every had in a knife and has zero snap when fully opening it. and it can almost rock on the half stop.

There is a slight gap on the back springs, but im really ok with that as it is minor.

Several of the pins are raised above the scales and you can really feel them. The bolsters are uneven and don't match from one side to the other, with gaps in the wood scales as they don't match the crooked bolsters. the shield is beautiful, but the wood scales were cut tool large on the top, causing gaps on the top of the shield.

I truly loved the knife when it first arrived. I used it to cut some cardboard boxes to make a cardboard train (Halloween costume) and used it as my light duty office job EDC with no issues. But as I started getting other knives, at half the cost and zero issues..........I started hating the knife.

So, two questions:
- Is this typical of S&M?
- Have I waited too long to contact S&M about the issues?

Thanks for any input.
 
Contact S&M and tell them about your issues. I did when I had a knife with several issues. What they did was tell me the knife was fixed but they could not re-handle so they sent me one of their new knives which was a small coke bottle 1 of 400 made. I told them I collect elephant toes and scout knives. I guess that didn't matter even though they have a scout knife for sale at about the same price as my baby sunfish.The funny thing was my original knife showed up on ebay for sale with all the issues repaired even the pin cracks.Who knows how that happened? One of my friends bought it on ebay and gave it to me to compare the knife to my original pics. I had marked the knife with a nail punch before I sent it in so I could identify it if need be. It was my old knife a real collector 1 of 100 baby sunfish with ebony scales. I didn't care that they wanted to make some of their money back on the knife after all I bought the knife from the previous owners. Anyway send it in but expect the unexpected when they finally get done with you. I almost forgot to tell you that it took over a year and several e-mails to get some sort of service. Send it in and be patient. Then follow knifgirl on ebay. If it's a nice knife it will sell there along with a bunch of other S&M knives that may or may not be new. The Buyer should always beware:rolleyes:
Here's a link to some of the BS that was kicked around at the time. [link to outside forum removed]
Old knife:

Replacement knife:
 
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Others here will be more knowledgeable than me on this subject so I'll just share my limited experience. I too have an ebony Heritage Jack and while I've heard that there were lots of issues with that line, mine is actually one of my favorite knives. That said, it's not perfect. The pull is a bit weaker than I typically like (probably a 4-5), but on this knife I've grown to like it. It also has a couple very minor gaps but aside from that, I have no complaints. It has the look and feel of an 'old knife' and most of my old knives have a few imperfections too.

I own a couple other recently made S&M knives (a Sowbelly and Shiner Pint) and don't have any QC issues to report with regard to them. Again, I'll let others speak to Queen/Schatt & Morgan's customer service as I have no experience with that. Best of luck if you do reach out to them to address your concerns.
 
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What a dismal (and squalid...) saga, gives food for thought though.

It's a shame about the Heritage series as potentially these could've been up to GEC consistency, they're certainly lookers. I have three of them, all good looking knives but they have their 'issues' for sure. looks like the OP needn't bother sending it in....
 
I have heard about qc issues witn Schatt & Morgan knives ,but the three I have owned have been perfect.Perhaps it’s luck of the draw.
 
I like the queen, s&m, and contract knives i have. I've seen current queen at shows and they looked good to me, but i am picky and would have left 1 out 3 behind, but then i won't even touch great eastern...not my taste. As with all traditionals, if you are picky its best to buy at a b&m or with a dealer that takes ready returns or inspects before shipment. Whipping queen on this forum is a common sport, i've judged them by product in hand and not been disappointed. Once i found a less than perfect qieen mt. Man and tried to get the owner (bird in hand, pa) to give me a discount. He said he'd send it back, because they need to know their problems.

With the original poster, you accepted the knife with the flaws and used it. Buyers remorse is not reason for return, except at time of receipt.
 
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Some regular line Queens have been fine, others have had horrible edges, springs, gaps etc. Schatt and Morgan when I first got into knives were top of the line, the Heritage series has some of my favorite looking knives but they have their issues. I've got a two blade spear jack in bone, a single spear blade in rosewood, a two blade spear jack in ebony and a bone premium stockman, all from the Heritage series. They are not as bad as some accounts I've read on here and other places, but they sure aren't the be all end all Queen made them out to be. The edges weren't that great, with the grind on the stockman poor, which was easily rectified by a knifemaker buddy. The springs are very poor on the bone spear jack, to the point of sending it in to Queen to be repaired, the main blade spring sits deep in the liners when in the half open position, and is very loose when opening or closing. Queen said carry it until the spring breaks, then they'll replace it or fix it. The pen blade and it's spring seem to be absolutely fine. I did hear that there was an issue with their spring stock on hand. The good springs are mixed with the bad springs, some were poorly heat treated. The bad ones are pre Daniels family but I heard from a dealer that they are working on it. The same dealer I just bought a brand new Heritage jack from.

I've had a few Queens in the past that were butter knife dull and had bad springs/locks. I bought a single blade trapper several years ago on my birthday that had a super thick edge. Others had barely there springs. They replaced a severely bent spring on a Northwoods stockman, which it's recipient absolutely loves. I've gotten some Queens as gifts and they were fine. I've bought some recent Queens, including a zebra wood MM and ACSB MM, both slipjoints, that were near perfect compared to prior Queens. There is a little hiccup on the ACSB opening, like an unfiled portion, and a growing gap on the zebra wood MM. I would say that they are high end materials and much prettier than Case, but with some of the same issues or worse you would see on a Case knife. From what I have seen, a lot of businesses and customers are sticking with them because of the longevity of the company and the new owners, and especially the promise of a top flight company. I truly believe that they could surpass GEC. Their knives are some of the most beautiful I've seen in a long time, and I just hope that the fit and finish and edges can catch up. I think they would become a powerhouse to be reckoned with.
 
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