Tim the Wizard
Street Samurai
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2012
- Messages
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I previously posted this report over at The High Road under a different username. I asked the mods here if I could repost the content, and I was approved to do so. I did the work and writeup hoping that this information would be useful to some of the community members here that carry a J frame. Comments and discussion are welcome.
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The purpose of this post is to report on the performance of the Speer .38 Spl+P 135 grain short barrel Gold Dot hollow-point as compared to the Buffalo Bore standard pressure.38 Spl 150 grain hard cast wadcutter and the Buffalo Bore Buffalo-Barnes .357 Magnum 140 grain low flash short barrel XPB cartridge out of a S&W 442 and a S&W M&P 340.
The Ammunition
Speer lists the SBGDHP as achieving 11-13" of penetration through various media when traveling over 838 ft/s. Speer lists the muzzle velocity at 860 ft/s out of a 2" barrel. There are many independent tests of this round through ballistic gelatin around the web. Reports tend to confirm penetration around 12" in gelatin even when traveling in the lower 800 ft/s range.
Buffalo Bore lists the velocity of the 150 grain standard pressure hard cast wadcutter at 868 ft/s out of a 2" barrel. There are very few tests of this cartridge around the web. Those that have tested this round in gelatin report total penetration upwards of 22" and the round generally exits the block.
Buffalo Bore lists the velocity of their 140 grain Barnes XPB bullet in their low flash short barrel offering as 1088 ft/s out of a 1 and 7/8" barrel. This XPB bullet has been loaded by Federal, by Barnes themselves as part of their VOR-TX brand, and in several configurations by Buffalo Bore. The XPB bullet, distinct from the TAC-XP bullet featured in the Corbon DPX line, was originally made for hunting. Reports around the web indicate full expansion and over 16" of penetration even when traveling in the 1100 ft/s range. When the round exceeds 1400 ft/s, reports indicate some loss of petals post-expansion and penetration that exceeds 20".
The "New York Reload" Snub Duo
The firearms used for this report were the Smith & Wesson Model 442 Revolver - No Internal Lock and the Smith & Wesson M&P 340 - No Internal Lock. The 442 is a popular J frame airweight revolver in the centennial style with enclosed hammer in an aluminum frame with a stainless steel barrel. The 442 is essentially a blued version of the 642. The weight is approximately 14.6 oz. unloaded and the barrel length is advertised as 1.875".
The Smith & Wesson Model M&P 340 is a J frame chambered for .357 Magnum. It is an airlite revolver in the centennial style with an enclosed hammer in a scandium alloy frame. Unlike the 442, the 340 has a shrouded stainless steel barrel, an XS tritium night sight, and weighs approximately 13.8 oz. unloaded. Like the 442, the M&P 340's barrel length is 1.875".
Here they are sporting maple boot grips by Kim Ahrends and his family and their crew, next to a good deal of brass and a Mini-Bowie by Ban Tang.
Range Report
I had the opportunity to access a rural private range and I was able to take some time alone to put these firearms and their respective cartridges through testing for velocity, accuracy, and recoil.
I always enjoy the drive out as country and shooting just seem right together.
When I was setting up I noticed the somewhat gratuitous lunch of a HUGE Regal Jumping Spider (P. regius).
Subsequently, I was able to shoot the Speer round and the 150 grain wadcutter in the 442 through a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital Chronograph. Following the test, I shot both these rounds plus the short barrel low flash .357 XPB through the M&P 340.
All strings were > or equal to 5 shots. The table below lists several descriptive statistics including range, mean, and std. deviation.
For visual learners, I arranged them in boxplots that show the spread of the velocity for each string as well as outliers marked by o and *.
Noticeable in this output is the relative low velocity of the Gold Dot 135 Grain hollowpoint, which had several bullets in the 760 - 800 range. The mean of the group was 808 ft/s for the 442 and lower for the 340.
The Buffalo Bore 150 grain hard cast wadcutter had remarkably consistent output and very low standard deviation around the mean for both firearms.
Both the SBGDHP and the 150 wadcutter traveled 15-20 ft/s faster in the 442 than the M&P 340.
I previously tested the SBGDHP in the 442 and achieved a mean of 838 ft/s. These results indicate that this 442 has lost velocity for this round over time, or that these batches of SBGDHP are on the slower side. a 20 ft/s difference in mean over time may also be attributed to chronograph error or other confounding variables.
Both rounds have somewhat stout recoil. My personal perception is that the 150 grain wadcutter has slightly less recoil in both guns. I must congratulate Buffalo Bore on provoking a heavier bullet to to travel faster in a cartridge with less pressure when compared to the .38 Spl + P Gold Dot.
It is also noteable that the Buffalo Bore 150 grain rounds were right around published velocity of the maker. Most of the Speer rounds failed to reach velocities published by Speer in their ballistics catalogue. However, they had reached those numbers in my previous report. The Speer cases from today seemed to have a little unburnt powder in them compared to the Buffalo Bore offering.
Primers and crimps were checked during the trip. This photo shows a sample of primers from the 442.
The SBGDHP showed no evidence of "jumping the crimp" or bullet movement on the fifth bullet after firing multiple rounds.
In both the 442 and the M&P340, the 150 hard cast wadcutter showed slight variation. The bullet to the right shows movement of the wadcutter out of its case.
Speer did a good job limiting this movement in the short barrel Gold Dot!
Despite this movement in the wadcutter, there was plenty of room in the cylinder to accommodate the change. I did not perceive this to be a risk but I report it here for your consideration.
Here is the fifth bullet in the cylinder after firing 4 similar rounds:
Magnum
One interesting aspect of the M&P 340 is its versatility and its ability to shoot both .38 Spl and .357 Mag cartridges.
Previously, I tested the 140 grain XPB Buffalo-Barnes short barrel low flash offering in a Ruger SP101 which has a barrel length of 2.25".
In the SP101, it performed quite admirably, averaging 1178 ft/s and creating a perfect hollowpoint when shot through water.
In the M&P 340, the XPB achieved an average of 1074 ft/s, which represents a 14 ft/s difference from the published velocity.
Although I have not tested the round in gelatin, it is clear that this XPB load offers a distinct power advantage over the others, as you might expect in most .357 Magnum to .38 comparisons.
Here are the magnum primers:
Speer does offer a short barrel .357 Magnum Gold Dot. It is advertised as a 135 grain bullet traveling 990 ft/s out of a 2" barrel. I have not tested this round, however it would be unusual for these particular guns to exceed the published velocities. This Buffalo Bore XPB round can be considered slightly heavier and significantly faster than the GD. I have no report on other comparable characteristics of the two cartridges.
In the M&P 340, the fifth XPB round did have some slight crimp jump, as seen below on the right cartridge:
However, I had no issues with binding or any failures to fire. You can see the available space in the cylinder of the fifth round, after four other XPB's had been fired:
Accuracy and Recoil
From L to R in the M&P 340: Gold Dot; Wadcutter; XPB
I tended to shoot in the upper right quadrant with the Gold dot and the wadcutter through both firearms. I tended to shoot a little to the left with the XPB. The stray rounds in the photo were intentional.
I feel a little more accurate in both the 442 and the 340 with the Buffalo Bore wadcutter. However, all of the rounds had sufficient close-range accuracy for my purposes of carrying these as quintessential "belly guns".
I did test them one handed with the strong side, and I did alright. I won't bother to show you my weak side hits, as there were none...
All of these shots were taken from about 10'.
These are the one-handed draw and shoot hits with the wadcutter in the 442 (big holes) and the XPB in the 340 (little holes on the paper):
As to recoil... despite my intention to report back with good data on these rounds, I can say that I over did it a bit. I don't ever want to shoot 75 on-the-hotter-side rounds out of <20 oz. revolvers in one go again.
The 150 wadcutter had the least recoil, although in all honesty it is about even with the Gold dot. The XPB goes BOOM and you feel it.
My hand after >75 J frame rounds.
The .357 was brutal, loud, and impressive. I was happy with the accuracy of it, despite the recoil, and I think it deserves consideration as a carry round just for the power factor. However, with power comes compromise. I am not sure if I am ready to make that compromise, but I know the 340 has no issue with this round after today's testing.
With the wadcutter, I was able to knock down a steel plate at over 50' on the first shot. It could of been luck, as I was unable to repeat it with any of the rounds, and I did try. Maybe I will work on that some more later.
All said and done, based on these tests I am seriously considering moving on from the 135 SBGDHP that I have carried for many years. The wadcutter is compelling, especially for those of us that might have a positive bias towards penetration, although I daresay all of these should be considered as top performers.
Featured here among the fallen brass and some holsters by Bob Mika.
Thanks for reading!
************
The purpose of this post is to report on the performance of the Speer .38 Spl+P 135 grain short barrel Gold Dot hollow-point as compared to the Buffalo Bore standard pressure.38 Spl 150 grain hard cast wadcutter and the Buffalo Bore Buffalo-Barnes .357 Magnum 140 grain low flash short barrel XPB cartridge out of a S&W 442 and a S&W M&P 340.
The Ammunition
Speer lists the SBGDHP as achieving 11-13" of penetration through various media when traveling over 838 ft/s. Speer lists the muzzle velocity at 860 ft/s out of a 2" barrel. There are many independent tests of this round through ballistic gelatin around the web. Reports tend to confirm penetration around 12" in gelatin even when traveling in the lower 800 ft/s range.
Buffalo Bore lists the velocity of the 150 grain standard pressure hard cast wadcutter at 868 ft/s out of a 2" barrel. There are very few tests of this cartridge around the web. Those that have tested this round in gelatin report total penetration upwards of 22" and the round generally exits the block.
Buffalo Bore lists the velocity of their 140 grain Barnes XPB bullet in their low flash short barrel offering as 1088 ft/s out of a 1 and 7/8" barrel. This XPB bullet has been loaded by Federal, by Barnes themselves as part of their VOR-TX brand, and in several configurations by Buffalo Bore. The XPB bullet, distinct from the TAC-XP bullet featured in the Corbon DPX line, was originally made for hunting. Reports around the web indicate full expansion and over 16" of penetration even when traveling in the 1100 ft/s range. When the round exceeds 1400 ft/s, reports indicate some loss of petals post-expansion and penetration that exceeds 20".
The "New York Reload" Snub Duo
The firearms used for this report were the Smith & Wesson Model 442 Revolver - No Internal Lock and the Smith & Wesson M&P 340 - No Internal Lock. The 442 is a popular J frame airweight revolver in the centennial style with enclosed hammer in an aluminum frame with a stainless steel barrel. The 442 is essentially a blued version of the 642. The weight is approximately 14.6 oz. unloaded and the barrel length is advertised as 1.875".
The Smith & Wesson Model M&P 340 is a J frame chambered for .357 Magnum. It is an airlite revolver in the centennial style with an enclosed hammer in a scandium alloy frame. Unlike the 442, the 340 has a shrouded stainless steel barrel, an XS tritium night sight, and weighs approximately 13.8 oz. unloaded. Like the 442, the M&P 340's barrel length is 1.875".
Here they are sporting maple boot grips by Kim Ahrends and his family and their crew, next to a good deal of brass and a Mini-Bowie by Ban Tang.
Range Report
I had the opportunity to access a rural private range and I was able to take some time alone to put these firearms and their respective cartridges through testing for velocity, accuracy, and recoil.
I always enjoy the drive out as country and shooting just seem right together.
When I was setting up I noticed the somewhat gratuitous lunch of a HUGE Regal Jumping Spider (P. regius).
Subsequently, I was able to shoot the Speer round and the 150 grain wadcutter in the 442 through a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital Chronograph. Following the test, I shot both these rounds plus the short barrel low flash .357 XPB through the M&P 340.
All strings were > or equal to 5 shots. The table below lists several descriptive statistics including range, mean, and std. deviation.
For visual learners, I arranged them in boxplots that show the spread of the velocity for each string as well as outliers marked by o and *.
Noticeable in this output is the relative low velocity of the Gold Dot 135 Grain hollowpoint, which had several bullets in the 760 - 800 range. The mean of the group was 808 ft/s for the 442 and lower for the 340.
The Buffalo Bore 150 grain hard cast wadcutter had remarkably consistent output and very low standard deviation around the mean for both firearms.
Both the SBGDHP and the 150 wadcutter traveled 15-20 ft/s faster in the 442 than the M&P 340.
I previously tested the SBGDHP in the 442 and achieved a mean of 838 ft/s. These results indicate that this 442 has lost velocity for this round over time, or that these batches of SBGDHP are on the slower side. a 20 ft/s difference in mean over time may also be attributed to chronograph error or other confounding variables.
Both rounds have somewhat stout recoil. My personal perception is that the 150 grain wadcutter has slightly less recoil in both guns. I must congratulate Buffalo Bore on provoking a heavier bullet to to travel faster in a cartridge with less pressure when compared to the .38 Spl + P Gold Dot.
It is also noteable that the Buffalo Bore 150 grain rounds were right around published velocity of the maker. Most of the Speer rounds failed to reach velocities published by Speer in their ballistics catalogue. However, they had reached those numbers in my previous report. The Speer cases from today seemed to have a little unburnt powder in them compared to the Buffalo Bore offering.
Primers and crimps were checked during the trip. This photo shows a sample of primers from the 442.
The SBGDHP showed no evidence of "jumping the crimp" or bullet movement on the fifth bullet after firing multiple rounds.
In both the 442 and the M&P340, the 150 hard cast wadcutter showed slight variation. The bullet to the right shows movement of the wadcutter out of its case.
Speer did a good job limiting this movement in the short barrel Gold Dot!
Despite this movement in the wadcutter, there was plenty of room in the cylinder to accommodate the change. I did not perceive this to be a risk but I report it here for your consideration.
Here is the fifth bullet in the cylinder after firing 4 similar rounds:
Magnum
One interesting aspect of the M&P 340 is its versatility and its ability to shoot both .38 Spl and .357 Mag cartridges.
Previously, I tested the 140 grain XPB Buffalo-Barnes short barrel low flash offering in a Ruger SP101 which has a barrel length of 2.25".
In the SP101, it performed quite admirably, averaging 1178 ft/s and creating a perfect hollowpoint when shot through water.
In the M&P 340, the XPB achieved an average of 1074 ft/s, which represents a 14 ft/s difference from the published velocity.
Although I have not tested the round in gelatin, it is clear that this XPB load offers a distinct power advantage over the others, as you might expect in most .357 Magnum to .38 comparisons.
Here are the magnum primers:
Speer does offer a short barrel .357 Magnum Gold Dot. It is advertised as a 135 grain bullet traveling 990 ft/s out of a 2" barrel. I have not tested this round, however it would be unusual for these particular guns to exceed the published velocities. This Buffalo Bore XPB round can be considered slightly heavier and significantly faster than the GD. I have no report on other comparable characteristics of the two cartridges.
In the M&P 340, the fifth XPB round did have some slight crimp jump, as seen below on the right cartridge:
However, I had no issues with binding or any failures to fire. You can see the available space in the cylinder of the fifth round, after four other XPB's had been fired:
Accuracy and Recoil
From L to R in the M&P 340: Gold Dot; Wadcutter; XPB
I tended to shoot in the upper right quadrant with the Gold dot and the wadcutter through both firearms. I tended to shoot a little to the left with the XPB. The stray rounds in the photo were intentional.
I feel a little more accurate in both the 442 and the 340 with the Buffalo Bore wadcutter. However, all of the rounds had sufficient close-range accuracy for my purposes of carrying these as quintessential "belly guns".
I did test them one handed with the strong side, and I did alright. I won't bother to show you my weak side hits, as there were none...
All of these shots were taken from about 10'.
These are the one-handed draw and shoot hits with the wadcutter in the 442 (big holes) and the XPB in the 340 (little holes on the paper):
As to recoil... despite my intention to report back with good data on these rounds, I can say that I over did it a bit. I don't ever want to shoot 75 on-the-hotter-side rounds out of <20 oz. revolvers in one go again.
The 150 wadcutter had the least recoil, although in all honesty it is about even with the Gold dot. The XPB goes BOOM and you feel it.
My hand after >75 J frame rounds.
The .357 was brutal, loud, and impressive. I was happy with the accuracy of it, despite the recoil, and I think it deserves consideration as a carry round just for the power factor. However, with power comes compromise. I am not sure if I am ready to make that compromise, but I know the 340 has no issue with this round after today's testing.
With the wadcutter, I was able to knock down a steel plate at over 50' on the first shot. It could of been luck, as I was unable to repeat it with any of the rounds, and I did try. Maybe I will work on that some more later.
All said and done, based on these tests I am seriously considering moving on from the 135 SBGDHP that I have carried for many years. The wadcutter is compelling, especially for those of us that might have a positive bias towards penetration, although I daresay all of these should be considered as top performers.
Featured here among the fallen brass and some holsters by Bob Mika.
Thanks for reading!
