S30V Steel, is it that much better

PartialSerrations · Jan 30, 2005

Gentlemen,
If there is a posted forum on this subject please guide me in the right direction so I don't bring up the same subject again. I'm just an ole stubborn fart I guess. I like ATS 34 / 154 cm steel. Many of the major knife manufacturers swear by it such as MOD, Emerson, Cutters Knife and Tool, and Benchmade. I'm paranoid about obtaining a product I can't sharpen. I figured out the chisel grind myth about sharpening so maybe S30V won't be such a challenge. Is it really that much better? If it is then why are many of the best custom knife makers out their avoiding it. I heard it's a real bear to grind. Any comparasion charts would be great. My knife use pertains to mostly rope, boxes, and parachute cord so ATS 34 / 154 cm fills the bill nicely. Does S30V sharpen easily with ceramic stones on a sharpmaker or do I have to purchase some diamond hones. Any help in this matter would be great. Thanks for reading my forum!!!

IF WAR IS HELL, TAKE A BETTER PITCHFORK THAN THE DEVIL

Milu · Jan 30, 2005

I've fully sharpened S30V once on a knife that had NO edge and very little bevel. I used a Lansky type kit to do the hard work and finished with a Sharpmaker. Result razor sharp. It wasn't that big a deal.

I have a knife in 154cm that came sharp but not sharp enough. Honing that so it was acceptable was much, much more trouble, and I am still not totally satisfied.

I don't believe it is only steel type that influences ease of sharpening and touch ups. Hardness obviously but I also believe the blade geometry has a large part to play.

I am sure the experts will chip in.

SIFU1A · Jan 30, 2005

imho all the higher grade stuff (ie M2/D2/S30V) is a LITTLE harder to sharpen than ATS34/154CM but not that big a deal, as long as ya have good sharpening equipment like a sharpmaker/good ark stones/norton india stone/etc, i am sure the diamond stuff would work faster but my std sharpmaker rods have always worked fine for me, never really needed them myself. and i have sharpened talonite with the std stuff too.

and they do hold an edge longer, but again not that big a deal imho, its better than ATS34/154CM but not THAT much better, but it is enough to notice it.

if ya can sharpen 154CM/ATS34 ya can sharpen anything out there i have seen anyway, might take a LITTLE longer, imho funky bevels on knives prob make it harder to sharpen than the composition of the steel.

guy g · Jan 30, 2005

Something to keep in mind. Some of the makers are now cooking S30V to 59-60. That will make sharpening different than the 55-57 used on some knives. P.S. the steel as designed was supposed to be used at the lower hardness so to be easier to sharpen for the average consumer. The dealer I bought my CR's from said the customers love it.

Nakano 2 · Jan 30, 2005

I' ve been quite satisfied in using a BladeTech ProHunter in S30V for over a year now. Although it sports a V grind, I' ve managed to thin out the edge bevel a bit on a diamond benchstone. It holds a very good edge, at least as well as ATS34 and 154 CM. I' ve always used a diamond benchstone and have not experienced any more difficulty than if I were sharpening my other steels. Milu is correct in that the edge bevel (thickness) does play a role in determining how much effort is needed to get it sharp. But experience will let the user know how much pressure is required to sharpen certain steels. So I say go with a diamond benchstone. Or a Triangle Sharpmaker if you desire.

N.

klattman · Jan 30, 2005

No problem at all, at least with spyderco ceramics. If you want speed you may need to get a coarse diamonds.

Sharpmaker stones are very very hard, but may not be coarse enough if you have a lot of metal to remove. (would simply take longer)

HoB · Jan 30, 2005

Personally, I have had very good experiences with ATS-34. Good enough, that I believe buying a new knife just because of a new steel is unnessary. On the other hand I am a "steel snob" and want to try as many steels as I can (afford). I think that both VG-10 and S30V hold an edge better than ATS-34 and S30V is also supposed to be tougher. Sharpening is no problem, the sharpmaker works real good. Reprofiling takes definitely longer than ATS-34 for example but with decent benchstones is not a problem either. S30V is definitely nothing to shun and IMO you are getting indeed a better steel, but I don't see a need to throw out a knife just because of a blade in ATS-34/154CM.

DRider · Jan 30, 2005

I have a Pro Hunter and a Skirmish both in S30V. Neither was particularly hard to harpen on the Edgemaker's ceramic stones.

VampyreWolf · Jan 30, 2005

I have been using a BM921s in 30v since march 04... wasn't too impressed with the steel, acted more like vg-10 than 440v(60v) for edge retention.

Just got a spydie lil temp leaf in 30v 3 weeks ago... 3 weeks of daily use and it still shaves. And thats incuding cutting food on a hard plastic cutting board for a few meals.

Still off work, so I can't say how long it'll last on boxes, rope and nylon tarp material, but so far it's blown BM's effort out of the water.

WYK · Feb 1, 2005

S30V, unlike ATS-34 and 154CM, has a significant amount of vanadium. Vanadian carbides are some of the hardest, if not THE hardest, there are. Thus, it can hold an edge longer at the same RC scale(all else being equal), allowing you to use a lower edge angle to promote even more sharpness for the same edge wear. It holds it's edge better than BG-42, too. It is also stronger due to it taking well to tempering and having a finer grain structure - it can take more stress than ATS-34 or 154CM before it permanently bends or breaks. In fact, I saw on a CPM site that stated it had twice as much strength(toughness, or whatever they call it) when it came to bending, and more even than D2.

WYK