SAKs - Tool-by-Tool

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UnknownVT

Joined
Feb 15, 2003
Messages
2,575
Can-Opener

I had always thought that the different sized SAKs (84mm thru 111mm) all used the same basic tools.

That is until I recently got the 84mm Victorinox (Economy) Sportsman II - see this linked thread if you have access to SOSAK.

Looking at this 84mm model more closely I realized that not only was it (obviously) shorter than the standard 91mm models - but it was narrower as well - one can just discern it in this photo:
84mm91mm.jpg


Anyone with both 84mm and 91mm models can simply put one on top of the other to see the difference.

Glancing at the Sportsman II can-opener I thought that it was just perceptibly smaller - so I dug out a representative example of each size (84mm, 91mm, 94mm and 111mm and even the SwissTool) and compared them.
CanOpeners1.jpg
CanOpeners2.jpg


One can (pun intended :D ) just about make out the 84mm Sportsman II can-opener is just perceptibly smaller/narrower - perhaps hard to see for some......

However surprisingly the can-opener of of the biggest SAK the 111mm WorkChamp seemed smaller too......

Close up of 84mm and 111mm compared to standard 91mm
CanOpener111mm.jpg


Hopefully one can see that the 111mm is not smaller - because it simply sits further in the handle making it look smaller - look more carefully at its width. Notice how the 84mm Sportsman II can-opener is smaller - both shorter and narrower.

I've seen some other people say that the can-opener of the Soldier is bigger/heavier duty.

This is NOT so, at least on my one sample of the 02 Soldier bought recently - it seems the same size

Close-up compared to the standard 91mm, and 111mm SAKs as well as the smaller 84mm -
CanOpenersSoldier.jpg


--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
Vincent,
Your posts on the tiny differences of SAKs are the best and I love your photography! I have noticed most of the things that you point out but your pictures drive the messages home.
I haven't had an 84mm two blade for a while but if I remember, isn't the small blade on those models the same dimensions as the small blades on the 91mm models making it look odd in a neat way when it's open. I always liked the look of the larger-than-normal small blade in the smaller frame of the 84mm.
Adam
 
APS said:
Your posts on the tiny differences of SAKs are the best and I love your photography! I have noticed most of the things that you point out but your pictures drive the messages home.
I haven't had an 84mm two blade for a while but if I remember, isn't the small blade on those models the same dimensions as the small blades on the 91mm models making it look odd in a neat way when it's open. I always liked the look of the larger-than-normal small blade in the smaller frame of the 84mm.
Click to expand...

Adam,

Thank you so much for your kind comments.

You know, I have to confess - not to have done a comparison of the small blades yet :o - I now certainly will ;)

My excuse is that that Sportsman II is literally my first 84mm with the standard separate can-opener and large screwdriver tools, and I hadn't even thought about it - the small blade.

I have an infatuation with the combo tool, and most of my SAKs seem to have the combo tool -
ComboTools.jpg


That may explain why the small blade and the standard can-opener and separate large screwdrivers despite being "standard" are actually strangely kind of scarce for me........
well - that's my feeble excuse anyway :) :o

Please take a look at these threads -

Minimalist SAKs

My EDC Story - Victorinox Combo Tool Story


Lastly BTW -

Just in case you didn't know the pics posted in this thread were all done by "scanner photography" - I just arranged the knives on a simple (read cheapo) flatbed scanner.

A flatbed scanner in most cases will avoid the common problems that plague a lot of photos - of focus and exposure.

Being attached to the computer - it is a lot faster and more convenient than even a digital camera.

I have often scan-photographed knives, literally while on-line, to illustrate a point in a posting.

Scanner photography may not be particularly "artistic" - but then again a lot of times all we want are clear (in focus) and well exposed utilitarian functional photos - which the scanner easily does without much skill or experience required in photography.

I urge people with scanners to try it.

Please take a look at this post:

some general flatbed Scanners advice

An important note: even when scanning a "low" resolution of 100dpi - a full scan will yield an image of about 1100x850 pixels which is WAY TOO BIG to display on most people's screens - and is a PAIN to download for people not on HighSpeed internet. PLEASE be considerate and re-size the photo to something more managable around about 480x360 is a good size.

AND please use JPG compression to quality level "7" or 70% this should get the file-size down to about <30Kb.

I've seen photos at about 480x360 pixels BUT the file size was still over 200KB - which is ridiculous, as it really doesn't gain anything on visual quality having a larger file size - just frustrates people on modems.

--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
Vincent, thanks for the links. I didn't realize that you used a scanner, that makes sense and would be easier with regards to lighting. I need to get one sometime.
I can tell by your other threads and what you said above that you prefer the combo tool. I am on the other side of the fence and HAVE to have a smaller blade to do things like trimming cuticles and other small jobs that I have trouble controlling the tip of the large blade which is why I never carry my Compact.
Do you also carry a smaller blade or maybe 'choke up' on the large blade for those smaller jobs? When my main carry is a Soldier, I usually put the Classic on my keyring just for that smaller blade :)
Adam
 
APS said:
Do you also carry a smaller blade or maybe 'choke up' on the large blade for those smaller jobs? When my main carry is a Soldier, I usually put the Classic on my keyring just for that smaller blade :)
Click to expand...

Nope, I just choke up on the large blade - I don't think that I can recall finding the standard large SAK blade too big for any task I normally do - so the small blade would be superfluous to me.

and - er-hum, cough-cough - (doubly embarrassed :o ) - that 84mm Sportsman II - despite having the standard separate standard can-opener and large screwdriver tools - doesn't actually have a small blade (!) - instead it has a nail-file combined with nail cleaner-tip tool -

SportsmanII3.jpg


So I actually still can't compare a small blade from an 84mm SAK,
as I still don't have one.... :o

--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
Over on SOSAK someone suggested that the Alox Pinoneer series (of which the Soldier and Farmer are part) can-openers while not any larger are actually thicker - giving a measurement of 2.0mm thick for the standard 91mm SAK while a Farmer (in red Alox) was 2.35mm.

I thought of the difference in thickness and did do a quick look-see before I posted and I thought that the Soldier's Can-Opener looked to be the same thickness as the regular 91mm SAKs - now the lighting in my room was not the best, and my eye-sight.. the less said the better :o

Now I do know that the main blade on the Soldier and (I assume) the Pioneer Alox series (of which the Farmer is one) are noticably thicker.

But the can-opener - at least on my "02" Soldier - if it's any thicker I certainly could not see - and I would have thought an over 15% difference can easily be seen.

So after being told the difference I (obviously) went back and re-examined the can-openers - I'll let my photos speak for themselves -

Side-by-side:
CanOpenersSoldSC.jpg


Layers head-to-head
CanOpenersSoldSC2.jpg



I looked not only at the actual can-openers -
but also literally head-to-head with the layers lining up the liners -
and even with good lighting and magnifying glass -
try as I might, I cannot see a difference in thickness that's anywhere near 15% -
as those photos hopefully show.

What do others think?

--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
OK, more good stuff Vincent. I have in front of my my Ranger, 03 $13-from-Target Solder and the digital caliper that I use to check OAL of reloaded ammunition.
For the bottle opener/screwdriver:
Ranger at the shank 1.8mm thick, at the thinnest part of the screwdriver blade, 5.6mm wide (measuring over the back and inside the curve.
For the Soldier, 2.1mm and 7.3mm respectively.

For main blades:
Ranger is 2.3mm thick at the shank and .9mm thick at the farthest tip of the nail nick. 12.1mm wide at the middle of the nail nick.
Solder is 2.6mm, 1.1mm and 13.9mm respectively.

I like the thicker tools on the Soldier but miss the toothpick/tweezer and small blade. Now, if they upped their standard line or at least offered the outdoor oriented models (Ranger, Camper, etc) with the thicker tools and blades that would be awesome.
Adam
 
APS said:
For the bottle opener/screwdriver:
Ranger at the shank 1.8mm thick, at the thinnest part of the screwdriver blade, 5.6mm wide (measuring over the back and inside the curve.
For the Soldier, 2.1mm and 7.3mm respectively.
Click to expand...

Adam,

Many thanks for the measurements.

The large screwdriver/bottle cap-lifter tool certainly looks larger and more substantial on the (94mm) "02" Soldier I have - over the standard 91mm SAKs. The 84mm Sportsman II looks smaller still -
screwdriv2.jpg


--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
I just re-discovered my swiss army knives a few months ago, when I came accross my first, and well worn, Victorinox Camper (now 20+years old). The saw is still sharp, amazing to me since I must have de-forested my old neighborhood with it growing up.

Can you post a comparison of the Farmer VS the Soldier? I'm curious to see just how much thicker it is.

Just picked up my second Soldier at Target for only $14! :)
 
Thanks for the post! Good comparison. You seem to own a lot of SAKs, any suggestion on where to buy?
 
Mr.Moose said:
Thanks for the post! Good comparison. You seem to own a lot of SAKs, any suggestion on where to buy?
Click to expand...

For the available Victorinox model configurations in the US - I check on SwissArmy.com and note the US model #.

To check low prices - I just use froogle.com - use the US model number for a more precise search - eg: the Farmer would be -
"Victorinox 53964" -
there are some pretty low prices out there -
but, as always, be aware of shipping charges.

I have had good dealings with Brian at DiscountKnivesOnLine.com - the shipping was always a flat $3.85 which was the exact Priority Mail price.
Brian used to be a one man operation, so when he is away (at a show for example) there would be NO response from him (obviously) -
so I always used to write e-mail to him to do a stock check first - and get a reply - before placing any order.

--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
OK, since we are talking about the combo tool, will someone please tell me what the little semi-circle cutout at the base of the tool is for. By base, I mean close to where the tool pivots. It's driving me nuts... what is this feature's purpose???
 
manicreader said:
OK, since we are talking about the combo tool, will someone please tell me what the little semi-circle cutout at the base of the tool is for. By base, I mean close to where the tool pivots. It's driving me nuts... what is this feature's purpose???
Click to expand...

Wire stripper. (Cuts the little plastic line around electrical wires and such)

Vincent,
How does the Farmer compare in thickness to the Camper? Thanks,
-Kevin
 
manicreader said:
OK, since we are talking about the combo tool, will someone please tell me what the little semi-circle cutout at the base of the tool is for. By base, I mean close to where the tool pivots. It's driving me nuts... what is this feature's purpose???
Click to expand...

Look 6 posts up from yours (post #8) the standard large screwdriver/bottle cap-lifter tool has that same notch as in the combo tool -
ComboScnWait.jpg


It is as Kevin (Morgoth412) described - supposed to be a wire-stripper as in:
WireStrp.jpg


Kevin - I don't know what the Farmer's thickness is compared to the Camper, as I don't have a Farmer - well, no more than you can by yourself -

I can compare a Soldier and a Camper, and measurements were given for both the Farmer and the Soldier (in my previous post above) -
the Farmer is almost 1/10th inch thicker than the Soldier -

So as a guess - I would say that the 3 backspring Farmer is similar in thickness to the 3 backspring Camper... the thinner Alox scales make up for the slightly thicker main blade/awl backspring/layer - with the exception of the corkscrew protrusion on the Camper......

But then why would you trust my guess any more than your own judgement? :confused: :confused:

--
Vincent

http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
 
UnknownVT said:
So as a guess - I would say that the 3 backspring Farmer is similar in thickness to the 3 backspring Camper... the thinner Alox scales make up for the slightly thicker main blade/awl backspring/layer - with the exception of the corkscrew protrusion on the Camper......

But then why would you trust my guess any more than your own judgement? :confused: :confused:
Click to expand...

Vincent,
I think thats a fairly reasonable guess. You obviously thought it through, and having a Farmer, which I don't, you certainly have more info to go on then me.

I'll post the question in the other thread I started on the Camper Vs. Farmer.
-Kevin
 
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