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The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is $300 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
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SAS Smock?
- Thread starter bmstrong
- Start date
K Williams
Gold Member
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I always wore an SAS smock during my time in the army. A fantastic bit of kit. Lightweight, windproof, quick drying - I loved mine.
It is called a smock but it has a full length zip, so it is actually a jacket. I believe the WW2 version was an over-the-head on/off smock, but the name stuck, even after it became a jacket.
There is also the Royal Marines Arctic Windproof jacket that has a wired hood and rank slides on the front and rear, otherwise similar to the SAS smock.
Expect to pay around £100 for a genuine SAS or Arctic Windproof smock.
Watch out for fakes, ther are plenty around.
Silvermans does genuine kit, as does http://www.strikeforcesupplies.co.uk/16.shtml
If you're into British gear check out Arktis . They make windproof smocks, available in many different camouflage patterns, and although they are not issue gear they are excellent kit. Also see their Classic Chest Rig. It is .......classic!
It is called a smock but it has a full length zip, so it is actually a jacket. I believe the WW2 version was an over-the-head on/off smock, but the name stuck, even after it became a jacket.
There is also the Royal Marines Arctic Windproof jacket that has a wired hood and rank slides on the front and rear, otherwise similar to the SAS smock.
Expect to pay around £100 for a genuine SAS or Arctic Windproof smock.
Watch out for fakes, ther are plenty around.
Silvermans does genuine kit, as does http://www.strikeforcesupplies.co.uk/16.shtml
If you're into British gear check out Arktis . They make windproof smocks, available in many different camouflage patterns, and although they are not issue gear they are excellent kit. Also see their Classic Chest Rig. It is .......classic!
- Joined
- May 21, 2003
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- 232
Steven, are the issue SAS smocks Ventile Cotton (see www.ventile.co.uk)? I've read they are.
Arktis (www.arktis.co.uk) also makes a couple nice versions in a variety of camoflage patterns. Oops--I see you've already posted a link to Arktis. Great minds think alike
Arktis (www.arktis.co.uk) also makes a couple nice versions in a variety of camoflage patterns. Oops--I see you've already posted a link to Arktis. Great minds think alike
This is the theory (from the Arktis website):
1015: Waterproof Smock
Ripstop outer fabric with breathable waterproof dropliner. No need to carry an additional waterproof outer. Lined with ultralight 77gmw liner, seam taped.
In practice, it just works very very well. It has an unbelievably wide range of adjustment according to the elements, depending on how much you pull the zipper. If you zip it all the way up and use the hood as well, it is a very good outer layer for snow and low temperatures. If you unzip it to just below the neckline, it is just a cold weather jacket. If you unzip it more, it works for warmer weather. The waterproof breathable layer works very well, so there are a lot of possible combinations: you can wear it over a single shirt in autumn, or you can wear it over three layers of cold weather clothes in a snowstorm. You have to wear it in order to really appreciate it, and of course the workmanship is exceptional. It does not look like cheap army surplus, it looks like a high quality garment, but it is very rugged at the same time.
1015: Waterproof Smock
Ripstop outer fabric with breathable waterproof dropliner. No need to carry an additional waterproof outer. Lined with ultralight 77gmw liner, seam taped.
In practice, it just works very very well. It has an unbelievably wide range of adjustment according to the elements, depending on how much you pull the zipper. If you zip it all the way up and use the hood as well, it is a very good outer layer for snow and low temperatures. If you unzip it to just below the neckline, it is just a cold weather jacket. If you unzip it more, it works for warmer weather. The waterproof breathable layer works very well, so there are a lot of possible combinations: you can wear it over a single shirt in autumn, or you can wear it over three layers of cold weather clothes in a snowstorm. You have to wear it in order to really appreciate it, and of course the workmanship is exceptional. It does not look like cheap army surplus, it looks like a high quality garment, but it is very rugged at the same time.
K Williams
Gold Member
- Joined
- Nov 17, 1998
- Messages
- 3,286
What do these stand for...
"OG, BK, DP, SC, FK, AU, DN, CE, BE, US, LE"
Some I already know:
OG-Olive Green
BK-Black
DP-Dispursed Pattern(jungle or desert?)
SC-?
FK-?
AU-?
DN-?
CE-?
BE-?
US-I'm guessing US Woodland Camo
LE-?
"OG, BK, DP, SC, FK, AU, DN, CE, BE, US, LE"
Some I already know:
OG-Olive Green
BK-Black
DP-Dispursed Pattern(jungle or desert?)
SC-?
FK-?
AU-?
DN-?
CE-?
BE-?
US-I'm guessing US Woodland Camo
LE-?
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2002
- Messages
- 2,167
FK - Flecktarn (German)
AU - Auscam (Australian)
DN - Dancam (Danish)
CE - Central European (French)
BE - Belgian
SC - Swedish
LE - Leaf, like Mossy Oak
DP - Disruptive Pattern (British)
US - American
OG - Olive Green
BK - Black
AU - Auscam (Australian)
DN - Dancam (Danish)
CE - Central European (French)
BE - Belgian
SC - Swedish
LE - Leaf, like Mossy Oak
DP - Disruptive Pattern (British)
US - American
OG - Olive Green
BK - Black
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2002
- Messages
- 2,167
I recently bought this Ventile smock, made by Snowsled in the UK.
It is the smock I have wanted for about twelve years! It exceptionally well-made, out of 6.5oz single layer ventile.
It cost a lot of money (£200) but in my opinion it is worth every penny.
It is the smock I have wanted for about twelve years! It exceptionally well-made, out of 6.5oz single layer ventile.
It cost a lot of money (£200) but in my opinion it is worth every penny.
- Joined
- Jun 16, 2003
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- 20,200
Ah yes, Ventile. Memories of the 1960's come flooding back. D flashlights. Trapper Nelson Pack Boards. Hyperventilating while blowing up the air mattress each night. Wool. 
Ventile is a dense, 100% cotton, uncoated fabric. In theory, as it encounters water, the fibers swell, and block penetration. In fact, once saturated, it will leak wherever it touches anything -- like you -- which breaks the surface tension. This is the same behavior as exhibited by cotton tents. That is why Ventile fails the test for the rating "Waterproof" and barely meets "Water repellant." (Vendors fudge by using undefined terms like "Weatherproof.") Ventile becomes a sponge in prolonged, heavy rain. Used as an outer layer with a breathable, waterproof liner, it becomes VERY heavy when saturated and prevents breathing by the inner liner. Hence, Ventile ceased to be a major player in the outdoor garment market a generation ago. It hangs on in Europe - especially the UK.
As for military usage as an endorsement, remember that the military took 30+ years to adopt padded weight-bearing waist belts on their packs. Actually, it's more like 130 years. An Army surgeon tried to sell the military on transferring pack weight to a heavy cotton waist belt via wooden struts during the U.S. Civil War. Then there's the "deadoption" of magazine rifles as soon as the Civl War was over. Military intelligence should not be used to select kit.
For use where heavy rain is not anticipated, Ventile is quite good as it is wind-resistant and quite breathable -- as is uncoated Nylon which costs a fraction of the usual price for Ventile. Ventile is more resistant to flame than Nylon. Cotton is less resistant to abrasion and less strong than Nylon.
Ventile is a dense, 100% cotton, uncoated fabric. In theory, as it encounters water, the fibers swell, and block penetration. In fact, once saturated, it will leak wherever it touches anything -- like you -- which breaks the surface tension. This is the same behavior as exhibited by cotton tents. That is why Ventile fails the test for the rating "Waterproof" and barely meets "Water repellant." (Vendors fudge by using undefined terms like "Weatherproof.") Ventile becomes a sponge in prolonged, heavy rain. Used as an outer layer with a breathable, waterproof liner, it becomes VERY heavy when saturated and prevents breathing by the inner liner. Hence, Ventile ceased to be a major player in the outdoor garment market a generation ago. It hangs on in Europe - especially the UK.
As for military usage as an endorsement, remember that the military took 30+ years to adopt padded weight-bearing waist belts on their packs. Actually, it's more like 130 years. An Army surgeon tried to sell the military on transferring pack weight to a heavy cotton waist belt via wooden struts during the U.S. Civil War. Then there's the "deadoption" of magazine rifles as soon as the Civl War was over. Military intelligence should not be used to select kit.
For use where heavy rain is not anticipated, Ventile is quite good as it is wind-resistant and quite breathable -- as is uncoated Nylon which costs a fraction of the usual price for Ventile. Ventile is more resistant to flame than Nylon. Cotton is less resistant to abrasion and less strong than Nylon.
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True, Ventile is not waterproof. But if I wanted a waterproof jacket I would have bought one.
I bought Ventile as a quiet, comfortable, fireside friendly, WINDPROOF outer for cold WINDY days.
And what a smock.
You can keep your nylon!
Oh, and I like wool too.....
I bought Ventile as a quiet, comfortable, fireside friendly, WINDPROOF outer for cold WINDY days.
And what a smock.
You can keep your nylon!
Oh, and I like wool too.....
I hope that Arktis has --greatly -- improved their quality in the fifteen or so years since I ordered a Windproof Smock and Pants set in British DPM from them.
I believe the fabric my set is made of is called Cotton Modal -- and it wears out at the speed of cheap linen. A few days in the mountains left me with stress areas rubbed almost white and threadbare, and lint coming off like crazy.
To make it worse, their sizing and cut is/was ridiculous.
I am a very regular size Large in jackets, and ordered an XL smock: fine on the shoulders and across the chest, and thats about it. The smock is too short: too short sleeves, and the 'waist' drawstring lands squarely somewhere up my ribcage.
The hood is useless: too small and too short.
I used to be a 32/34 in pants, and ordered a size 36. It was so tight in the thighs I couldn't wear long johns underneath, and now that I am a 34/34 I can't even get into the pants.
In fact, the cheap chinese replica M-65 jacket I subsequently bought was FAR superior to Arktis' gear from about 1990.
I believe the fabric my set is made of is called Cotton Modal -- and it wears out at the speed of cheap linen. A few days in the mountains left me with stress areas rubbed almost white and threadbare, and lint coming off like crazy.
To make it worse, their sizing and cut is/was ridiculous.
I am a very regular size Large in jackets, and ordered an XL smock: fine on the shoulders and across the chest, and thats about it. The smock is too short: too short sleeves, and the 'waist' drawstring lands squarely somewhere up my ribcage.
The hood is useless: too small and too short.
I used to be a 32/34 in pants, and ordered a size 36. It was so tight in the thighs I couldn't wear long johns underneath, and now that I am a 34/34 I can't even get into the pants.
In fact, the cheap chinese replica M-65 jacket I subsequently bought was FAR superior to Arktis' gear from about 1990.
Holy smokes! I started this thread way back last year! Nice to see it again!
Steven Andrews: Any more pics of that beaut!?! Looks very nice. Can you provide the link to where you got it? You stated that it doesn't work well in water, but, does it offer some protection against the rain?
Thanks,
Brian
Nice to see it again!Steven Andrews: Any more pics of that beaut!?! Looks very nice. Can you provide the link to where you got it? You stated that it doesn't work well in water, but, does it offer some protection against the rain?
Thanks,
Brian
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- Jun 16, 2003
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- 20,200
Steven Andrews said:
Excellent choice for your purposes.
(And I like the Monarchy, even if they exiled my people across the water.)
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- Apr 7, 2002
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- 2,167
Bmstrong,
It's a Classic by Snowsled Clothing. They have supplied kit to Prince Charles and the Highgrove Estate, British Special Forces, The SAS Unsupported Expedition to the North Pole, British Antarctic Survey, the US National Science Foundation and many others - quite a pedigree.
Snowsled Endorsements
SNOWSLED CLOTHING LTD
Unit 44D, Nailsworth Mills,
Nailsworth, Gloucestershire
GL6 0BS
Tel: + 44 (0) 1453 839090
Fax: + 44(0) 1453 839800
Contact: Lorraine Goodliff
Lorraine is very helpful: LORRAINE@snowsledclothing.fsbusiness.co.uk
I'll get some more pictures for you....
It's a Classic by Snowsled Clothing. They have supplied kit to Prince Charles and the Highgrove Estate, British Special Forces, The SAS Unsupported Expedition to the North Pole, British Antarctic Survey, the US National Science Foundation and many others - quite a pedigree.
Snowsled Endorsements
SNOWSLED CLOTHING LTD
Unit 44D, Nailsworth Mills,
Nailsworth, Gloucestershire
GL6 0BS
Tel: + 44 (0) 1453 839090
Fax: + 44(0) 1453 839800
Contact: Lorraine Goodliff
Lorraine is very helpful: LORRAINE@snowsledclothing.fsbusiness.co.uk
I'll get some more pictures for you....
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2002
- Messages
- 2,167
Oh! Yeah! Sweet. Many thanks for the Pics...
Have you seen:
http://www.west-winds.co.uk/p_ventile_windshirt.htm
That one looks good as well..
Brian
Have you seen:
http://www.west-winds.co.uk/p_ventile_windshirt.htm
That one looks good as well..
Brian