scandi grind questions

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kedavis

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Apr 30, 2014
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I am very interested in the Condor Bushlore knife. Its 3mm in width, 4 3/8 blade length, and made of 1075 carbon steel. Ive heard a lot about how the scandi grind put on by the manufacturer just doesn't cut it and I should modify it to a convex grind. The question, or atleast the first, is what else is a scandi grind referred to? Ive heard double bevel but I wanted to clarify. Thank you guys. Btw im a noobie.
 
It depends what you will use it for. I use mine for splitting wood and a lot of batoning so I left it scandi but raised it up a bit. For a more all purpose you will probably want to change it.
 
I have the mini bushlore and the sapien, the edge they came with is more of a convex than a Scandi, at least compared to most knives from the Scandinavian region that are billed with that type of grind. In fact it took a bit of work to thin it out to where I was happy with how it performed, was certainly not too acute for hard work out of the box. Most Scandi come with a slight convex and/or a microbevel, and will require intentional work to make them a flat single bevel grind from shoulder to apex.

Martin
 
Thanks for the advice. Ill be using it as my bushcraft knife. What might be the best use or all around edge? Using it for things like batoning, spltting wood, feather sticks and things like that.
 
I would recommend sharpening with waterstones to around 2000-4000 grit. Working with wood requires a more refined edge. I would not recommend batoning with a Scandi grind, the thin edge geometry that is so awesome at carving wood cannot handle the abuse of batoning. Use a axe.
 
knifenut1013 said:
I would recommend sharpening with waterstones to around 2000-4000 grit. Working with wood requires a more refined edge. I would not recommend batoning with a Scandi grind, the thin edge geometry that is so awesome at carving wood cannot handle the abuse of batoning. Use a axe.
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Bunk. Scandi grinds are perfectly fine for batoning. If you stop in the middle of the log you'll notice that the edge isn't even touching the wood because the scandi grind has it's full thickness lower on the blade and causes a wedging action which is exactly what the axe is doing. You can't damage the edge if it's not touching anything. I do agree that you want a high polish on the edge. I usually stop at 2000 grit sand paper and then finish with a black and then green loaded strop.

To the OP: the edge on the condors is a "scandivex" which means it has a slightly convexed single bevel. The only thing wrong with it from the factory is that it might be a little too obtuse. Meaning the angle of the bevel could be lowered a bit to give you better cutting action. It should work pretty well from the factory though so give it a try before you decide on reprofiling.

If wood working is the only thing you're doing then the scandivex is a great edge profile. True scandis(flat single bevels) tend to dig in when feathering. Slightly convexing them with sand paper on a wood backed strop puts enough curve in the edge that it will glide down the piece of wood rather than dig in. It already comes from the factory like that so it's good to go. :D Scandis are great at wood work and one of the things I noticed that they really do well, other than feather sticks, is planing. Laying the blade flat on a piece of wood gives you a nice flat cut. Worked great when I made a pancake flipper.
 
OP, I'm going to lose sight of this thread as I just don't come into the maintenance section so if you have anymore questions feel free to pm or email me.
 
Well, it has happened to me more than once but sence you say it can't happen then I guess it didn't.
 
To the OP, some of these questions re Scandi and convex relative to bushcrafting and EDU come up all the time. There is no blanket answer, it all comes down to the degree the edge is ground to. This is what I have found, others may disagree.

A true flat Scandi that is ground to a lower 20s inclusive is a fantastic woodcrafting tool, but is also very much like a carefully ground chisel or bench plain. It does sweet work but has no lateral stability - batoning and some carving where the edge experiences lateral stress such as at the initiation of a cut, encountering cross grain or a knot will destroy the edge. This is true of very finely ground convex edges as well. You wouldn't use your finest bench plain or chisel for rough work, but a more durable edge isn't the best choice for finish work either.

Everything changes as the edge angle climbs into the mid to upper 20s inclusive and by the time you approach 30 inclusive the edge has pretty good stability and can handle a lot of abuse but is no longer the sweet woodworker that can shave off thin curls etc - though is still plenty good for bushcrafting.

The factory edge (though a tad broad) is a good strategy for most utility bushcrafting. If you decide you need to do finer work with it, you'll want to thin it down and maybe eliminate some of the convex.
 
I can not resist but give my two cents here and hope that "kedavis" benefits somehow. A scandi edge-bevel is just the same as a "regular" edge-bevel, just put on thicker "stock". Imagine you have a grinding jig, set at 15 degrees per side. Now you take a 3mm (it could be 5/32, 3/16 etc.) stock blade and grind it to an edge, symmetrical on both side. Now you take a 0.6 mm "stock" (resembling a blade with a secondary flat grind at about 4-7 degrees or so and about 0.02 before sharpening at the future apex) and do the same thing. The only difference between those edge-bevels is the surface area of the bevel. After a fraction of a millimetre the 0.6 mm stock bevel reaches the it's stock (the secondary grind) and goes up to the spine on a much more acute angle of often 4-7 degrees or so. The 3 mm stock bevel continues at the same 15 degree angle until it reaches it's stock (the "secondary" grind which in this case is the flat stock of 3 mm) and then goes flat to the spine. So until those two edge-bevels reach their individual stock, the geometry/thickness/strength is exactly the same! But - right beyond that point, the 3 mm stock edge-bevel continues to get thicker at the 15 degree angle, the 0.6 mm stock edge-bevel however continues only very slightly to get thicker at the angle of the secondary grind that is. So the bottom line is, the scandi bevel (3 mm stock edge-bevel) is actually stronger/thicker. The delicate thing of a scandi grind is not! the character of the grind itself, it is the unusual low edge angle of often less than 12 degrees per side. This is all different of course for convex grinds. The only area that a scandi excels in my opinion is on wood if it is being used like a chisel since the large bevel area serves you like a plane (plain?). Also, the tip is usually quite sturdy an may be stronger for some drilling tasks. As mentioned above, it may also help pushing wood apart during batoning and gets the very apex off the wood contact faster/earlier resulting in better edge retention, however in real life I have not noticed a difference compared to other grinds.

I could have a 1/4 inch thick 3V chopper with a 20 degree per side scandi bevel on it, and it would be stronger than a flat ground chopper that is 1 mm thick before edge, has a nice secondary grind to spine and a final edge bevel of the same 20 dps. Of course, a 1/4 stock scandi does not make any sense since the cutting/chopping geometry would be awful.

I agree to above that a slight convex makes a better woods knife (no biting in, no bouncing off) but once you start sharpening your scandi by hand, it will be a slight convex over time anyway. I believe, although I have not used a Condor scandivex, that that convex geometry might be to obtuse, similar to the Bark River Bushcrafter and it's scandi-vex. Too obtuse and the edge has the tendency to "bounce off" the wood.
 
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