Scandi-lous thoughts

Jack of All Blades

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I’ve been getting into scandi ground knives as of late and I’m wondering if anyone has experience with a Scandi-Busse.

The Carothers video With the 18dps Mistress had me thinking:
At what point does a high edge grind become a scandi grind?
On a thick knife, 18dps started to look kinda scandi to me when compared to the other edges that weren’t as tall.

Would a zero edge scandi ground Busse be any different than a zero edge convex?

I’ve heard true scandi ground knives are more fragile at the edge than micro edges, if this is true, would a higher grind at the same angle be “more fragile” than the same angle that’s a shorter micro edge?

And for fun what’s your favorite all purpose edge/grind?
Mines quickly becoming the scandi.

Sharpening gurus welcomed 🙏
 
I think what sets a scandi grind aside are the parallel flats and only one bevel. Essentially, they have only one true bevel, which is the FLAT bevel that goes from the flats all the way to the edge. This is different from most Busse (and really most any brand knives) where there’s a primary grind that thins the blade at a shallow angle (which can be flat or hollow, etc.), then has a secondary grind at a steeper angle at the cutting edge.

I’m not sure if it was noticeably convex, would it still count as a true Scandinavian grind.
 
You've got the right thought here on this, let me explain...

Mora tends to be considered the standard for discussing scandi ground blades because they are most common. Whether or not they represent a 'true' Scandi is another matter that I can't say. What a Mora does have going on is a 12 degree per side edge bevel with no primary grind at a lower angle to thin out behind that 12 DPS edge.

Typically with Busse, and I have measured quite a few over the years, you have somewhere in the neighborhood of a 3-7 degree per side primary bevel and a secondary edge bevel in the ballpark of 26-30 degrees per side. Here's where things get a bit wild and is something you'd completely overlook if you weren't looking at the thickness of the steel behind that edge with a critical eye (like where the choil meets the edge or the tip) or a set of calipers.

Directly BEHIND that obtuse edge geometry you will often find on older Busse's (the newer stuff I've found to be thinner) anywhere from .040-.060" or perhaps more is the thickness of the steel where the secondary edge bevel meets the primary bevel. For a point of comparison.... the Mora knife is just barely thicker than this AT THE SPINE at .090" thick. If you reprofile the Busse to then you end up with an even thicker crosse section behind the edge, which thickens proportionally to the lower angle.

SOOO.... your point about 18 DPS on a BWM being like a Scandi grind is quite true. In fact, I consider Mora's to be quite robust and overbuilt because of the lack of a primary bevel at a lower angle to thin out the middle of the knife BEHIND the edge. Mora's are not ground like lasers but rather ground for ease of manufacturing because it's quite straightforward and fast to produce shallow single bevel knives with the type of machinery they are using.


If you are not concerned with extreme durability, then the best thing you could do for cutting ability in either case is to add an additional or primary grind bevel (Mora) or grind beck the convex bevel BEHIND the 18 DPS bevel on the BWM until it blends into the 18 DPS bevel to a degree. As it is shown in Nathan's video, that BWM is what I would call invincible... which basically happens at 15 DPS w/ .035" thickness or heavier geometry. Most any Busse that has been reprofiled to 15 DPS will easily satisfy that thickness behind the edge which means you really cannot damage the primary grind behind it. This means you can often 'knock down the shoulder' as many call it here after reprofiling a Busse, to increase cutting ability.

It's worth noting in Nathan's video that the damage to the apex was very shallow and didn't even begin to approach reaching the end of that 18 DPS edge bevel. This shows that the thickness behind that edge was MUCH more extreme than it needed to be for that application (as demanding as it was). Many here don't even do such demanding cutting tasks, so the question I would ask is why not thin down the edge to the appropriate geometry for what you're cutting? The answer.... it takes a lot of grinding (careful grinding if you don't want an ugly knife) and that either takes having a grinder that will make quicker work of it or a good set of stones .... otherwise you're sending off your baby to somebody like me to pay for it to be done for you.

All knives are overbuilt. There's no way that a maker can know how you will use a knife and how much force YOU can generate at the edge. Many knives are beyond that threshold of 15 DPS at .035" thickness behind the edge to make sure the primary doesn't blow out or twist. It's our job as knowledgable knife users to understand that we'll have to decide our own application and put some time and effort into using and modifying them to become the most efficient tool for any given application. At the end of the day, you can either work easier or harder. An overbuilt knife is only going to take more energy and effort to use. If you're using it for actual work (not fun) and lots of it, you'll appreciate anything that makes that easier.
 
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