Second slipjoint completed, Bose Pattern Zulu Spear, please critique

[Brian.Evans]

Finished up my second slipjoint last night. I'm excited to have a knife I can be proud to carry, instead of my first attempt, which was an abomination of a knife.

Specs:
Steel: 3/32" A2 @ 61 Rc
Heat Treat by Peter's
Covers: Brown Canvas Micarta
Pins/Liners/Bolsters: Nickel Silver
OAL Open: 6.4"
OAL Closed: 3.5"
Bolster to Tip: 2.8"
Plunge to Tip: 2.4"
Thickness: .40"
Hand rubbed 320 grit finishing the blade, 800 inside the liners and buffed on the covers. I need to go back over the handle again though, it looks like.
The edge is .0015" right above the sharpened bevel. I ran it about ten strokes on each side on a very old 400-600 grit silicon carbide stone, then stropped. Very easy to sharpen with that thin edge, even though with its high Rc.

All numbers are rounded to the tenth, that's why they don't quite add up exactly.

I am pretty upset, I think I grabbed a piece of stainless rod for the pins instead of nickel silver. You can see the pivot looks like a different metal entirely. Live and learn. I'll make sure I never do that again!

Bear with me, there's going to be a bunch of pictures. I couldn't get my makeshift photo booth to work, so like McDonalds, you get a bunch of mediocre instead of a little great.

The scuff marks are where I messed up and laid it too flat on the very first stroke sharpening it, not leftover grinding marks. I am not going back and fixing it, because its going to get a lot more dinged up before this is all over. I would never send one out like that though.

Wow, this look horrible close up. The covers look like poop, and the nick is horrible. I'm buying a dovetail cutter for my next one.

In hand:

Now, what good is a knife if it can't cut? No good I tell you! So.....lets cut! It was late last night, so I grabbed some leather scraps. This is roughly 8/9 oz. leather, about 1/8" or 3mm for our metric friends. I actually did all the cutting before I took the rest of the pictures.

What I began with:

It shaved hair easily before the test.

Cut 126 pieces of leather.

Shaved afterwards.

I wanted to get a video, but I didn't have a videographer to take it. The cuts weren't sawing, they were easy, clean slice, slice, slice, slice over and over. I was very happy with the laser like cutting of this blade, especially given the very marginal sharpening I did. I'm going to take the edge up to 1000 or even 4000 today and see how amazing this edge can get. Very happy with Peter's Heat Treating.

Critiques, comments, criticisms welcome and encouraged. Tear it apart, I want the next one to be better. I already have a long list I want to fix on number 3.

I am posting this in Traditionals, Shoptalk, and [gulp] Customs due to the wide variance in types of people who frequent each forum. I'd like to hear everyone's feedback to become better. If the Mods take issue, I will respectfully redact my posts.

 

[abcdef]

I like this post. It will be interesting to see the incremental improvements in your future knives. You are taking on a tough task; but it looks like you have a knack for it.

 

[Brian.Evans]

I have very little use for fixed blades, but I carry a pocket knife every day. I tried making fixed blades, but I got bored. Not because I mastered it, but because I could see myself with 20 fixed blades lying around and nothing to do with them. I like having my own knife in my pocket. Number 3 will be so much better.

I'm not impressed with the action on this one. It snaps open and closed, opening about a 4/10, but ramping to a 7-8/10 at the end. I like that, but it is lazy in the middle. I don't like half stops, but my poor attempt at a cam tang on this one acts more like a half stop than a cam tang. It opens nicely, gets lazy and then snaps all the way open with authority. The blade doesn't flop around in the middle, but it is more limp than I'd like.

 

[Don Hanson III]

It's a start and you are brave to post that here.

You know where the problems are and will only take practice to get past them.

Best part is it cuts!

 

[Brian.Evans]

Don, I have watched/read the development of several "critique my knife" threads.

It starts one of two ways:
1. This knife is so awesome, tell me how cool I am, it is the best knife ever.
2. This is the knife I made.

It continues:
1. Tell me how cool this is and pat me on the head.
2. I know it has problems. Point them out and let's discuss them. I need to know.

Finally:
1.a. Yay! Pats on the head. I'm so great. I'm going to go make more mediocre knives! Yay me!
1.b. What?! Indignant surprise! It's not as good as I thought?! Just don't tell me anymore. I want to pretend everything's ok.
2. Thanks for the feedback. The next knife I'll fix all the problems. I want to be better.

I hope I've come across as number 2. That being said, can you or anyone else help me get better? I'm serious, I want feedback, be cruel if you want, but I can't stand making crap, I want to make good knives.

Specifically, I need help pinning cover material and bolster material. Also, general fit and finish help.

 

[Brian.Evans]

Basically, it may be brave to post a failure here, but this is where the greats hang out, and I want to be great. I can't come bug you all in person, so y'all get me here. Only by challenging myself will my work become better. I will not stagnate or bury my head. If its crap, tell me why and tell me how to fix it.

 

[goodshepherdknives]

wow i thought i was critical of my stuff...

the grind on the spine isnt even on both sides and the pin near the end of the handle looks like its about to fall through the micarta, maybe usea smaller one?

otherwise i think its really nice, any good places to look to start making a slipjoint? ive always wanted to try that

 

[Brian.Evans]

wow i thought i was critical of my stuff...

the grind on the spine isnt even on both sides and the pin near the end of the handle looks like its about to fall through the micarta, maybe usea smaller one?

otherwise i think its really nice, any good places to look to start making a slipjoint? ive always wanted to try that

If I'm not critical, I won't get better.

The grind is off for sure. I am piss poor grinding with the handle end pointing left. Partially me, a lot my platen. Fixing that as we speak.

The handle pin is a result of being not good at pinning. It is a 3/32" pin, but I had too much sticking up when I started pinning. It will be better the next time. It is actually where it should be per the pattern, but my poor pinning job makes it look like it does.

Look up Don Robinson's book "Slipjoints My Way." It's on Amazon. It is a great book and it literally shows exactly step by step how to build a knife and even provides a pattern. I'm not affiliated in any way, just love the book. It's worth every penny.

 

[cchu518]

Put a wider blade on that guy! The handle looks comfy but it seems like an awful lot of handle for the blade size. Could be a visual mirage though.

 

[greg c]

I think the handle looks pretty good for knife number 2! I like the end swell, seems like it would afford a lot of cutting control.

My "cruel" critique is that you should have rejected the blade as soon as you:
-lost too much of the edge to keep it looking full
-made the nail nick

By keeping it you couldn't NOT end up with a blade that looks "tired" (to borrow a Japanese sword term). If you had a blade that was fuller and had a good nail nick than even with uneven grinds this knife would look so much better. So my critique would be to have the patience to start over again when necessary- the fitment skills will come with time but it's the intolerance of mediocrity that makes for great knifemakers.

By the way, I'm curious how you envisioned the blade shape when you started the project- can you draw it out?

(Now please search for my threads with my sodbuster rehandles and critique my work, I desperately want feedback too!)

Respectfully,

Greg

 

[Don Hanson III]

Basically, it may be brave to post a failure here, but this is where the greats hang out, and I want to be great. I can't come bug you all in person, so y'all get me here. Only by challenging myself will my work become better. I will not stagnate or bury my head. If its crap, tell me why and tell me how to fix it.

It's not crap. It looks better than my 2nd slip joint, but not quite a good as my 4th. So each one should get better.

As said, your blade doesn't look full, my guess is you had to adjust it as you were grinding.

Good thing about making a bunch of small fixed blades, is you get a lot of practice grinding bevels and finishing blades. You may not have much use for fixed blades, so make parring knives for the kitchen. Keep a couple and give a bunch away.

You need to do something to keep the sides of the tang from rubbing the inside of the liners. I use .005" bronze washers, but most guys relief mill the inside of the liners.

Keep everything flat, flat, flat and all holes 90 degs. Before pinned together, it should be assembled and held together with clamps. At this point it should work right and have no gaps. Hammering it together wont make it any better, but can make it worse.

Your weak cam action at the half way point, just means you need more roundness on the end of the tang, more hump.


Keep at it! Go start another! Practice, practice, practice!

 

[Brian.Evans]

I think the handle looks pretty good for knife number 2! I like the end swell, seems like it would afford a lot of cutting control.

My "cruel" critique is that you should have rejected the blade as soon as you:
-lost too much of the edge to keep it looking full
-made the nail nick

By keeping it you couldn't NOT end up with a blade that looks "tired" (to borrow a Japanese sword term). If you had a blade that was fuller and had a good nail nick than even with uneven grinds this knife would look so much better. So my critique would be to have the patience to start over again when necessary- the fitment skills will come with time but it's the intolerance of mediocrity that makes for great knifemakers.

By the way, I'm curious how you envisioned the blade shape when you started the project- can you draw it out?

I lost about .060-.080" off the edge when I was grinding it. Platen issues that I will have resolved before the next one.

I would have started over bit I was out of steel! Haha. Also, if I started over every single time I made a mistake, I would never have made this thing. As it is, I know I can get the action right at least. Or kind of right.

The whole thing is an exercise in not quitting and chucking the whole dang project. I've never had so many ups and down with projects than these stupid knives. Fun though.

 

[Brian.Evans]

It's not crap. It looks better than my 2nd slip joint, but not quite a good as my 4th. So each one should get better.

This makes feel better.

As said, your blade doesn't look full, my guess is you had to adjust it as you were grinding.
Yes. See above.

Good thing about making a bunch of small fixed blades, is you get a lot of practice grinding bevels and finishing blades. You may not have much use for fixed blades, so make parring knives for the kitchen. Keep a couple and give a bunch away.
I've never made kitchen knives before. Any good patterns or steel I should be looking at?


You need to do something to keep the sides of the tang from rubbing the inside of the liners. I use .005" bronze washers, but most guys relief mill the inside of the liners.
I'm going to try using a dremel or similar on the next one. Maybe an end mill in the drill press, but that seems dangerous.

Keep everything flat, flat, flat and all holes 90 degs. Before pinned together, it should be assembled and held together with clamps. At this point it should work right and have no gaps. Hammering it together wont make it any better, but can make it worse.
I'mng to have my blade and spring flat ground after hardening next time. Also, I lapped the liner/cover combos flat enough to feel them stick to the counter, but then they still weren't flat compared to the blade and spring. I think my spring and blade weren't flat enough.


Your weak cam action at the half way point, just means you need more roundness on the end of the tang, more hump.
how much is right? About 10% more on the cam than the other two dimensions? I am going to work on my cam tangs on the next one.


Keep at it! Go start another! Practice, practice, practice!
Thanks Don. I have a small piece of O1 sent to me by Jared Oeser, hopefully I can get it into blades soon. I'm thinking a couple sub-3" Zulu spears.

 

[ISKski]

 

[J. Oeser]

Brian, Don knows his stuff and has given some great advise. FLAT, is one of the most important words he used. If you can get a granite block that is made flat that will help. I use mine still all the time. The one tool that took my folders to a new level was when I bought a surface grinder. You want to talk about flat, holy cow. Before that I used a disk and my granite. They still turned out pretty good.j

My first two folders I did not have a mill, so what I did was etch relieve the liners. You can use fingernail polish and block out the parts you don't want etched then dip the liner in some ferric chloride solution for a few hours and you will have relieved liners. I would not put an end mill in a drill press. I run mine mill pretty slow to relieve the liners and I think you would have some problems.

For my cam ends I basically take a tang that has a half stop then add a radius on the end. Then you shouldn't have trouble with it being weak or lazy. Sometimes you have to take some off because it's too much but that's easier than adding more on.

Seriously, keep at it. My first slip joint makes me cringe to look at it. And making fixed blades will help you get more grinder time on the bevels without all the effort of a slip joint.

It's not crap. It looks better than my 2nd slip joint, but not quite a good as my 4th. So each one should get better.

This makes feel better.

As said, your blade doesn't look full, my guess is you had to adjust it as you were grinding.
Yes. See above.

Good thing about making a bunch of small fixed blades, is you get a lot of practice grinding bevels and finishing blades. You may not have much use for fixed blades, so make parring knives for the kitchen. Keep a couple and give a bunch away.
I've never made kitchen knives before. Any good patterns or steel I should be looking at?


You need to do something to keep the sides of the tang from rubbing the inside of the liners. I use .005" bronze washers, but most guys relief mill the inside of the liners.
I'm going to try using a dremel or similar on the next one. Maybe an end mill in the drill press, but that seems dangerous.

Keep everything flat, flat, flat and all holes 90 degs. Before pinned together, it should be assembled and held together with clamps. At this point it should work right and have no gaps. Hammering it together wont make it any better, but can make it worse.
I'mng to have my blade and spring flat ground after hardening next time. Also, I lapped the liner/cover combos flat enough to feel them stick to the counter, but then they still weren't flat compared to the blade and spring. I think my spring and blade weren't flat enough.


Your weak cam action at the half way point, just means you need more roundness on the end of the tang, more hump.
how much is right? About 10% more on the cam than the other two dimensions? I am going to work on my cam tangs on the next one.


Keep at it! Go start another! Practice, practice, practice!
Thanks Don. I have a small piece of O1 sent to me by Jared Oeser, hopefully I can get it into blades soon. I'm thinking a couple sub-3" Zulu spears.

 

[Bruce Bump]

Don, that was awesome advice.

 

[Brian.Evans]

J, you have a bigger help to me than you know. I will remember that trick re: adding a radius to the half stop then grinding till it is right.

I want a surface grinder. After my grinder is built I will probably look for one next. They shouldn't be too hard to find used around here. They seem like they'd be good for all sorts of things. Bolsters, blade/spring steel, all sorts of things.

I have two knives laid out on that steel, but I'm undecided whether I'm going to do two small zulu spears, or take a chance and do my own designs, specifically that little hunter, modified to the proper working condition.

 

[Brian.Evans]

Bruce, do you have any advice? I'd really welcome it from a maker such as yourself.

 

[Bruce Bump]

Bruce, do you have any advice? I'd really welcome it from a maker such as yourself.

My advice is to buy the best machines you can afford and then take all Dons advice. Many makers try to get by with poor equipment and drop out from frustration.

 

[Brian.Evans]

My advice is to buy the best machines you can afford and then take all Dons advice. Many makers try to get by with poor equipment and drop out from frustration.

That's where I'm at with my grinder. Hopefully fixing the platen will help, then I can get my GIB finished soon and get going on an actual grinder instead of the little Craftsman.