Selling - Trading to Under Eighteen Year's

[Ramm9]

Web retailers, that "auction site" and many sellers here make the statement that knives will not be sold to anyone under 18 years of age. What is the law about trading or selling "sharp" objects to under 18's?

 

[Karda]

It varies from state to state. while many states prohibit sales to minors under the age of 21 or 18, many states prohibit sales to persons under 16 years of age. There are also many states which have no specific law against sales to minors.

Check this out.

http://www.akti.org/PDFS/Vol8Iss2.pdf

 

[glistam]

In addition to any law requiring that the purchaser be over a certain age, it is also up to the seller's personal choice. This is a liability thing rather than a legal requirement. They do this to avoid being sued.

 

[joe-bob]

In Texas, the only prohibition on minors is "illegal" knives; which are listed a few lines above that section. As kids, we all bought knives at the Sun Rexall drug store and carried them everywhere, including school.

Since the laws vary so wildly, it's easier just to not sell to anyone under 18 than to try to comply with all the different stuff.

 

[Ramm9]

Got it, and thanks. Aside from the State's are there any issues with interstate mailing or shipping?

 

[mbassoc2003]

I would have thought that morally you shouldn't regardless of what the law states. At some level, we must all take moral responsibility for making our society better (regardless of the money). If you have a good business ethic, you will succeed anyways, and be able to say 'I did good.'

 

[joe-bob]

What?!

Look, if selling pocket knives to Boy Scouts is legal, then there's no reason not to. Violating a youngster's rights in no way makes you moral, nor does it "improve" society.

 

[Gunfucius]

I would have thought that morally you shouldn't regardless of what the law states. At some level, we must all take moral responsibility for making our society better (regardless of the money). If you have a good business ethic, you will succeed anyways, and be able to say 'I did good.'

I fail to see the moral problem with selling/trading/giving a knife to a minor. I also fail to see how depriving them of carrying a basic tool somehow "makes society better." I guess what I don't understand is the mentality behind the above post. Could you please explain what you're getting at here?

 

[GWashington1732]

I would have thought that morally you shouldn't regardless of what the law states. At some level, we must all take moral responsibility for making our society better (regardless of the money). If you have a good business ethic, you will succeed anyways, and be able to say 'I did good.'

First of all, why are you on this forum? You obviously hate knives, go away.

Second of all, I've been carrying a knife everyday since I was five and I never use, or have used it irresponsibly. Denying young people the right to buy, carry, and use knives is every bit as stupid as denying anyone else that same right. Growing up in this horrible padded society that most over protective parents seem to adore will only weaken children and it's people like you that think there's some deep moral issue behind it that cause the problem.

 

[mbassoc2003]

First of all, why are you on this forum? You obviously hate knives, go away.

That's not the case.

In which case, presumable, as adults we need to be able to define who we should and should not sell knives to. I got my first SAK at about 10, given to me by my father. Clearly there are those who can and should be trusted, and those who cannot and should not be trusted with buying blades. It is still a moral question, just as selling firearms is a moral problem. Just because someone can buy a firearm, does not mean you should sell them one.

Obviously this is a case by case thing, but people get stabbed and shot in schools because irrisponsible people give them access to weapons. Of because their parents are trailer trash. That does no good if you happen to be the parent of the person stabbed or shot. But then you cannot hold society back because of the scum within it. You can't not trust everyone because some of them can't be trusted.

Maybe then, you only sell knives to kids who demonstrate a level of intelligence and utility with it. Or maybe you jail the parents of kids who commit knife crimes.

Morally the seller has to take responsibility for the decision they make, because in cases where things go wrong, neither the buyer nor the parent of the offender will take responsibility. Knife sellers do have to take responsibility, and not just say 'why should I care?'.

 

[GWashington1732]

That's not the case.

In which case, presumable, as adults we need to be able to define who we should and should not sell knives to. I got my first SAK at about 10, given to me by my father. Clearly there are those who can and should be trusted, and those who cannot and should not be trusted with buying blades. It is still a moral question, just as selling firearms is a moral problem. Just because someone can buy a firearm, does not mean you should sell them one.

Obviously this is a case by case thing, but people get stabbed and shot in schools because irrisponsible people give them access to weapons. Of because their parents are assholes. That does no good if you happen to be the parent of the person stabbed or shot. But then you cannot hold society back because of the assholes within it. You can't not trust everyone because some of them can't be trusted.

Maybe then, you only sell knives to kids who demonstrate a level of intelligence and utility with it. Or maybe you jail the parents of kids who commit knife crimes.

Morally the seller has to take responsibility for the decision they make, because in cases where things go wrong, neither the buyer nor the parent of the offender will take responsibility. Knife sellers do have to take responsibility, and not just say 'why should I care?'.

That's the same kind of crap that causes the problems with knife laws. Interpretation, that's why some innocent guy can get arrested and convicted for looking suspicious and carrying a knife while some punk who runs around with a bunch of domestic terrorists (I.E. A gang) has nothing happen to him because the Police Officer didn't see him. So now we have an innocent man whose life has been ruined for a pocket knife while a worthless thug is still out there being a worthless thug. Interpretation is complete crap, it's not the dealer's responsibility to make these determinations, it is impossible for them to do it with any amount of accuracy unless the buyer comes straight out and say that he's going to go off someone with it. Interpretation, morals, and placing the blame is a complete waste of time only used on pseudo-crimes. Real crime is much more simple than that. One guy kills another guy, the first guy is responsible.

 

[zignal_zero]

while i don't really agree with MBASSOC2003 i'm on a similiar wavelength to the one he was when he made the statement the we should be morally obligated NOT to sell weapons to children.

i believe it is WRONG to give a child a any knife WITHOUT the consent of their parent. i feel by doing so, you are circumventing the parents discretion. some kids are mature enough for certain things, some are not. i do not feel it is the gvt's (or an uncles) place to decide which are which, i believe it is the parents. my son is 8, he'll probably be getting a GSG-5 for Christmas. however, if i found out someonelse had taken it upon themselves to give him a gun, heads would freakin roll. i do think that it promotes a stronger society when we leave decisions, like this, up to the parents because it gives them closer control over their childrens advancement.

now LEGALLY - in my state you cannot give any knife OTHER than a pocket knife to a child without the parents consent. i do not think there should be a pocket knife exception to this law because any knife can be missused. even a pocket knife should require parental consent.

i was ordering ALL SORTS of knives at 15, i just signed where it said "i swear i am over 18"

 

[mbassoc2003]

In which case, below the age of consent, you sell only to the parent. And if a child is involved in a knife crime that results in another person being injured, and they can prove intent to harm, you prosecute the parent as an accessory and change the law so that they can be jailed for it.

You can't run a society where you say knives and should be available to all, and then get pissed when kids cut eachother up in the streets. Kids cannot take responsibility for their actions, so someone has to.

If you don't feel morally responsible for society around you, then maybe that's the whole problem. I will hapily train my kid to use a knife from an early age, and I will happily give my child a knife when I believe the time and place is appropriate. Whether I'd let my child EDC is a different matter, and one as a parent I will have to make when I'm presented with the choice. But the bottom like is that the decisions I must make are for the good of my child and the society he will interact with, and I must take responsibility for that. I really think it would be wrong for some idiot shopkeeper the believe he knows my child better than me, or to think he'll sell my child a blade because he wants the money and to hell with society.

Maybe not giving a damn about society and not being willing to take responsibility for your decisions is the whole problem in a nutshell.

 

[Karda]

Got it, and thanks. Aside from the State's are there any issues with interstate mailing or shipping?

Unless it's an automatic knife/switchblade (which has state and federal restrictions), there are no restrictions that i'm aware of.

mbassoc2003, this is a more or less civil discussion, is there any reason we can't keep the profanities out of it?

 

[mbassoc2003]

Duly edited and noted for the future.

 

[TOM1960]

I would personally not sell a knife to anyone under the age of 18. Heck, any 16 year old can have a brother, cousin or older friend/classmate (most high school seniors are 18) buy one. If the kid insisted that he needed one for camping, fishing, etc. I would ask him to bring a parent along and I would sell it to the parent. What happens after that is none of my business.

A recent thread was from a college student asking about knife carry and concealment rules and laws on college/university campuses. I responded to his question, but the Gerber FS II rocker-locked folder that I obtained in the summer of 1978 was not purchased by me. It was bought in a Lawrence, MA gun shop by a friend of mine who was 19, because the dealer would never sell to anyone under 18. At the time, I was only 17 and did not turn 18 until the end of the first semester of my freshman year in college (yes, I started school a year younger than the rest of my classmates). I gave him the money and he bought the knife for me. I do not blame the dealer, because Massachusetts is a very anti-weapon state. Gun licenses in Massachusetts are issued at the discretion of the local chiefs of police and this guy obviously didn't want any problems since this was his livelihood. As I stated in a prior post, I carried the FS II through all four years of college here in Massachusetts without incident. About five years later, I gave it to another friend to settle a small debt. It was still in excellent condition, despite daily pocket carry for nine years!