(Sharpening) Gosh I have No Skill...

G

GarageBoy

Joined
May 23, 2003
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I found a stone my dad used a few years back and I have been grinding away. Well, instead of the stone sharpening the knife, the blade is scraping away the stone. (ACE Hardwear Combination Stone)I am pulling the blade (45 degree angle)towards me in an arc for 5 minutes on the coarse side and I'm still not getting a burr!
:confused:
Thanks Guys!
 
Do the Sharpie! Hehe.

Go get a magic marker and coat the edge bevel. You should have somethign like 1/8" of ink or a bit less on the blade. Then take two slices on the stone (slicing into it like you are trying to cut it) and look at the edge. If the black is worn away at the top but the very edge still has black on it, then you aren't even hitting the edge yet! If the very edge is shiny (no black) but there is tons of black left above it, then you are hitting the edge now, but you may have too steep of an angle.

So, with that little guide in mind, coat the edge and take a slice or two keeping sure that you have the angle that you want. Then look at the edge. If the black has been removed from the edge, re-coat the bevel and take a couple more slices. Keep doing this and start checking the other side of your knife for the bevel. Repeat on the opposite side.

It may help if you have a flat stone as well. if your stone is dished out, you'll need to flatten it. If after taking a couple of swipes at the angle you want black has only been removed at the top of that 1/8" secion and you aren't even hitting th every edge, then that means the edge bevel is super thick. In cases liek that I thin out the bevel before putting on an edge. To do that, hold the knife at an angle shallower than what you want to sharpen at (say by 5 degrees) and scrub in a circular motion with decent pressure. Try to hold that angle, but go with good pressure and speed. In a short time you'll have that edge bevel thinned out and a burr will pop up on the other side of the edge. Flip the knife over and do the same on the opposite side. When you get a burr again, then you have to sharpen the edge. You would hold the knife at the angle you want and sharpen "regularly". 5 strokes on one side, 5 on the other, 3 and 3, then alternating for half a dozen strokes or so. That step will take only a couple of minutes if your edge bevel has been thinned out.
 
Do I cut the stone vertically or at the angle? (initally)Is there a prefered way to hold the blade? (I just broke a handle rivit)
Thanks Crayola!
 
If you just broke a handle rivet while scraping slices off your stone, here is what I recommend:

Go to Wal-Mart's sporting good department and pick up an EZE-LAP Diamond stone($5) and a Buck 110 ($35).

The diamond stone is really agressive and coarse so you will be able to sharpen a whole lot easier and faster. I hold the stone pointing out in front, and hold the knife at angle (depends on how long the knife is), edge towards me and tip pointing to the front (at an angle, of course). I pull the blade down at an angle towards me, sliding slightly to cover the whole length in one pull. Sharpening the belly is more of a sliding than a slicing motion. Hold it whatever way you find comfortable without breaking handle rivets. When you get your burr (and you should be able to with a diamond stone) switch sides. I use my left hand for the other side, but thats up to you.

You may want to use a finer Arkansas stone for the final sharpening for a finer edge, or just sharpen with the diamond stone which will give you a coarse, toothy edge.
 
45 degrees is probably way too steep an angle for any edge short of an axe. Use the great magic marker trick to find out.

I use an angle guide when I sharpen on stones. It's just a little plastic thing with the top set at an angle. I had one that came with the stones, but the angle was too steep (~24 degs), so I made my own by gluing together some scrap plastic. I made the angle about 18 degrees.

At the beginning of each stroke I just set the knife against the angle guide to make sure I've got the right angle. It really helps in keeping the angle consistent.
 
I agree with the Ezelap diamond stone from Walmart part(but, it will cost you $5.95) ;) :) The diamond stone will probably outlast you.

As to the sharpening, all you have to do is attempt to slice a thin layer off the stone. I raise the spine of the blade off the stone about an 1/8" or so, and slice away. What is important is, keeping the angle constant and making sure that whatever metal you remove off one side, you have to remove the same amount off the other side. Patience, Grasshopper. You will learn. :)
 
Originally posted by AlphalphaPB
45 degrees is probably way too steep an angle for any edge short of an axe.
Click to expand...

Oh, YES!! You should not be doing any more than 20 degrees per side. Somewhere between 15 and 20 degrees will do it.
 
Watering the stone helps a little, but the stone is not removing any metal of the 007. It's just scratching the polished finish of the soft steel:(
 
Sounds like your stone needs replaced. Get a new one (It dousn't have to be expensive.) Find one with an angle guide. (A diamond sharpener is nice, but not necessary).

Use the angle guide to bring the proper bevel back. (I suspect you massively changed the bevel).

Push or pull the blade (it doesn't matter which) over the stone DRY. Dry is more aggressive. Sharpen on one side only!!! Sharpen until you get that elusive burr on one side. THEN and only then switch to the other side!!!!

After you get the burr on the second side, you now need to make some decisions. You can continue using the stone dry, use the stone with water or use it with oil. (using the stone with water or oil helps to "float" the steel slivers.) Which ever you decide, you will now need to take that burr off the edge. This is when you switch from side to side to take off the burr. (Push or pull on one side, flip over, push or pull, flip).

After the burr looks like it is off, GENTLY run the edge over your thumbnail. (You can feel all the rough places this way.) You can "polish" (ie strop) the burr off on cardboard, leather, (even a flourscent light bulb. You can even strop on a piece of 800+ grit sandpaper.

After you strop the blade, it should be sharp again. If you have problems, email me.

Pam
 
How do you strop the blade? How much time should the entire process take? (completely dull to sharp) Thanks again!
 
With the proper set of stones, and assuming that the edge is not square, you should be able to do this in 10 to 15 minutes, a major mistake people make who are learning to sharpen is that they try to use 1 stone to do everything. Use a coarse stone to profile the blade a medium stone to set the primary bevel and a finer stone to finish or polish the edge and lastly a strop to finish it off if you want a razor edge.

Here is an excerpt from a post I made a while ago, hope it helps more than it confuses.

Having been sharpening my own blades for the last 30+ years I've come to notice a few things in regards to what you use to sharpen a knife. Diamond hones remove massive amounts of steel and sharpen a blade fast but even with the finest hone you will still need to finish your blade on a strop or ceramic hone to smooth out the edge. Always sharpen at the desired angle,(between 17-24 degrees, depending on the thickness of the blade) till you get a wire edge on one side, (the best way to feel for this is to slide your thumbnail from the spine side, or back of the blade towards the edge) when you encounter a wire edge it will feel like a little lip has formed where the wire edge has rolled over. Next sharpen the opposite side till you achieve the same result. Done on a Fine Diamond Hone, finish off by repeating the process using lighter pressure on each subsequent stroke and the wire edge will become smaller. When the wire edge is barely noticeable with your fingernail. Finish with a leather strop and stropping compound by applying a reasonable amount of force and dragging the blade backwards on the leather at a slightly less angle than you sharpened,(the leather will actually curl around the edge of the blade and wear off the wire edge) after a few strokes on the leather on both side you should have a finished edge. When the edge of the sharpened blade is rested on the smooth part of your thumbnail it will dig in, (bite into the nail with no additional pressure), Your knife should now be shaving sharp.

Diamonds are more aggressive and faster than wet stones or oilstones but will accomplish the same results with a smoother more polished edge, and depending on the grit of the stone may take a lot longer. The key either way is repetition, the more you perform the same task your brain starts memorizing the pathways through your body needed to accomplish this task. Eventually holding an angle, smoothness of stroke, all become second nature, and the task becomes easier. That’s why it always looks easier when someone else whose good at it does it.

My way is not the only way but it works for me, if you feel confident enough to attempt your own blades, start on a cheaper knife that your not afraid of ruining, and remember it’s easier to sharpen a knife that’s not dull, than to sharpen one that is. So don’t wait till your knife won’t even cut butter before you dress up that edge. LOL

PS as for my preference I prefer a diamond hone just because I think it's quicker, and more versatile I can accomplish the same thing with one hone by just varying pressure to the blade as I sharpen.
 
To sharpen I stroke the blade by pushing the knife edge first along the stone. To strop, I pull the knife back (or spine) first with just the edge of the blade contacting the stone. Others do it differently, this is just what works for me.

When you are sharpening, work on one of the knife only. Starting from the base of the blade (the end nearest the handle), push the edge along the stone and at the same time slide the blade toward the tip. You could set up a circular motion. If you are holding the handle in your right had it will be a clockwise circle.

Keep doing this on one side only (keeping the same angle along the blade edge) until you can feel a burr. You can best feel the burr by sliding the tip of your finger nail from the spine to the edge. (check the side of the blade that was facing up on the stone.)

You will have created a burr when the tip of your finger nail "catches" on the very edge. Then and only then switch sides and sharpen the other side until you can feel the burr again.

To strop the blade you will pull the blade (maintaing the same angle that you used when sharpening) along your stropping material. (Actually you can use the same stone.) If you are holding the handle in your right hand, it will be a counter-clockwise motion. This time switch sides on each pass, maintaining progressively lighter pressure on the blade until you are just barely touching the stone. Carefully check for burrs with your thumb nail.

Hope this helps,

Pam
 
How do you strop with leather? (won't the blade cut it?) Also, do I push the blade and drag it back or do I go in 1 direction only?
 
Sounds like your pushing too hard.

Try putting it on one of those "gel pads" that keeps your cell phone from sliding, or maybe turn a mouse pad upside-down.

BTW has what I wrote made sense?

Pam
 
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